Obese Pax
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,488
Likes: 35
From: Hong Kong
Yes - I agree - but at some point a medical / health condition makes it unsuitable for you to fly. So if you are a genetically predisposed, psychological truffle pig with a huge body - perhaps you shouldn't be on the plane.
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,415
Likes: 2
From: Europe
psychological conditions are medically recognised, and some of these can cause over eating through no fault of the person concerned.
So if I find myself unable to use the seat that I have paid for without been crushed by a neighbouring lard-ass, I shall ask to be moved or, if that cannot be done, off-loaded since there is no seat available as per contract. If that happens with a UK carrier, or in the UK, I will sue for recovery of costs using the Small Claims procedure.
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 796
Likes: 4
From: Back of beyond
Read the small print and you'll find that there's only a charge if you cause the airline to lose revenue i.e. a paying passenger is denied boarding because an obsese passenger requires 2 seats.
If the seat next to the obese passenger would have stayed empty, there's no charge.
Which is fair enough.
And it shouldn't matter whether the passenger is obese through lifestyle choice or for medical reasons.
If the seat next to the obese passenger would have stayed empty, there's no charge.
Which is fair enough.
And it shouldn't matter whether the passenger is obese through lifestyle choice or for medical reasons.
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,267
Likes: 92
From: south of Cirencester, north of Lyneham
One medical reason for getting fat is if you are on steroids and have to have insulin as well. Although my calorie intake didn't go up (it was about 1300 a day) I still put on weight like crazy. Since coming off steroids at Christmas, I've little appetite and have lost 14kilo. And have been able to cut back on insulin.
But of course, the airlines could have tried charging me for an extra seat on the 12 flights I've taken in Club class so far this year, and as a result, not had the revenue at all.......
But of course, the airlines could have tried charging me for an extra seat on the 12 flights I've taken in Club class so far this year, and as a result, not had the revenue at all.......
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,488
Likes: 35
From: Hong Kong
Most lard arses didn't have your medical issues which quite obviously you could have explained to the airline if need be in quite clear medical terms....
Did you get huge enough to spill over into another passengers seat if you'd been in cattle class?
Did you get huge enough to spill over into another passengers seat if you'd been in cattle class?
Guest
Posts: n/a
Pax + Bags, Total Weight?
I asked the question once at check in at LHR as to why I had to pay for an extra 5 kilos of baggage when the guy who had just checked in, in front of me, had the correct baggage weight but at a conservative estimate weighed 20 kilos more than me! There then followed a long and convoluted explanation involving aircraft trim, etc. I said that I understood the need to adhere to a/c weight and balance criteria but asked the question how can you get an accurate trim if you are using actual weights for the baggage but "standard" weights for the passengers. As a Loadmaster of some 35 years experience I was playing devils advocate but the point I wanted to make was that if I had to pay for the excess baggage the other guy should have been made to pay for his extra weight over the "standard" passenger weight!!
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 1,267
Likes: 92
From: south of Cirencester, north of Lyneham
LoadToad,
It would have depended on whose economy seat I was trying to fit into....Some (such as Southwest and Fly Baboo) are (or seem to be) slightly wider than others.
But for encouragement to eat less, the lamb chops served on BA289 to Phoenix last Friday couldn't be beaten. How the catering company managed to make them so tasteless and yet greasy is a mystery.....I didn't finish them.
It would have depended on whose economy seat I was trying to fit into....Some (such as Southwest and Fly Baboo) are (or seem to be) slightly wider than others.
But for encouragement to eat less, the lamb chops served on BA289 to Phoenix last Friday couldn't be beaten. How the catering company managed to make them so tasteless and yet greasy is a mystery.....I didn't finish them.
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 553
Likes: 0
From: UK
Originally Posted by GroundedSLF
My other half has just been advised to give up sugar totally - you have no idea what sort of stuff contains sugar until you start reading the packets carefully - and we basically have to now cook everything from scratch - which is way more expensive (tastes great though).
I was 'between jobs' and living on saving for almost a year not too long ago, and I lived on probably the healthiest and cheapest diets I have had in years!
My local market does cracking deals on fruit and veg. None of your supermarket rip-off prices. Meat too! I would go down there in the afternoon and pick up a stack of greens for well under a fiver that would last all week. Breakfast would be Porage ( A bag of oats for under a quid will do about two weeks) and fruit.
I'd use my slow cooker and make about 5 litres of casserole or chilli and freeze whatever I didn't use that day.
The drawback was that all this takes time, but the freezer option means you can keep what you don't eat for later.
As a population, we were at our healthiest (I believe) in the 1950's? ie: when people would make proper meals and convenience food was unheard of.
As far as fat goes, I agree that it's a lifestyle choice. Why should other people subsidise it?
Guest
Posts: n/a
This policy seems fair and reasonable.
But what astounds me, once again, is the vitriol in evidence against obese people.
I will say this only once, so please listen carefully.... I fit easily into a standard sized airline seat.
As it happens, I'm a pretty smart guy, educated to masters degree level and travel the world doing consulting work and running seminars.
I come across many people who do not try to make the most of their talent and some who are just born dim.
You could compare these people to obese people in the sense that some people don't try to improve themselves and some cannot.
Should we despise these people, too?
What is it with some of you people???
But what astounds me, once again, is the vitriol in evidence against obese people.
I will say this only once, so please listen carefully.... I fit easily into a standard sized airline seat.
As it happens, I'm a pretty smart guy, educated to masters degree level and travel the world doing consulting work and running seminars.
I come across many people who do not try to make the most of their talent and some who are just born dim.
You could compare these people to obese people in the sense that some people don't try to improve themselves and some cannot.
Should we despise these people, too?
What is it with some of you people???
Guest
Posts: n/a
Whilst trying to keep a balanced view and respecting everybodys right to live the way they wish, I feel the point is being missed here. The vast majority of people, certainly in UK, will tolerate many things as long as they don't encroach on their own lives! I, for one, smoke, but I do so in designated areas or well away from other people. The effects of "secondary smoking" have been well documented and there are very few, if any, public places which allow smoking (including airports and aeroplanes), quite rightly. I expect the same consideration that I show in ensuring my "habit" does not affect others, to be shown to me in similar ways. Certainly I would never criticise anyone for their size whether it be self-induced or due to a medical condition, that is their right or in the latter case, their lot. But when they encroach on my space it becomes a different matter. I don't have an answer but there must be some middle ground which will go some way towards removing the "vitriol" that is clearly aimed at "larger" people.
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 3,585
Likes: 0
From: UK
Thank you Scott Diamond - At least body fat can sometimes be reduced, whereas stupidity often lasts forever.
When posting on this subject, please would you all try and remember that you are discussing human beings - a small number amongst you appear to be having difficulty with this concept.
When posting on this subject, please would you all try and remember that you are discussing human beings - a small number amongst you appear to be having difficulty with this concept.
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 280
Likes: 0
From: Scotland
Good point , Tightslap!
But, don't you think compulsory declaration of bodily dimensions would give the load controllers some guidance as to where to place the gravitationally challenged? It seems to me that, for some unaccountable reason, those of larger dimensions always seem to get a bum wrap ( oops, excuse the unintentional pun) by being allocated the dimunitive middle seats - This must be sheer coincidence - or is it just that some huge folk make the middle seats look so small?
Whilst, like you, I see the human side to ths problem and don't wish to condone an anti fat culture I think a few good points have been made about comfort and safety - not only for those approaching clinical obesity but those unfortunate enough to get sandwiched between the window and giant haystax (you have to be of a certain age to remember!) Indeed, on one such flight I did feel sorry for the gent levered into 5e on a 737 - 500 until he asked for another breakfast! I spend the short flight with my face involunaraily pressed against the window, due to the absence of shoulder room and the said individuals personal hygiene issues. Had we needed to make an emergency exit I doubt I would ever have got past. Indeed, during the safety briefing I had worked out a more direct route via 4e, 3d and out.
So if they want two breakfasts and need two seats why shouldn't they be asked to pay for that?
But, don't you think compulsory declaration of bodily dimensions would give the load controllers some guidance as to where to place the gravitationally challenged? It seems to me that, for some unaccountable reason, those of larger dimensions always seem to get a bum wrap ( oops, excuse the unintentional pun) by being allocated the dimunitive middle seats - This must be sheer coincidence - or is it just that some huge folk make the middle seats look so small?
Whilst, like you, I see the human side to ths problem and don't wish to condone an anti fat culture I think a few good points have been made about comfort and safety - not only for those approaching clinical obesity but those unfortunate enough to get sandwiched between the window and giant haystax (you have to be of a certain age to remember!) Indeed, on one such flight I did feel sorry for the gent levered into 5e on a 737 - 500 until he asked for another breakfast! I spend the short flight with my face involunaraily pressed against the window, due to the absence of shoulder room and the said individuals personal hygiene issues. Had we needed to make an emergency exit I doubt I would ever have got past. Indeed, during the safety briefing I had worked out a more direct route via 4e, 3d and out.
So if they want two breakfasts and need two seats why shouldn't they be asked to pay for that?
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 123
Likes: 0
From: 28°12′N 177°21′W
Guys,
I'm the first one to put my Jeremy Clarkson hat on and ridicule every single stupid law in this country and take the mick out of any american.
But when I mentioned the medical bit - I know of a few people who are larger than life due to medical problems. One was a diabetic - genetic unfortunately. Another had a problem with her heart, eats like a size 0 model but looks like a tank.
BUt i see your point though - you should still pay for that extra seat even if it isn't your fault.
Life isn't fair. Get over it.
I'm the first one to put my Jeremy Clarkson hat on and ridicule every single stupid law in this country and take the mick out of any american.
But when I mentioned the medical bit - I know of a few people who are larger than life due to medical problems. One was a diabetic - genetic unfortunately. Another had a problem with her heart, eats like a size 0 model but looks like a tank.
BUt i see your point though - you should still pay for that extra seat even if it isn't your fault.
Life isn't fair. Get over it.
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 239
Likes: 0
From: France
In addition to individuals of size, or whatever they call them now, think also about very tall people (should they get free F or J seats because they have long legs?) and very small people (should there be some rows with lower windows and lockers?). Tallness and shortness are never lifestyle choices so they have perhaps more right to special treatment.
On the other hand it is clearly not fair that airlines or other passengers have to pay for the extra weight other people carry. If this is really due to a medical condition then perhaps the fairest and simplest solution is for the airlines to charge up front and then the state or health insurance reimburses the extra cost to the passenger.
I was also struck by the way you can say things about obese people that you would never say about people of other races.
Many people are actually disgusted by the sight of obesity and though it would be more polite to conceal this, the fact that it exists is curious, because it is not true always and everywhere. People who have travelled might have noticed that in some countries men are attracted to very large women that would be kept out of sight in the west. In the past, too, in western countries being "of size" has been a status symbol. I guess that this means people acquire their sense of disgust by conditioning when they are children. Has there ever been a children's book with a fat hero?
On the other hand it is clearly not fair that airlines or other passengers have to pay for the extra weight other people carry. If this is really due to a medical condition then perhaps the fairest and simplest solution is for the airlines to charge up front and then the state or health insurance reimburses the extra cost to the passenger.
what astounds me, once again, is the vitriol in evidence against obese people
Many people are actually disgusted by the sight of obesity and though it would be more polite to conceal this, the fact that it exists is curious, because it is not true always and everywhere. People who have travelled might have noticed that in some countries men are attracted to very large women that would be kept out of sight in the west. In the past, too, in western countries being "of size" has been a status symbol. I guess that this means people acquire their sense of disgust by conditioning when they are children. Has there ever been a children's book with a fat hero?
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 239
Likes: 0
From: France
Quote:
I was also struck by the way you can say things about obese people that you would never say about people of other races.
I wasn't aware 'fat' was a race?
I was also struck by the way you can say things about obese people that you would never say about people of other races.
I wasn't aware 'fat' was a race?
Guest
Posts: n/a
Politicallly correct - Moi?
Muppet this is the first time I have ever been accused of being politically correct.
I am going to take my time to revel in and enjoy this new experience.
The tone of this thread is akin to a bunch of bullies taunting some kid in the class and I know what I want to do when I see someone being bullied. Replace the wall on the smiley with another head.
The only aviation related question that needs to be answered here is:
If you are too big (read obese, pregnant, muscular, tall, squat etc). to fit into one seat without incommoding your fellow passengers should you pay for another seat?
Answer: You should pay for another seat.
As to why people are obese, pregnant, muscular, tall etc. there are multiple medical or psychology based forums where these issues can be debated.
I am going to take my time to revel in and enjoy this new experience.The tone of this thread is akin to a bunch of bullies taunting some kid in the class and I know what I want to do when I see someone being bullied. Replace the wall on the smiley with another head.
The only aviation related question that needs to be answered here is:
If you are too big (read obese, pregnant, muscular, tall, squat etc). to fit into one seat without incommoding your fellow passengers should you pay for another seat?
Answer: You should pay for another seat.
As to why people are obese, pregnant, muscular, tall etc. there are multiple medical or psychology based forums where these issues can be debated.
Last edited by Michael Birbeck; 21st April 2009 at 12:19.