Birdstrike affecting LGW flight?
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Birdstrike affecting LGW flight?
Is there a way of verifying a birdstrike incident which my airline is telling me affected a flight out of LGW early on Saturday morning, leading to a five-hour delay? Presumably would have happened on an inbound flight as it was an 0610 flight? Is there a publicly-viewable log for such incidents? Thanks (Sceptical SLF)
No, but if you search your outbound flight number on FlightRadar24, you will be able to see what time the inbound flight landed.
Though that's not necessarily the whole story, as it may not have been the aircraft you flew on that had been involved in the birdstrike.
Though that's not necessarily the whole story, as it may not have been the aircraft you flew on that had been involved in the birdstrike.
Is there a way of verifying a birdstrike incident which my airline is telling me affected a flight out of LGW early on Saturday morning
Not knowing the airline involved I guess it is possible the birdstrike could have happened the previous evening when perhaps the aircraft returned to base or came for a night stop, and there then followed a long repair, or it might have been spotted by someone at the start of the day shift....and/or as DR has said the aircraft you eventually flew on may not have been the one involved in the birdstrike, all sorts of airframe "shuffling" might have been involved.
These things do happen and circumstances can lead to long delays - out of interest can you tell us why you are sceptical?
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Is this related to an anticipated EU261 claim?
If so then the following link (item 17) may be useful.
http://www.caa.co.uk/WorkArea/Downlo...?id=4294974505
Also note the headline Three notes.
If so then the following link (item 17) may be useful.
http://www.caa.co.uk/WorkArea/Downlo...?id=4294974505
Also note the headline Three notes.
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The realities of a birdstrike (it will vary airline by airline): Just a smear I can wash off with no visible damage? Telephone call with my company, inspection by myself and a bit of paperwork. Damage or bird through engine? Telephone call and an engineering presence required. The delay after the engineer's visit may be minutes, hours of days depending on the level of damage. A five hour delay is quite understandable, but still inconvenient!
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And there is nothing more an airline can do to avoid or mitigate a birdstrike. Completely outside the control of the airline and, in R261 terms, truly an extraordinary circumstance.
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I doubt any airline, even Cryanair, would lie when it comes to this.
If a pax disagrees with an airlines contention they should contact their National Enforcement Body (see EU website). They have the power to enforce the Regulation.
If a pax disagrees with an airlines contention they should contact their National Enforcement Body (see EU website). They have the power to enforce the Regulation.
Jeez what a bunch of cynics we are becoming. Airlines are damned if they don't give passengers information about delays, and not believed when they do!
From my experience in the truthfulness stakes the passengers are more likely to be spinning a yarn than the airlines. The fanciful stories invented to try to avoid paying excess baggage charges; to get onto a flight that they have arrived late to the airport for; and most amusingly when asked to give details of the contents of a misplaced/misrouted piece of their baggage, are far more frequent than any untruths from an airline about a delay.
I well remember a chap who claimed he only had designer labelled clothes in his luggage, plus an expensive camera, expensive after shave etc. The bag was found and forwarded to the airport the next day and as he was living close by he agreed to come and collect it. As his claim was so high for the contents, and for reasons I won't go into now the airline could have been liable on this occasion, it was agreed we should ask him to open the bag in front of a policeman to ensure nothing was missing from the bag. Oh quelle surprise, all the clothes were from cheapo clothing stores and not a single designer label to be found. The policeman warned him that the airline had every right to pursue him for making a fraudulent claim. We didn't pursue it, but I doubt he will have pulled the stunt again.
From my experience in the truthfulness stakes the passengers are more likely to be spinning a yarn than the airlines. The fanciful stories invented to try to avoid paying excess baggage charges; to get onto a flight that they have arrived late to the airport for; and most amusingly when asked to give details of the contents of a misplaced/misrouted piece of their baggage, are far more frequent than any untruths from an airline about a delay.
I well remember a chap who claimed he only had designer labelled clothes in his luggage, plus an expensive camera, expensive after shave etc. The bag was found and forwarded to the airport the next day and as he was living close by he agreed to come and collect it. As his claim was so high for the contents, and for reasons I won't go into now the airline could have been liable on this occasion, it was agreed we should ask him to open the bag in front of a policeman to ensure nothing was missing from the bag. Oh quelle surprise, all the clothes were from cheapo clothing stores and not a single designer label to be found. The policeman warned him that the airline had every right to pursue him for making a fraudulent claim. We didn't pursue it, but I doubt he will have pulled the stunt again.
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Yes, surely not, you are probably right. My observation was based on being a pax for 50 years and working in commerce for 38 years. My cynicism is based on living in Britain and seeing that the number of people (customers or sellers) that are lying is not small.
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While I have seen plenty of anecdotal accusations that the 'airline lied to me' I have yet see once evidence of any airline intentionally lying about the reason for a delay or cancellation. Forget about morals it's more than their reputation would be at stake if they would knowingly lie to regulators.
Yes I'm sure staff have made up or guessed what could have happened, saying 'It could have been a birdstrike' when they don't have the information. Human nature.
Any 261 issue should be pursued as set out in the Regulation. First claim with the airline, if not satisfied then go to the NEB, still not satisfied go to the courts. And save yourself some money, contact airline and NEB yourself, before approaching a claims agent. While some may be reputable, some are not.
Yes I'm sure staff have made up or guessed what could have happened, saying 'It could have been a birdstrike' when they don't have the information. Human nature.
Any 261 issue should be pursued as set out in the Regulation. First claim with the airline, if not satisfied then go to the NEB, still not satisfied go to the courts. And save yourself some money, contact airline and NEB yourself, before approaching a claims agent. While some may be reputable, some are not.
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Sadly I don't think a bird strike is an extraordinary circumstance according to those interpreting the EU261 regulations. I will happily stand corrected.
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According to: http://www.caa.co.uk/WorkArea/Downlo...?id=4294974505 it is, subject to the provisions.
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ExXB, I documented on these very forums an example which happened to me several years ago when an airline tried the inevitable "extraordinary circumstances" card when I made a claim. Unfortunately for them, inside information available to me through my job revealed their attempted distortion of the truth. At that point they paid up without further argument. What surprised me at the time was that this was a respected and reputable airline. I guess my cynicism developed from that experience.
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Well, to clarify, I didn't mean that a passenger had never been lied to. But I have yet to hear of an airline lying to their regulators. That is why the NEB option shouldn't be discounted. They do have the power to find out what happened and if that circumstance falls under R261.
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Sadly, Avherald seems to be turning into a shadow of its former self.
Some of its recent "analyses" (DY277, for example) have been distinctly dodgy. More worryingly, and notwithstanding the disclaimer, Simon now arbitrarily deletes reader comments that don't support his conclusions.
That said, I don't think everyday bird strikes normally get reported on AH.
Some of its recent "analyses" (DY277, for example) have been distinctly dodgy. More worryingly, and notwithstanding the disclaimer, Simon now arbitrarily deletes reader comments that don't support his conclusions.
That said, I don't think everyday bird strikes normally get reported on AH.
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Of course, birdstrikes can have a serious side but I sometimes wonder about the measures taken.
I have lost count of the number of times the bird scarers have out and about, at different airports. The usual result, in my experience anyway, has been the birds jump off the grass and into the air. Then settle back down on the grass again! And I have never seen a flock of birds flee the sound of the gun and hop it over the fence. On Tuesday, an inbound Ryanair flight reported "2 large birds of prey, 2 miles from touchdown". This info was relayed to the following Wizz Air flight. When they had landed, they reported that the 2 birds were still there but they were now 1.5 miles from touchdown. So, if a couple of huge, roaring monsters didn't scare them, what chance a Very pistol?
Incidentally, while taking photographs at Luton a couple of months ago, I found one of the photos showed a Red Kite travelling along below a departing aircraft! The aircraft won and the bird flew over the fence, presumably looking for prey that didn't make such a noise!
I have lost count of the number of times the bird scarers have out and about, at different airports. The usual result, in my experience anyway, has been the birds jump off the grass and into the air. Then settle back down on the grass again! And I have never seen a flock of birds flee the sound of the gun and hop it over the fence. On Tuesday, an inbound Ryanair flight reported "2 large birds of prey, 2 miles from touchdown". This info was relayed to the following Wizz Air flight. When they had landed, they reported that the 2 birds were still there but they were now 1.5 miles from touchdown. So, if a couple of huge, roaring monsters didn't scare them, what chance a Very pistol?
Incidentally, while taking photographs at Luton a couple of months ago, I found one of the photos showed a Red Kite travelling along below a departing aircraft! The aircraft won and the bird flew over the fence, presumably looking for prey that didn't make such a noise!
