Infants In Business Class
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Interesting topic.
I have flown bus class (not first cant afford that) with my family from London to Melbourne once. At the time the youngest was 3 and the oldest 5 and we flew with Singapore. They were no bother at all, we decided on an airline which had a good in flight entertainment system. Each of their back packs was rammed full of toys and goodies should the in-flight become boring and we had loads of calpol for the youngest one and blackmail was rife, I mean the pot of gold that awaited them if they behaved for 24 hours was huge and they got it.
I felt uneasy boarding the flight as I was a little concerned for those who sat near us but at the end of the flights all said how good they had been. I can only say it was down to planning PPP=PPP and all that.
When it does come down to kids charging around the cabins surely this is a time for people to exercise those diplomacy skills they have hopefully acquired through life. I bet many people sit there just moaning to their co-travellers rather than perhaps offering some help or perhaps asking the attendant if you can help at all (that may be just the polite hint for them to speak to the parents and offer assistance) I don't know what crew training is in these situations, they probably do this already at a guess ??
If no joy as the earlier thread, the man who spoke directly to the kid, something perhaps a simple as "I am a policeman and you are not allowed to run around planes" may have done it, lol, or you see this £1 coin, would you like it ? well I will give it to you when we get off the plane if...... kids and bribery etc etc perhaps better than scaring them :-)
Also re kids charging around, I have seen it, let's face it kids get bored and also I have seen parents go for a stroll (cause we can get bored too) with the kids, very proactive I think whereas the charging kids carer is perhaps just watching a film and says yes off you go, maybe they don't know the havoc being caused. In the interest of safety to everyone (hot drinks and food etc) surely there is a case here for parents to be told to control their children. (in polite words)
If they didn't and a child bowls into someone serving boiling coffee and it lands on a customer I guess that customer would have a case to claim against the server/airline if they are injured. I guess one would then ask well did the server or anyone have words with the kids or the kids parents. If they did then perhaps the responsibility lies with the parents but if not, if c.crew have done nothing about it, what next ? who is to blame ? (Just thinking out loud !)
As for the screaming baby, you have to feel for the family so badly, do they really want their kids screaming ? of course they don't, they are dying and wishing they were not there when this happens. Maybe that's why everyone gets a free pair of head-phones
I don't know if they do but perhaps flights should carry the likes of calpol etc for upset infants ??
Just my thoughts.
Regards
Flystudent
I have flown bus class (not first cant afford that) with my family from London to Melbourne once. At the time the youngest was 3 and the oldest 5 and we flew with Singapore. They were no bother at all, we decided on an airline which had a good in flight entertainment system. Each of their back packs was rammed full of toys and goodies should the in-flight become boring and we had loads of calpol for the youngest one and blackmail was rife, I mean the pot of gold that awaited them if they behaved for 24 hours was huge and they got it.
I felt uneasy boarding the flight as I was a little concerned for those who sat near us but at the end of the flights all said how good they had been. I can only say it was down to planning PPP=PPP and all that.
When it does come down to kids charging around the cabins surely this is a time for people to exercise those diplomacy skills they have hopefully acquired through life. I bet many people sit there just moaning to their co-travellers rather than perhaps offering some help or perhaps asking the attendant if you can help at all (that may be just the polite hint for them to speak to the parents and offer assistance) I don't know what crew training is in these situations, they probably do this already at a guess ??
If no joy as the earlier thread, the man who spoke directly to the kid, something perhaps a simple as "I am a policeman and you are not allowed to run around planes" may have done it, lol, or you see this £1 coin, would you like it ? well I will give it to you when we get off the plane if...... kids and bribery etc etc perhaps better than scaring them :-)
Also re kids charging around, I have seen it, let's face it kids get bored and also I have seen parents go for a stroll (cause we can get bored too) with the kids, very proactive I think whereas the charging kids carer is perhaps just watching a film and says yes off you go, maybe they don't know the havoc being caused. In the interest of safety to everyone (hot drinks and food etc) surely there is a case here for parents to be told to control their children. (in polite words)
If they didn't and a child bowls into someone serving boiling coffee and it lands on a customer I guess that customer would have a case to claim against the server/airline if they are injured. I guess one would then ask well did the server or anyone have words with the kids or the kids parents. If they did then perhaps the responsibility lies with the parents but if not, if c.crew have done nothing about it, what next ? who is to blame ? (Just thinking out loud !)
As for the screaming baby, you have to feel for the family so badly, do they really want their kids screaming ? of course they don't, they are dying and wishing they were not there when this happens. Maybe that's why everyone gets a free pair of head-phones
I don't know if they do but perhaps flights should carry the likes of calpol etc for upset infants ??
Just my thoughts.
Regards
Flystudent
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perhaps flights should carry the likes of calpol etc for upset infants ??
Only a child's parent can know if the baby is actually in pain, it's certainly NOT advisable to give drugs of this sort on an ad hoc basis.
I would expect that any sensible parent would ensure that they have appropriate meds in their baby kit when travelling.
Rainbow Chaser
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On short-haul flights where many people are trying to prepare for business meetings it might be helpful for airlines to have a "business section" ... (business class used to be that!) and on flights destined for, primarily, family vacations maybe space for families should also be thought out. After all, trying to line up a family with small children and have them sit in a row facing seat-backs is not gong to help kids have a good time, equally, as others have said, when trying to sleep ahead of picking up a hire car at the onward destination means that many adults, even though "on vacation", might appreciate a place to be less disturbed by the antics of their fellow vacation-bound passengers.
Not quite sure what the solution is, there appear to be as many parents who expect everyone to accept the bad behaviour of their home-grown monsters as there are parents who you can feel genuinely sorry for (and try to help) as they are clearly stressing out because of their kids' behaviour (oftentimes these are parents of good kids who act up as others have said on take off or landing!)...and we have all read about air-rage and the horror stories of drunken adult pax.
For many flying and taking a vacation are a thrill and delight, for others it is pure hell and stressy and everyone copes in different ways. I always make sure I have more than ample time to do all I need before getting on board, have facial water spray, ear plugs, eyeshade etcetc (ie all my personal treats) to make my flight pleasant for me. I check in to a seat (usually in traveller) which I have chosen - aisle for long-haul daytime, window for short-haul or long-haul night-time (now that flight deck visits are history!). I am lucky, I have flown a reasonable amount in business and economy so know what I need to do to give myself the best and most enjoyable flight possible.
I don't like kids kicking the back of my seat, I equally don't like an adult violently pushing my semi-reclined seat back because they don't want to sleep on an overnighter ... I don't like drunken pax and as in real life don't like violent behaviour or rude behaviour of any kind so particularly dislike shouted conversations over my head between different members of a party whose seats are not together. Unfortunately, because an aircraft is a public place and I don't have the means to buy myself the entire First/Upper cabin I have to put up with a lot of "intereference" ... tough on me ... but it doesn't mean that I lose sight of being as pleasant to my fellow pax and cabin crew as is appropriate... after all ... if it does all go pear-shaped I would like think we could all work together to produce the best possible outcome!
I do, however, think the airlines somehow need to re-assess the service they can offer pax that do travel to different destinations and for different purposes.
Not quite sure what the solution is, there appear to be as many parents who expect everyone to accept the bad behaviour of their home-grown monsters as there are parents who you can feel genuinely sorry for (and try to help) as they are clearly stressing out because of their kids' behaviour (oftentimes these are parents of good kids who act up as others have said on take off or landing!)...and we have all read about air-rage and the horror stories of drunken adult pax.
For many flying and taking a vacation are a thrill and delight, for others it is pure hell and stressy and everyone copes in different ways. I always make sure I have more than ample time to do all I need before getting on board, have facial water spray, ear plugs, eyeshade etcetc (ie all my personal treats) to make my flight pleasant for me. I check in to a seat (usually in traveller) which I have chosen - aisle for long-haul daytime, window for short-haul or long-haul night-time (now that flight deck visits are history!). I am lucky, I have flown a reasonable amount in business and economy so know what I need to do to give myself the best and most enjoyable flight possible.
I don't like kids kicking the back of my seat, I equally don't like an adult violently pushing my semi-reclined seat back because they don't want to sleep on an overnighter ... I don't like drunken pax and as in real life don't like violent behaviour or rude behaviour of any kind so particularly dislike shouted conversations over my head between different members of a party whose seats are not together. Unfortunately, because an aircraft is a public place and I don't have the means to buy myself the entire First/Upper cabin I have to put up with a lot of "intereference" ... tough on me ... but it doesn't mean that I lose sight of being as pleasant to my fellow pax and cabin crew as is appropriate... after all ... if it does all go pear-shaped I would like think we could all work together to produce the best possible outcome!
I do, however, think the airlines somehow need to re-assess the service they can offer pax that do travel to different destinations and for different purposes.
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Flystudent
Your thoughts and experience largely mirror my own.
Many years ago when my children travelled extensively with self & Mrs S we adopted similar measures. Never had any problems or complaints. In fact Mrs S, when on SIN/LHR flight with juniormost S (about 3 at the time) and was upgraded to business class, had a similar comment passed about small sprog.
Recently travelled back to the land of sand with entire family, including 3 yo granddaughter, was gratified to see that son and d-in-law used similar techniques successfully.
Takenthe5th
Whilst I appreciate your concerns, not all parents actually travel with appropriate 'medication'(?)
Was once able to offer something to parents travelling with 2 small children (London to NZ) to calm crying baby. It was greatfully accepted by parents and the rest of the passengers were MORE than greatful!
Your thoughts and experience largely mirror my own.
Many years ago when my children travelled extensively with self & Mrs S we adopted similar measures. Never had any problems or complaints. In fact Mrs S, when on SIN/LHR flight with juniormost S (about 3 at the time) and was upgraded to business class, had a similar comment passed about small sprog.
Recently travelled back to the land of sand with entire family, including 3 yo granddaughter, was gratified to see that son and d-in-law used similar techniques successfully.
Takenthe5th
Whilst I appreciate your concerns, not all parents actually travel with appropriate 'medication'(?)
Was once able to offer something to parents travelling with 2 small children (London to NZ) to calm crying baby. It was greatfully accepted by parents and the rest of the passengers were MORE than greatful!
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VS22 last Friday had lots of toddlers on the flight - I dont think anyone slept as they were all screaming and were clearly uncomfortable.
While waiting at the baggage line I mentioned to a ground staff chap about this and said I thought it rather irresponsible to take babies on long haul flights - at which point an american father decided to stand there and scream at me for being an "F*cking T*at"and followed on for five minutes effing and blinding at me. He then turned his attention to the ground staff and was threatening to have him fired for no good reason (!) at which point I started looking for security and also afterwards made a point of going with the ground staff to his manager and making very clear that the American was utterly out of order in his behaviour and I was happy to go on the record about this. It is grossly unfair that people like that are allowed to threaten normal workers just doing their job. I'm still furious about it now.
While waiting at the baggage line I mentioned to a ground staff chap about this and said I thought it rather irresponsible to take babies on long haul flights - at which point an american father decided to stand there and scream at me for being an "F*cking T*at"and followed on for five minutes effing and blinding at me. He then turned his attention to the ground staff and was threatening to have him fired for no good reason (!) at which point I started looking for security and also afterwards made a point of going with the ground staff to his manager and making very clear that the American was utterly out of order in his behaviour and I was happy to go on the record about this. It is grossly unfair that people like that are allowed to threaten normal workers just doing their job. I'm still furious about it now.
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Quies
Well, I have taken my kids in all classes long haul, and been a victim of screaming babies in all classes too, once with a (?) Philippina nanny and two googoos in First. I think the reason there are more babies - proportionately - in Economy may just be that there are more seats. Two notes:
1. When there is no noise left in your life, that is because you are dead.
2. The most effective ear plugs I have found are the "Quies" wax ones. You do have to remember to remove the cotton that covers the wax. In extreme cases, leave your headphones on.
Other suggestions for artificial silence?
Momo
1. When there is no noise left in your life, that is because you are dead.
2. The most effective ear plugs I have found are the "Quies" wax ones. You do have to remember to remove the cotton that covers the wax. In extreme cases, leave your headphones on.
Other suggestions for artificial silence?
Momo
There are merits to all sides to this argument - and as a travelling parent with a 2 year old (pleasure!) or as a FO up the front (work) I can see both sides of the coin.
There was an instance not too long ago where there were children in CC running around and causing an obvious nuisance. On a "leg stretch" to the loo, I saw for myself the irritation that these kids were causing....they were travelling with a single parent who was patently out of her depth as the 2 kids didn't take a blind bit of notice of her. Not her fault - there are days when my nipper ignores me, even though I pride myself on being a caring, considerate parent who insists on giving his offspring the discipline that will serve them well throughout life (an ex-mil type can't get away from good discipline!!!). So I went back and told the skipper, who gave a very friendly PA to the effect that the aircraft was not a playground, that the Cabin Crew had a very important job to do (including serving scalding hot pots of tea and coffee) and that if we encountered turbulence, children out of their seats could be seriously injured. This fell on deaf ears, so we stuck the seat belt signs on ..... for half an hour. Soon enough, the kids were sat down, and once she had managed to regain control of them they were fine.
Flying in Club or First should enable you to have a more comfortable journey than those in economy, but children are an integral part of the fabric of our society and should be tolerated, especially as flying is, in general, a completely new and exciting experience for them. If there are kids that are irritating you, then either ask the Cabin Crew to ask the childrens' parents to reign them in or ask them yourself! I have to say that investing 50p in a pair of foam earplugs could be the best 50p you've spent!
As for "children should be seen and not heard".......a) Fat chance, and b) The Victorian era is long gone. There are good parents and bad parents, good children and bad children. However, the percentage of bad adults to bad children is staggering.
There was an instance not too long ago where there were children in CC running around and causing an obvious nuisance. On a "leg stretch" to the loo, I saw for myself the irritation that these kids were causing....they were travelling with a single parent who was patently out of her depth as the 2 kids didn't take a blind bit of notice of her. Not her fault - there are days when my nipper ignores me, even though I pride myself on being a caring, considerate parent who insists on giving his offspring the discipline that will serve them well throughout life (an ex-mil type can't get away from good discipline!!!). So I went back and told the skipper, who gave a very friendly PA to the effect that the aircraft was not a playground, that the Cabin Crew had a very important job to do (including serving scalding hot pots of tea and coffee) and that if we encountered turbulence, children out of their seats could be seriously injured. This fell on deaf ears, so we stuck the seat belt signs on ..... for half an hour. Soon enough, the kids were sat down, and once she had managed to regain control of them they were fine.
Flying in Club or First should enable you to have a more comfortable journey than those in economy, but children are an integral part of the fabric of our society and should be tolerated, especially as flying is, in general, a completely new and exciting experience for them. If there are kids that are irritating you, then either ask the Cabin Crew to ask the childrens' parents to reign them in or ask them yourself! I have to say that investing 50p in a pair of foam earplugs could be the best 50p you've spent!
As for "children should be seen and not heard".......a) Fat chance, and b) The Victorian era is long gone. There are good parents and bad parents, good children and bad children. However, the percentage of bad adults to bad children is staggering.
Paxing All Over The World
Momo
I have told this story before, so skip if you've heard it ...
I once sat next to a lady on the way down to JNB. We were in Premium Economy and the infants were in the front row of Econo - so they were just a couple of rows back.
We were still at the gate waiting for push, when the babies started. The lady next to me fished in her bag for a remote control and pressed two buttons, before replacing it in her bag.
She said that she had a digital hearing aid and had adjusted it's frequency response - so that she could no longer hear the babies. The sooner my hearing fails and I get me one of them thar dickerty hearum raids ...
--------------------
"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you any different." Kurt Vonnegut, Jr..
Other suggestions for artificial silence?
I once sat next to a lady on the way down to JNB. We were in Premium Economy and the infants were in the front row of Econo - so they were just a couple of rows back.
We were still at the gate waiting for push, when the babies started. The lady next to me fished in her bag for a remote control and pressed two buttons, before replacing it in her bag.
She said that she had a digital hearing aid and had adjusted it's frequency response - so that she could no longer hear the babies. The sooner my hearing fails and I get me one of them thar dickerty hearum raids ...
--------------------
"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you any different." Kurt Vonnegut, Jr..
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first there's a great difference between infant and child....child with schools usually fly in economy all in the same compartment, with their group leader 8and...I know they may be very noisy, but is not possible to deny admission on board!!!).
About First class and Club Class, many companies have a limit in the number of infant/child admitted, usually unaccompained minors travel in economy (and usually they are quiet).
I remember when my father (Captain on B-747) took me around the world with him, I had a briefing at home on how to behave on board, and a de-briefing after flight , if I made something wrong....
Anyway not all dads are like that, but if a businessman wants to take his son with him and pay the ticket has all the right to do it!
If someone is planning a long trip in Club or First Class, maybe can ask directly in reservation if children are allowed, booked and maybe ask for a preassigned seat far from them!
in the unlucky case you are sitted next to a noisy child....well...try to ask to the cabin attendant if she can show him the galley AND THE OVENS heeeheeeeheeee...just kidding!!!!
Skunkie
About First class and Club Class, many companies have a limit in the number of infant/child admitted, usually unaccompained minors travel in economy (and usually they are quiet).
I remember when my father (Captain on B-747) took me around the world with him, I had a briefing at home on how to behave on board, and a de-briefing after flight , if I made something wrong....
Anyway not all dads are like that, but if a businessman wants to take his son with him and pay the ticket has all the right to do it!
If someone is planning a long trip in Club or First Class, maybe can ask directly in reservation if children are allowed, booked and maybe ask for a preassigned seat far from them!
in the unlucky case you are sitted next to a noisy child....well...try to ask to the cabin attendant if she can show him the galley AND THE OVENS heeeheeeeheeee...just kidding!!!!Skunkie
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speedbird_heavy, you are damn right !
Most of these idiots have their flight paid by their companies and couldn't afford them themselves. Let them complain... When they fly commercial with their young ones, they are int he back anyway !
I fly with my kids in C if I want to and the only people who have shown discomfort are those who cannot afford it themselves. Usual human jealousy... nothing more, nothing less.
L
Most of these idiots have their flight paid by their companies and couldn't afford them themselves. Let them complain... When they fly commercial with their young ones, they are int he back anyway !
I fly with my kids in C if I want to and the only people who have shown discomfort are those who cannot afford it themselves. Usual human jealousy... nothing more, nothing less.
L
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Folks, this discussion is more or less stupid. Here's why:
A ticket gives you the right to fly. Your ticket is not a ticket for a quiet flight -- it's a ticket to move you from point A to point B.
Things happen - people talk, kids play, babies cry. None of this behaviour is quiet. You can tell a person to speak quieter, ask parents to stop their kids, but the problem are the babies. You can't talk to them and sometimes they cry just because they are scared of the plane. Or they can't (don't know how) equilize the pressure in their ears (BTW: if you've ever flown with a cold, you'll know if fr
ing painful). Yes, the parents can HELP the baby, but they can't FORCE it to stop crying.
Everyone of you WAS a baby in his/her past and yes, believe it or not, you were screaming at least occasionally.
Where did everybody's tolerance go? Should we lock the babies into their own rooms because they cry? People, I'm stunned.... A plane is a mass transportation vehicle and so we have to live with each other for as long as the travel lasts - and tolerate each other, not even to mention to help each other on the plane.
Adult only flights? No, thank you. (what's the difference between "adults only" and "whites only"? - it's just another form of discrimination)
I personally traveled over the Atlantic several times with children under 2 years of age. We tried whatever possible to quiet them down. Sometimes it worked, sometimes it didn't. Mostly, our fellow travellers were good enough to help us when we needed help and we appreciated it.
So, if you want a private transportation -- order a private jet. Otherwise you are on a "bus in the air" and everything that it comes with, including noise. And tolerate it because you don't have another option.
A ticket gives you the right to fly. Your ticket is not a ticket for a quiet flight -- it's a ticket to move you from point A to point B.
Things happen - people talk, kids play, babies cry. None of this behaviour is quiet. You can tell a person to speak quieter, ask parents to stop their kids, but the problem are the babies. You can't talk to them and sometimes they cry just because they are scared of the plane. Or they can't (don't know how) equilize the pressure in their ears (BTW: if you've ever flown with a cold, you'll know if fr
ing painful). Yes, the parents can HELP the baby, but they can't FORCE it to stop crying. Everyone of you WAS a baby in his/her past and yes, believe it or not, you were screaming at least occasionally.
Where did everybody's tolerance go? Should we lock the babies into their own rooms because they cry? People, I'm stunned.... A plane is a mass transportation vehicle and so we have to live with each other for as long as the travel lasts - and tolerate each other, not even to mention to help each other on the plane.
Adult only flights? No, thank you. (what's the difference between "adults only" and "whites only"? - it's just another form of discrimination)
I personally traveled over the Atlantic several times with children under 2 years of age. We tried whatever possible to quiet them down. Sometimes it worked, sometimes it didn't. Mostly, our fellow travellers were good enough to help us when we needed help and we appreciated it.
So, if you want a private transportation -- order a private jet. Otherwise you are on a "bus in the air" and everything that it comes with, including noise. And tolerate it because you don't have another option.
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Klausk,
Fortunately for the airlines not everyone agrees with you, other wise everyone would travel in economy class. Those of use who value space, privacy, good food and drink, lounges before and after, priority in case of problems and, yes, peace and quiet on board, are prepared to pay extra for that. The colour of someone's skin cannot affect my enjoyment of a flight; a screaming kid can. I would be very happy to pay a small premium to avoid that, in the same way that I pay a large premium for all the other benefits I mentioned.
Fortunately for the airlines not everyone agrees with you, other wise everyone would travel in economy class. Those of use who value space, privacy, good food and drink, lounges before and after, priority in case of problems and, yes, peace and quiet on board, are prepared to pay extra for that. The colour of someone's skin cannot affect my enjoyment of a flight; a screaming kid can. I would be very happy to pay a small premium to avoid that, in the same way that I pay a large premium for all the other benefits I mentioned.
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just my $0.02
Flying reasonably often on LHR-SIN-LHR route with SQ I've got an impression that they follow unofficial rule of no children under 12 (or may be even 16) on C-class upper deck. I've told several times by their ticketing agent and check-in staff that "If you are looking for quiet ride we would recommend you to choose upper deck". And really I've never seen children on their upper deck yet.
Not sure about F class, I'm not really often there, but never seen under 12 there on CX and SQ, but once been been flying BA LHR-JNB sitting quite close to the mother with infant, and that was a nightmare for 7 hours in row. BA agreed later to compensate me, after I send them a claim, but anyway I'm on the side of prohibiting children (at least under 8 or 10) to F and C classes (OK, SQ way works well with separating pax between 2 decks).
Just think about it. In our world we have restraunts, we have hotels, including resorts, where the children are not allowed etc. May be it worth to think about the flights? I'm sure many of F and C class pax would support this idea, especially long haul.
Flying reasonably often on LHR-SIN-LHR route with SQ I've got an impression that they follow unofficial rule of no children under 12 (or may be even 16) on C-class upper deck. I've told several times by their ticketing agent and check-in staff that "If you are looking for quiet ride we would recommend you to choose upper deck". And really I've never seen children on their upper deck yet.
Not sure about F class, I'm not really often there, but never seen under 12 there on CX and SQ, but once been been flying BA LHR-JNB sitting quite close to the mother with infant, and that was a nightmare for 7 hours in row. BA agreed later to compensate me, after I send them a claim, but anyway I'm on the side of prohibiting children (at least under 8 or 10) to F and C classes (OK, SQ way works well with separating pax between 2 decks).
Just think about it. In our world we have restraunts, we have hotels, including resorts, where the children are not allowed etc. May be it worth to think about the flights? I'm sure many of F and C class pax would support this idea, especially long haul.
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I recently flew BAH-LHR with GF in J-class. Unfortuneatly, I was in the last row of the J-cabin. As you will probably know, the front row of economy is where they usually sit families with small children, and this was no exception. 2 infants, I would guess around the age of 3-6 months, spend 90% of the flight screaming their heads off. While a baby has no other means of making the world know it's uncomfortable, adults should have the ability to understand that subjecting a baby to 7 hours in a jet is not their idea of fun. They must be suffering from pain in their ears, as well as being locked in a very dry, noisy and turbulent environment. In short, I find that parents taking babies on long flights are being rather cruel and incredibly selfish.
Now as luck would have it, GF's got these wonderful noise-cancelling headsets, and you can turn the volume up high enough to drown out the noise. Even better, I'd met the Sky Chef in BJ's the night before, and he was kind to offer me a seat further forward and less noisy. The poor sods sitting behind and next to these babies neither had the benefit of noise-cancelling head-sets nor the advantage of knowing a crew member. It must have been bloody horrible.
However, I have read the fine print on the back of the ticket and no-where does it say anything about not allowing babies. So I'd say that anyone willing to pay the money have as much right as anyone else to occupy any class of travel they can afford, bringing with them as many children as they like. It might not be very considerate of other people if you're flying with babies, but since when has consideration come back in fashion I wonder?
PS
When I landed in LHR, evil thoughts were festering in my mind about what to do with the parents of those screaming babies. Nothing a couple of Marlboro's and a cold Stella couldn't cure though.
Now as luck would have it, GF's got these wonderful noise-cancelling headsets, and you can turn the volume up high enough to drown out the noise. Even better, I'd met the Sky Chef in BJ's the night before, and he was kind to offer me a seat further forward and less noisy. The poor sods sitting behind and next to these babies neither had the benefit of noise-cancelling head-sets nor the advantage of knowing a crew member. It must have been bloody horrible.
However, I have read the fine print on the back of the ticket and no-where does it say anything about not allowing babies. So I'd say that anyone willing to pay the money have as much right as anyone else to occupy any class of travel they can afford, bringing with them as many children as they like. It might not be very considerate of other people if you're flying with babies, but since when has consideration come back in fashion I wonder?
PS
When I landed in LHR, evil thoughts were festering in my mind about what to do with the parents of those screaming babies. Nothing a couple of Marlboro's and a cold Stella couldn't cure though.
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After reading this, I would be hesitant to offer anybody (infant or otherwise) anything..
http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/Midwest/0...iked.juice.ap/
Flying Business back from HKG about 3 weeks ago, I had developed a really bad cough and I could not stop the tickle in my throat. The pax next to me (Chinese) offered my a lozenge (well I think that that is what it was - all of the text was in Chinese..).
I did not know what it was, but took it anyway - What if I had had an allergic reaction to one of the ingredients? Maybe the flight would have to be diverted?
Getting back closer to the topic - (and trying to be a little more constructive than a few of the posts on this thread)
I am one of the "few" that has their bus class travel paid for. But even when I travel in cattle class, I hate being woken up by screaming children on Long Haul.
Most of the parents that I see with small children / Infants that are crying are extremely embarressed and do everything to get their child to cease crying.
Why not have a small sectioned/curtained off area at the rear of the aircraft for families with babies / small children? Surely this would be OK on the A380? If VS are planning on having room for bars etc., why not have a nursery style section with paintings of animals all over the walls??
More room for bassonetts etc. I know a lot of families that would go for this option...
This would serve the purpose of keeping both sets of PAX happy I.e. the economy class travellers who want to sleep, and the families that need to keep their children entertained..
(Then the doe-eyed parents of newborns could "network" with each other and swap baby story's and photos etc...)
Any suggestions for possible names for this class??
Childrens Club?
Childrens Class?
http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/Midwest/0...iked.juice.ap/
Flying Business back from HKG about 3 weeks ago, I had developed a really bad cough and I could not stop the tickle in my throat. The pax next to me (Chinese) offered my a lozenge (well I think that that is what it was - all of the text was in Chinese..).
I did not know what it was, but took it anyway - What if I had had an allergic reaction to one of the ingredients? Maybe the flight would have to be diverted?
Getting back closer to the topic - (and trying to be a little more constructive than a few of the posts on this thread)
I am one of the "few" that has their bus class travel paid for. But even when I travel in cattle class, I hate being woken up by screaming children on Long Haul.
Most of the parents that I see with small children / Infants that are crying are extremely embarressed and do everything to get their child to cease crying.
Why not have a small sectioned/curtained off area at the rear of the aircraft for families with babies / small children? Surely this would be OK on the A380? If VS are planning on having room for bars etc., why not have a nursery style section with paintings of animals all over the walls??
More room for bassonetts etc. I know a lot of families that would go for this option...
This would serve the purpose of keeping both sets of PAX happy I.e. the economy class travellers who want to sleep, and the families that need to keep their children entertained..
(Then the doe-eyed parents of newborns could "network" with each other and swap baby story's and photos etc...)
Any suggestions for possible names for this class??
Childrens Club?
Childrens Class?
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an-124
There is one thing making your suggestion questionable:
if you have one infant who is screaming, so it is all what you have (apart from annoyed neighbours).
if you have a dedicated area for passengers with infants/children, and one, just one, child starts to scream - in 2 minutes you have all "baby class" screaming becuase children and especially infants tends to scream if anyone else screaming nearby... so it's a potential hell on every second flight
There is one thing making your suggestion questionable:
if you have one infant who is screaming, so it is all what you have (apart from annoyed neighbours).
if you have a dedicated area for passengers with infants/children, and one, just one, child starts to scream - in 2 minutes you have all "baby class" screaming becuase children and especially infants tends to scream if anyone else screaming nearby... so it's a potential hell on every second flight
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an-124 -and everyone- you are perfectly right as a passenger (I also hate baby screaming...) but even if most airlines still offers business and first class services, they (ALL) are trying to reduce costs, both to lower tickets fares and to balance their accounts.
A "Screaming-babies Class" would be a very comfortable innovation for travelers (except who is sitted just behind the curtain.......) but I think it will remain a dream for economic reasons!
Someone in this thread reminded that people should accept the fact that air transport is becoming affordable to everyone and the line is that...in the near future aircraft will be closer and closer to a bus and it will be easier to find really every kind of people on board.
I don't mean to be racist toward anyone, but I think it is the crude fact!
I' ve been flying for 14 years as as stewardess and now I work on ground in an international hub, so I can see the matter from both sides....it is a pity for me to see air transport going this way, but I don't think there will be any company operating for businessmen in general, at least for the next years...
Let's hope passengers who are not used to fly and families with children will soon learn good manners and the right behaviour to take on board an aircraft!
many happy and comfortable flights to everyone
p.s. don't forget your ear plugs!!!!!!
A "Screaming-babies Class" would be a very comfortable innovation for travelers (except who is sitted just behind the curtain.......) but I think it will remain a dream for economic reasons!
Someone in this thread reminded that people should accept the fact that air transport is becoming affordable to everyone and the line is that...in the near future aircraft will be closer and closer to a bus and it will be easier to find really every kind of people on board.
I don't mean to be racist toward anyone, but I think it is the crude fact!
I' ve been flying for 14 years as as stewardess and now I work on ground in an international hub, so I can see the matter from both sides....it is a pity for me to see air transport going this way, but I don't think there will be any company operating for businessmen in general, at least for the next years...
Let's hope passengers who are not used to fly and families with children will soon learn good manners and the right behaviour to take on board an aircraft!
many happy and comfortable flights to everyone
p.s. don't forget your ear plugs!!!!!!
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Some airlines do cater for the business traveller Lufthansa operate a 737 between Frankfurt and Newark with 48 seats - all of them business, IIRC 30 need to be filled to turn a profit.
Seems there is a demand for customer specific travel options, you just have to pay for it.
Air travel in general has become a regular event in peoples and families lives whereas the fundamental design and layout of aircraft has remained the same - time for a change?
Seems there is a demand for customer specific travel options, you just have to pay for it.
Air travel in general has become a regular event in peoples and families lives whereas the fundamental design and layout of aircraft has remained the same - time for a change?
Paxing All Over The World
Lufthansa operate a 737 between Frankfurt and Newark with 48 seats - all of them business
OK, back to squawling babies!
--------------------
"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you any different." Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
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Gandalf started as n all business company in Bergamo , few years ago (I don't know if they admitted children.....)
think they had dornier 328 or 728 , anyway small aircrafts , now is bankrupt, peolple around seeking job and Alitalia took their slots...nice story!
Have been flying for 4 years in VIP general aviation, I saw that expecially in Italy is absolutely not organised...I stopped in 1994 and hope things get better .... I don't believe, but the only solutin for quiet and really business class flight is renting the plane!
think they had dornier 328 or 728 , anyway small aircrafts , now is bankrupt, peolple around seeking job and Alitalia took their slots...nice story!
Have been flying for 4 years in VIP general aviation, I saw that expecially in Italy is absolutely not organised...I stopped in 1994 and hope things get better .... I don't believe, but the only solutin for quiet and really business class flight is renting the plane!
