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BA Strike - Your Thoughts & Questions III

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BA Strike - Your Thoughts & Questions III

Old 8th Oct 2010, 09:14
  #21 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
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Having read both threads more or less from the start there is one thing that concerns me as SLF.

With all the bile and invective being thrown about between strikers, non-strikers, VCC and in some cases the flight deck; how is this impacting on your work performance? I do not mean the hot towels or the meal service but more the safety critical aspects of your duties. Before I get jumped on with comments such as 'I/we/they would not be so un-professional to let that affect my performance', I will tell you that it does impact on your actions and in the vast majority of cases you are not conscious of it.

In my experience of assessing competance and managing traincrew I have had to remove from safety critical duties a number of staff who thought they were performing well but had underlying issues (financial, personal and colleague related among others) that was having a detrimental, or I thought could have detrimental effect, on the safety of the customers in the event of an incident.

Are measures put in place to ensure that the acrimony displayed on these boards and on picket lines is not carried over into the cabin?
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 09:18
  #22 (permalink)  
 
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Good call, call.

It would be interesting to see how much BA management grade pay is
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 10:03
  #23 (permalink)  
 
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Double letter on crewforum
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 10:10
  #24 (permalink)  
 
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Good call, except this dispute has never been about pay. The staff costs of all BA departments compared to other airlines are on the CAA website.

As for management, BA senior management pay is certainly lower than that of its FTSE 100 peers. There are FDs of large plcs who earn far more than WW does as CEO.

If you go on strike and seek out public support, you cannot expect your terms and conditions to escape public scrutiny and criticism.

Last edited by LD12986; 8th Oct 2010 at 10:35.
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 11:21
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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What relevance does BA management salary have to the issue of Cabin Crew?

Last I looked BA wasn't a collective.

Management makes more...as they should.
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 11:43
  #26 (permalink)  
 
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Not sure if this is the correct thread so am wearing safety gear. What are "new fleet"and "mixed fleet"? Taa.
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 12:01
  #27 (permalink)  
 
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I will tell you that it does impact on your actions and in the vast majority of cases you are not conscious of it.
Interesting comment. Last night my CE inflight service was delivered professionally and competently, unlike the previous two.

But I did not see a single smile from the three crew in our cabin.

The flight met the standards I expect for service delivery and that is good enough for me.

On the CW flight, it was service as usual, with just one hiccup, the seat I was allocated had several large areas of dried white/cream stains on it. Fortunately there was a spare seat available for take off and then the CC member in my area (who was really nice, as well as professional) changed the cushion so I could return to the original place.

The contrast between crew body language and facial expressions could not have been more noticeable.

Edited to add that I am not saying the difference between the two crews was anything to do with the strike, just that we pax do notice whether crew are apparently happy/not happy.

Last edited by Lotpax; 8th Oct 2010 at 14:31. Reason: Clarification
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 12:47
  #28 (permalink)  
 
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Angel

Sempir,
Mixed Fleet is a new fleet that BA are starting up with different terms and conditions to the Current Fleets which are World Wide, Euro Fleet and Single Fleet Gatwick. Some posters refer to it as New Fleet but it is the same thing.

If you look through all the posts on the previous threads British Airways V Bassa, there have been a few, you will find the answer to all your questions.
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 14:35
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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Call100 Job title ? totally irrelevant, its job dimensions that are important. Salary ? again not useful, there are some skills that have a higher value to organisations than others. In aviation, flight crew earn commensurately more than most managers with equivalent line responsibilities. Equally, you'll find that general admin workers tend to earn less than IT programmers. If you look at most organisations the highly paid folk tend to be the sales force, who get commission. I fai to see how publishing such information would even up the playing field.
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 14:53
  #30 (permalink)  
 
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Posterity

As an erstwhile student of Industrial Relations - and once a P/T lecturer on HR, it is worth bearing in mind that this strike will one day form the basis of an academic dissertation or even a book. I do hope that all the posts on PPRuNe will be saved as they will undoubtedly be invaluable to whoever undertakes this task.

Can I ask whether I am right in concluding that the BASSA leadership (sic) is predominately made up of senior cabin crew - CSDs and Pursers? If that is correct, how come that the more junior ranks are so under- represented? Could this explain what appears to be some rather skewed decision making?
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 15:03
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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Rethymnon, according to that ever-reliable source Wikipedia the Bassa leadership is made up predominantly of sacked/suspended/long term sick senior cabin crew.

If accurate, it is clear to see why BASSA have no interest in ending this dispute. Having said that, the Wikipedia entry for BASSA was clearly authored by someone with an anti-BASSA view!

The British Airlines Stewards and Stewardesses Association (BASSA) is a branch of the British trade union Unite.

BASSA was originally formed exclusively for British Airways (BA) cabin crew.

BASSA now has other branches representing cabin crew at other airlines. Branch 1/1117 is for Thomson Airways cabin crew.[1]

Originally part of the Transport and General Workers' Union (T&GWU), BASSA is now part of Unite. Membership is falling from a high point of over 11,000 in 2009. At 8 August 2010 membership stood at 9,555; one month later on 8 September 2010 membership stood at 9,279 before this information was removed from the website and updated to read "about 10,000". This still makes BASSA one of the largest branches of Unite.[2]

BASSA is managed by a committee of wholly elected representatives, which disproportionally consists in the main of CSDs and Pursers from the Heathrow World Wide fleet, all of whom are usually operational staff with their airline, though two are on disciplinary charges for gross misconduct. As at August 2010, Duncan Holley, the Branch Secretary, is the exception to this rule, and remains in his BASSA role despite having been sacked from British Airways for gross misconduct.

The current chairperson is Lizanne Malone, a BA Cabin Services Director, who has not worked operationally for over a year, and who married an American, resides in Los Angeles, California.[3]

Headquartered at the Unite offices at Harlington, Middlesex, BASSA has support offices in Abbey House at Heathrow Airport, and in Jubilee House at Gatwick Airport. BASSA provides a secure website to service its members, 10% of whom reside overseas.[4]

As of February 2010, BASSA is facing competition from the newly formed Professional Cabin Crew Council
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 19:05
  #32 (permalink)  
 
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I think that it is fundamental to homo sapiens that some will exploit others - therefore I believe that trades unions are very important (I would like to say essential) for civilised societies in which corruption is low.

What puzzles me is why World Fleet and Euro Fleet are not regarded by Unite as being different and separate work units._ The terms and conditions are clearly different with World Fleet receiving extra payments._ If only the two joint secretaries of Unite had realised this and imposed (am I allowed to say "imposed") this division then at least one of the two JS would today be planning his grand entry into the House of Lords.
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 21:17
  #33 (permalink)  
 
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BASSA now has other branches representing cabin crew at other airlines. Branch 1/1117 is for Thomson Airways cabin crew.[1]
So are the members THOSSA's ... Sorry, I'll get my coat.
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Old 8th Oct 2010, 23:17
  #34 (permalink)  
 
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Had to smile when I read this:

I think that it is fundamental to homo sapiens that some will exploit others
Any thinking person would apply the same motiviation to Unions in relation to their members as Employers and their employees.

No heroes to be found in that statement.
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Old 9th Oct 2010, 03:21
  #35 (permalink)  
 
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Any thinking person would apply the same motiviation to Unions in relation to their members as Employers and their employees.
Non sequitur.

Union officials are elected by the members, so they have to deliver something to keep tenure.

Don't equate BASSA to normal union, it is not.
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Old 9th Oct 2010, 04:13
  #36 (permalink)  
 
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Chuchinchow

Why are you going on about me on this forum?
MissM

I think you are getting more than a little paranoid and self-important.

Was your name mentioned in either of my messages? No. On the other hand, if the cap fits you are more than welcome to wear it.

If you can't take the heat, MissM, get out of the kitchen and quit moaning.

Perhaps you should quit your job with British Airways, too: an employer you so clearly hate and despise.

Last edited by Chuchinchow; 9th Oct 2010 at 12:57.
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Old 9th Oct 2010, 06:02
  #37 (permalink)  
 
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I think that it is fundamental to homo sapiens that some will exploit others - therefore I believe that trades unions are very important (I would like to say essential) for civilised societies in which corruption is low.
Not when that union is BASSA, who in my opinion manipulate and exploit their members to the extreme and are clinging on to their positions, being paid handsomely for doing so, despite have absolutely NO right to do so other than a show of hands from the more rabid bunch of Bedfont berks.
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Old 9th Oct 2010, 06:05
  #38 (permalink)  
 
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Court 74

Judgement Day
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Old 9th Oct 2010, 07:07
  #39 (permalink)  
 
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Lotpax quite reasonably says
Union officials are elected by the members, so they have to deliver something to keep tenure.
However Mrs Justice Cox said on 17 December 2009
Before the ballot closed on 14th December BA wrote to UNITE on 11th December, asking them to confirm the accuracy of the numbers and asking whether or not voluntary redundancy leavers had in fact been included in the figures. Unite did not reply.
Also from Mrs Justice Cox
In the absence of a response from the union, BA wrote a more detailed letter on 14 th December, i.e. the day that the ballot closed. This informed the union in the clearest terms that BA was concerned as to the inclusion of voluntary redundancy leavers in the process. Rather than respond to that concern, however, UNITE served on BA the result of the ballot and the notice of industrial action.
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Old 9th Oct 2010, 10:26
  #40 (permalink)  
 
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Not Langley

My point is simply that one cannot directly compare a union to an employer.

The board keeps tenure by convincing the shareholders they have a done a good job whereas senior union employees retain their job by convincing the members of the same.

One may argue that both exploit employees/members (delete as appropriate.)
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