RyanAir Firm Landings

[silverelise]

Just got back from a week skiing in Alpe D'Huez, a trip top and tailed by RyanAir 737-800 flights between Stansted and Grenoble. The outbound flight (Captain Somebody Sherlock-double barrelled) and the return flight (captain Mick somebody) were notable for their rather firm (to be polite) landings. Having now stemmed the bleeding where my teeth smacked in to my tongue and recovered enough from the whiplash to be able to type ( ) I was just wondering if this "technique" is part of the 737-800 experience, whether they were both just unlucky with the wind (phnarr), whether RyanAir doing some suspension testing for Boeing, or there is some other genuine reason why both landings were like that or were we just unlucky?

[Hotel Tango]

Re: RyanAir Firm Landings

Many many factors affect landings. Some require deliberate firm landings. You can't honestly expect a factual answer from what little information you give.

[catchup]

Re: RyanAir Firm Landings

As long as tochdown time doesn't equal on block time, don't worry.

[Memetic]

Re: RyanAir Firm Landings

Having now stemmed the bleeding where my teeth smacked in to my tongue

Were you never told it is rude to poke your tongue out? And foolish to do so whilst approaching tarmac at 100+ miles an hour?



Have a look at the following for some more sensible answers on this much discussed topic:

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...t=hard+landing

[MarkD]

Re: RyanAir Firm Landings

if the landings were autoland I understand firmness is part of the program...

[Shadowfox]

Back last September on a Ryanair flight from BHX to Dublin, we approached our destination on a nice fine evening. No wet, no winds etc. The plane slammed so hard into the runway that it was the first time that I was GLAD I had the seat belt strapped tight. Coming to the terminal it almost felt like he was taking corners on 2 wheels

Wonder why Aer Lingus don'nt have that problem ??

[MarkD]

Different aircraft, different autoland?

[Final 3 Greens]

Shadowfox

IF you wish to understand the answer to your own question, here is what I suggest that you do.

1 - qualify as a pilot

2 - land several hundred times and note the differences between the landings

3 - realize that landing is an art, not a science

4 - realize that all pilots sometimes land more firmly than they wish

5 - understand that the firm landings experienced are well within parameters & safe

6 - then get frustrated with ignoramusses who dont understand

[firemac]

Not just Ryanair (although I tend to think you can't have a greaser if you ain't paid for it...).

I travel several times a year to & around Australia from UK & I have yet to experience anything other than a teeth-rattling landing on Quantas. I've come to the conclusion that the Aussie flight crews work on the principle that "we've paid good money for the gear so we're going to bloody well use it!"

Either that or they simply lose interest in the approach at 50 feet or so.

[TheFlyingDJ]

"we've paid good money for the gear so we're going to bloody well use it!"

haha!

Anyway, like allready said, depends on the situation. Sometimes u just need to go on deck hard because of runway length. When you have a fully loaded 737 with lets say just 1800 meters, you better hit the deck and let the autobrake do its work (EHGG example)

edit: typo

[Self Loading Freight]

And anyway, in a Boeing aren't you supposed to fly through the runway rather than land on it? Not quite sure how that's supposed to work with the flare, but then I haven't been through stages 1 through 6 on the aviation appreciation course detailed above!

But I agree with the original poster - Ryanair seem to enjoy Operation Smackdown more than the other 737 operators to whom I entrust my bum. Also, they taxi faster.

I have been told on many occasions that this isn't true.

But it is.

R

[TightSlot]

This thread is starting to get silly, and irritating.

FR do not experience "hard" landings any more than other operator.

Earlier on in this thread, Final 3 Greens has given an answer that is accurate and well worth a re-read before we all move on

Take a look here: http://www.pprune.org/forums/showpost.php?p=2333928&postcount=8

--------------------------------------------------

P.S. Occasionally, when disembarking and saying goodbye, customers feel it necessary to pass on to me their assessment of a landing - "That was the worst I've ever had", "Did he have a row with his wife?" etc. etc. I usually reach for the Flight Deck door and ask whether they would be so kind as to share their comments with the Captain, as our Pilots welcome all feedback, and are always pleased to meet industry professionals. Strangely, nobody has yet taken up this offer

[BOAC]

1) I fly Classic and NG. I have never flown with RyanAir so I cannot 'assess' their landing skills. I would assume they are pretty much in the 'average' bracket of airlines in this area.

2) The above, From 'Finals'

"Shadowfox

IF you wish to understand the answer to your own question, here is what I suggest that you do.

1 - qualify as a pilot

2 - land several hundred times and note the differences between the landings

3 - realize that landing is an art, not a science

4 - realize that all pilots sometimes land more firmly than they wish

5 - understand that the firm landings experienced are well within parameters & safe

6 - then get frustrated with ignoramusses who dont understand "

I've been putting jets of various sorts onto runways (and some tin pads) now for over 4 decades( ) - and the above is absolutely correct.

Apart from yet another 'bash' at RyanAir I cannot see where this thread is going apart from into the bin.

Edited to say not quite as old as I feel

[firemac]

TightSlot.....

"This thread is starting to get silly, and irritating." - Chill, Man (or Miss..)! We non-professionals have opinions, even if they are sadly lacking in professional/technical experience. If such is not welcomed then maybe PRuNE should make it a "professionals-only" site.
"I usually reach for the Flight Deck door and ask whether they would be so kind as to share their comments with the Captain, as our Pilots welcome all feedback, and are always pleased to meet industry professionals. Strangely, nobody has yet taken up this offer" - I usually find that comments to cabin crew about "iffy" landings are taken in the spirit they are intended in, i.e. jocular. My experience has been that cabin crew often reply with a more stinging (but witty) criticism of the guy in the LHS than anything I've ever suggested.
It is often seasoned SLF's who make such jokes; inexperienecd pax's are sometimes too traumatised/relieved to say anything & simply get off the a/c as fast as possible!
You seem to be wound a bit tight....

[TightSlot]

Originally Posted by firemac

Chill, Man (or Miss..)! We non-professionals have opinions, even if they are sadly lacking in professional/technical experience.

Nicely chilled firemac, thank you - and neither shaken nor stirred

This forum exists precisely because you have opinions and wish to express them. It also exists so that non-professionals can get useful answers from the professionals, and, as I increasingly find, vice versa.

What is irksome is that when a coherent answer is given by not one, but many professionals, on this, and other threads - it is ignored!

To reassure you - some customers make comments about landings that are not jocular, but quite serious, and they get the flightdeck visit question above: I can read people well enough to know when they are trying to be pleasant, and respond accordingly.

I've been flying for just over 25 years as Cabin Crew, and am now described as "Old School" by more people at work than I care to know about. My employer is presently working flat out to encourage us old folk to leave, so that we may be replaced by younger cheaper and better looking models from Eastern Europe; doubtless the kind of cabin crew that will cheerily pass comment on the quality of a pilots' landing to a customer. I was taught that you don't do that. Ever! There are lot of other things that the old timers were taught that don't seem to apply any more, but let's not go there now... Sigh

One bright day in the future, one of you will be sitting back in your Loco seat, sipping your £5 Pepsi and struggling to understand an 18 year old Slovakian stewardess with attitude explain why they had to leave your baggage behind due to weight restrictions and you'll think...

"It wasn't always like this?" - and you'll miss us

[Globaliser]

Originally Posted by TightSlot

P.S. Occasionally, when disembarking and saying goodbye, customers feel it necessary to pass on to me their assessment of a landing - "That was the worst I've ever had", "Did he have a row with his wife?" etc. etc. I usually reach for the Flight Deck door and ask whether they would be so kind as to share their comments with the Captain, as our Pilots welcome all feedback, and are always pleased to meet industry professionals. Strangely, nobody has yet taken up this offer

But I was sure that it was one of your customers who asked the captain, "Sonny, did we land, or were we shot down?"

[Final 3 Greens]

Hey BOAC "I've been putting jets of various sorts onto runways (and some tin pads) now for over 40 decades( ) - and the above is absolutely correct."

I know that you have a bigger licence than mine and are much more experienced, but you must have taught Methusulah to fly

[BOAC]

Nice spot, F3G! I thought I felt tired today. Edit

PS Sent M solo.

[flyblue]

Knowing what goes on behind the F/D door, well before the pax board and well after they've disembarked, I've often thought it was funny that the only bits the pax ever notice is the landing (already been covered in this thread) and turbulence (that you get only when the pilots can do nothing to avoid it: when they've bent over backwards to avoid it, they don't get any credit).

[MarkD]

firemac - have those QF landings been on their 738s? Might account for the similarity with FR's.