A surreal lack of airmanship
 

Heard this on Jabiru CTAF a few weeks ago and was mortified:

'XXX, Jabiru Ground.'

*A long pause*

'XXX, this is Jabiru Ground, how do you read?'

*A further long pause, before, more exasperatedly then before*

'XXX, Jabiru Ground!'

'Jabiru Ground, XXX, Go ahead.'

'You've been parked in front of the fuel bowser with the engines running for ages, three charters have already departed and it's made a mess of everything. Can you move?'

*To my eternal shock and amazement I hear the following*

'XXX, I was waiting for an IFR clearance. Too bad.'

Some people should be refused licenses on the basis of a lack of common decency and any modicum of airmanship. I'd forgotten that some drivers out there think they are God's gift. :yuk:

nothing new sadly, happened quite regularly at YHOX in the day, though most would just sit there and do their preflight and runups! :ugh:

Were they not aware they could have departed on a broadcast basis..??? (Jeppo's ATC, AU717, unless they couldn't satisfy the requirements of course)

S

So this really happened or not? Well OCTA at JAB.

In years past that lack of airmanship and respect for other pilots would have been knocked out of a pilot at the 'single' stage of their career. Unfortunately this arrogance has been allowed to build as the more experienced twin drivers that were mentors to the single drivers were rapidly sucked up into the airlines.

As a result of this rapid progression many years of airmanship that where built up and passed along by these mentors to the younger pilots was lost, and the drivers now in the twins think that they know all. Then again, they must, they only did 600hrs in a 210 before they got put into their first twin. Everyone before them had been doing 1500+hrs before they got their chance to look at a baron, let alone those high performance pa31's and c402's.

I have been assured that it did indeed occur at the said location.

Modern selfishness
 

Not suprised to hear that at all.

In Mildura last year I heard this conversation (IIRC) between two helicopters:

AAA: "BBB on Mildura CTAF, this is AAA. Are you going to be long at the fuel bowser?"

(BBB had finished refuelling and was "turning and burning", but not in a hurry to go anywhere)

BBB: "We'll just be here for a few minutes more"
AAA: "Well, can you move it please?"
BBB: "I'll just be here a few minutes more"
AAA: "I need to refuel for a charter"
BBB: "Good for you!"

BBB moved along around 5 minutes later.

Just another example of "Modern selfishness" where "whatever I'm doing right now is always going to be more important than whatever everybody else is doing".

DIVOSH :sad:

DiVosh.. isnt the jet fuel at mildura a truck?

Lack of Ability , Humility equals lack of Safety
 

Pity you won t let on what the callsign was , then perhaps a dose of public humil would remind Capt D/a-- to pick his act up or get his boss on his tail ....lol .:)

I m figuring it was a PA 31 or similiar BIG !!! plane so close to Darwin .

Either he s new and got no spare capacity to answer an unexpected call ,

or he s a Capt D/Ass whose arrogance and exalted position of flying two engines instead of one ,tells him he doesn t have to regard others .

I reckon it could be either or both , and prob from the less reputable side of the GA area ,
Heard of a DN operator with half a dozen BIG !! planes ,whose CP only just got his IFR and has minimal time and now getting all his boys to fly IFR ,to get their experience up before the wet hits ........:hmm:

hmmmmmm
 

What is an "IFR clearance" anyway?

If I have submitted an IFR flight plan then do I need ATC permission to fly IFR? What happened to the airways clearance when departing in CTA & giving taxi report "IFR" to FS to get IFR traffic OCTA.

Have they lowered the steps over YJAB or has Bob lashed out & put a tower there recently. Would have prefered some decent lights instead of those battery powered jobbies.:ugh:

Sounds like a gen Yer with out a clue (no surprises there) or bull**** artist trying to piss Bob off (which wouldn't be difficult). That is if he hasn't retired.;)

Surreal?
 

...is this really "surreal" - ie: dream-like - or is it merely strange, bizzare or disappointing?

So the guy is a f$%&wit... so what, hardly Robinson Crusoe :rolleyes:

It's not the first time pilots from that company have pissed people of out there with there "I'm IFR, im in a bigger plane, get the :mad: outta my way, I'll do whatever I want."

Why is it such a surprise????
 

It should be remembered that aviation attracts people from all walks of life - with all different attitudes and personalities.

It is nice to think that in our "professional" world people would contain sufficient situational awareness and courtesy, but just like on the road, in an accounting firm or a servo, etc, there will always be people who are selfish and feel that they are more important

If these wankers piss you off enough then write a letter to their CP mentioning what happened.

Maybe they will learn something.
Maybe they won't.

If they don't, and are naturally just selfish, then dont worry about it!!

Every dog has their day......



On a different note, if your IFR deptarting from an OCTA aerdrome you of course dont need a clearance (unless your going to Class A, then you just need it before you get there).
Many times I have been at a community airstrip and departed without a taxi call becaseu HF is having another bad day, with the intention of contacting CN once airborne. Perfectly fine, as long as you remember that without the taxi call nobody knows you have departed so if you spud it in after take off nobodys going to come looking for you.....



Eternity.

What ever happened to a broadcast on VHF...& taxi report on HF (I haven't done the VFR thing for a good many years, thought it was a requirement for VFR charter, unless you have VHF comms with an agent etc has it changed?)

Spent many a time departing community airstrips always broadcast a taxi call on VHF prior to HF requesting trafffic, when IFR, or am I missing something?

Yea, at least something on VHF (CTAF), someone will hear that. Possibly me on short final. Nothing worse than an aircraft taxing onto the runway from behind the trees with out broadcasting, then having to power up and go around.

I'm pretty sure he wasn't referring to CTAF calls, but Centre.

In which case you should file a SARTIME for departure :)

The term "PILOT" is an oxymoron.

Every attribute that per person possesses that makes them a good PILOT is the exact same attributes that you would not employ then to do anything!
:uhoh:

surreal? Were you stoned or something?

As usual..nothing to do with airmanship..just a ******** in a plane..happens at the traffic lights all the time..its not called carmanship there.

Havick

Yes, Ken and (Was Neal but now Fitzy) do the jet fuel via the truck. Don't know if there is or was Jet fuel bowser.

I know crap all about helicopters mate, they could have been pistons for all I know. Just passing on what I heard on the CTAF.

DIVOSH!

I'm not from Oz but I'm here working for a charter company at the moment and it has to be said that Oz seems to have a huge amount of arrogant tossers in the GA sector. I have worked in many countries but for some reason it just seems that there is a disproportionate amount of generally young pilots who are rude and self important with there head so far up there own arse they are nearly inside out.

Its a shame for the good guys and girls in Oz who get tarred with the same brush. Can't wait leave the big hot island, flights booked.

Well GA has always been a training ground for the airlines... :}

In other countries these guys are recruited straight to the airlines!;)

No in other countries where I have worked you also need at least 2000hrs to go for airlines, they are just not as arrogent and self important.

Those countries must be awesome!!! Where are they?

Lack of respect
 

Recently had a C402 from a certain Goldfields company in kalgoorlie ??, park infront of me, downwind then fill my aircraft full of dust and stones, then proceeded to shutdown while we were warming up.
Plenty of room, and no reason to park there.
When i fronted him he showed no sign of an apology or professionalism.
Theres one born every minute.:ugh:
M

My personal favourite was a charter helicopter that plonked on the RFDS aeromed bay. Bad enough, but to make it worse an arriving RFDS med one was taxiing for the bay and the waiting (blocked) ambulance. When the SMC told the chopper to move (in no uncertain terms) the response was something like 'our pax are just disembarking, we'll only be a minute..." Some anonymous voice on frequency asked them if they parked in wheelchair zones. I guess they probably do. :ugh:

Some people are just way too important for their own good.

So who is the Broome pilot who enjoyed tying down on my tiedowns a few weeks back in Fitzroy Crossing despite the road cones marking the site as a survey calibration site? Its not like there is a shortage of parking there. Did they think the airport manager had prepared that spot especially for their arrival??
Oh well, I think I might have had the last laugh there.

Simple solution Aileron. Go to local hardware store and buy appropriate lengths of hardened chain and locks.

When you arrive home and find your tie downs and all other taken by visiting CPL hour builders/ toolish charter pilots

1 Put chains and locks to appropriate use.
2 Attach phone number to chains.
3 Make sure you take your time getting back out to the airport to unlock said chains once you receive phone call.
4 Word gets around soon enough and TADA, unmolested parking space, tie downs and chocks.
5 Call their CFI/CP after they're airborne.

j3

see J3, on long trips, most CPL hour builders (like myself) don't know how the airport works and tend to only visit once.. I tend to call the airport and ask them what the parking conditions are like up to a week beforehand.

Fortunately, where I fly, most people are very nice and generous!:ok:
A guy filling up his C206 even let me fill up my 20L jerry can for the J-3 I was flying before him, even when he arrived first!

:ok:Pyro.

Aileron 69, I'm sure you've made a few 'airmanship' mistakes in your career. I don't think parking your aircraft nose to nose with the parked aircraft, leaving a childish, sarcastic note, or posting photos of your parking on facebook was the right thing to do.

A simple phone call would have solved all issues.

Just to clarify a few things
 

Betaman & the air up there,


As Douche pointed out I was not referring to the standard (and required) CTAF calls.
They (obviously) are always made regardless of the flight rules you are operating under.
See, in the big bad scary bush, Centre usually can't hear you when your on the ground, hence the use of HF for your IFR taxi call.
To suggest that I would blast around the bush using only my HF and yelling "Yee-Haa!!" is borderline insulting.



Manymak,

Thanks for the tip about the IFR sartime for departure. But when you are operating charter flights (especially out of aboriginal communities) the actual time of departure plus or minus an hour is always a wild guess. If you compound that with the fact that the airstrip is usually quite a few miles from any sort of telephone simply increases the difficulty.
We do however, insist that the troopie (who dropped off or picked up the passengers) DOES wait after you have departed, which in turn gives you time to make contact with ATC before the drive off.
At night, however dept. SARTIME's are always used when departing from remote strips.

But thanks to all three of you for the comments.


Eternity.

Eternity, if you are flying to remote aboriginal communities, try a next G phone. Only place I've been in the Top End that doesn't have next G service is Croker Island.

Plus, most of the people out there won't mind you using the phone to make a quick call to revise departure time or notify the company your early/late.

OFFS /who waz it
 

Dear Up In The Air,

Who was the Capt Pratzski involved in the Jabiru affair ,cause DN has 200 odd Capt Perfects who would like to give that

I sure have, but I always make sure I ask to use someones tiedowns before parking there. Its usually pretty obvious that an aircraft will be returning if they have left ropes behind. Maybe if said Broome pilot had turned Broome pilot's brain on no phonecalls would be needed?:E

Wait, wait, let me guess, "AerobaticArcher" flys out of Broome?? :ok:

I always found the Broome pilots lacking in common sense!

Giving en-route reports VFR on Kimberley CTAF, Carrying jerry can of fuel on a charter in the baggage compartment when fuel was available at the destination......... I could go on and on!

Surreal (adjective);
Bizarre
Weirdly unfamiliar, distorted, or disturbing, like the experiences in a dream or the objects or experiences depicted in surrealism

Maybe the adjective “surreal” doesn’t apply here. Maybe “shocking”, “amazing”, or “woeful” would be more appropriate. Now that I’ve got that out of my system……..

Was lucky enough to be at Temora last weekend. Witnessed a bozo in a Warrior (didn’t get the rego unfortunately….for him!) disrupt the air show proceedings despite the NOTAM describing the temporary restricted area in place for said air show. A couple of the air show people had a rather interesting discussion with said bozo. Undeterred however, said bozo then leapt in his mighty Warrior which was parked with it’s tail pointing to one of our aircraft and proceeded to give it fistful of power to get it moving. He was clearly oblivious to the effect this was having, i.e. causing the rudder of the parked aircraft behind it to be buffeted significantly.

That’s just the latest example I have seen, and sadly I conclude that there will be many more.

I must also (sadly) agree with Bla3 to an extent. I know there are thoroughly professional operators and nice people in GA, however the tossers are becoming more noticeable. And isn’t this just representative of what’s happening in society as a whole?

"I know there are thoroughly professional operators and nice people in GA, however the tossers are becoming more noticeable. And isn’t this just representative of what’s happening in society as a whole?"

Nope......you're probably noticing it out there as your experience and wisdom levels increase.
Just a thought.:ok: