Jobs for Newbies
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Jobs for Newbies
How many hours does it take to get a job in the industry for a 200hour CPL dude?
As far as im aware nowone will touch me unless i have 500hours plus 200 twin time?
As far as instructing goes (which i cant see myself doing) where else can i get my 500 hours to get a job ? even meatbombing is extremely
competitive.
My aim is to get a job as a night freighter/bank runner anyone have some advise ?
As far as im aware nowone will touch me unless i have 500hours plus 200 twin time?
As far as instructing goes (which i cant see myself doing) where else can i get my 500 hours to get a job ? even meatbombing is extremely
competitive.My aim is to get a job as a night freighter/bank runner anyone have some advise ?
Join Date: Jan 2001
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GEEBEEZEE. You must be joking!! If noone would employ you with less than 500hrs, and 200ME, how did everyone else get a start in the industry.
I know it isn't easy, but I see you're in Sydney.... Pack your bags and go see Australia. Stop at every airport on the way and say G'day. Yes it is more difficult to get a job with 200 hours than 500 hours, but not impossible. And for getting a job doing night freight, is that so you don't have to leave Sydney, try hitting the companies up, but I think they will tell you to come back when you have 1000 hrs, and 200 or more twin. Learn to walk before you run
Some ways to get a strat in the industry;
Parachute dropping
Glider Towing (more winchs are being used nowaday)
Scenic Flights in Holiday areas, usually sea side resort type areas
Banner towing
Sky writing
Work for Pastral??? Companies such as AMP
Beach Patrols
N.T and hope for a start.
Instructing
Forestry Patrols (WA)
These are a few options that I can think of off the top of my head. The biggest thing is that you have to make yourself more employable.
Parachuting, 10 hours on type usually C182.
Tail wheel endorsements are generally required for Glider towing.
Banner towing requires special training, so does sky sign writing. Working for Pastrol companies generally require a low level endorsement.
Beach Patrols, are generaly a couple of steps up from where you are, but in WA a flying school do it.
You could head up to NT, but so does ever other 200 hours pilot.
If you do go that way make sure you have a C206 oc C210 endorsement, and a DG certificate.
"How many hours does it take to get a job in the industry" Thousands of Hours are required. Thousands of man hours, blood sweat and tears are generally required as well
GOOD LUCK, it is a hard long, and slow road... But keep your head up, and keep positive... GET OUT OF SYDNEY if you have't already done so
I know it isn't easy, but I see you're in Sydney.... Pack your bags and go see Australia. Stop at every airport on the way and say G'day. Yes it is more difficult to get a job with 200 hours than 500 hours, but not impossible. And for getting a job doing night freight, is that so you don't have to leave Sydney, try hitting the companies up, but I think they will tell you to come back when you have 1000 hrs, and 200 or more twin. Learn to walk before you run
Some ways to get a strat in the industry;
Parachute dropping
Glider Towing (more winchs are being used nowaday)
Scenic Flights in Holiday areas, usually sea side resort type areas
Banner towing
Sky writing
Work for Pastral??? Companies such as AMP
Beach Patrols
N.T and hope for a start.
Instructing
Forestry Patrols (WA)
These are a few options that I can think of off the top of my head. The biggest thing is that you have to make yourself more employable.
Parachuting, 10 hours on type usually C182.
Tail wheel endorsements are generally required for Glider towing.
Banner towing requires special training, so does sky sign writing. Working for Pastrol companies generally require a low level endorsement.
Beach Patrols, are generaly a couple of steps up from where you are, but in WA a flying school do it.
You could head up to NT, but so does ever other 200 hours pilot.
If you do go that way make sure you have a C206 oc C210 endorsement, and a DG certificate.
"How many hours does it take to get a job in the industry" Thousands of Hours are required. Thousands of man hours, blood sweat and tears are generally required as well
GOOD LUCK, it is a hard long, and slow road... But keep your head up, and keep positive... GET OUT OF SYDNEY if you have't already done so
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The gravy needs more salt, Mum
G'day Gravox
You are correct, just like the time you set up that light at the BBQ, and we were just giving you a hard time time saying you were 5C3SD.
Yes, get out of Sydney, it is a s&*%hole anyway. Great place to live if you make 100K a year.
I reckon the Queensland coast between Rocky and Townsville would be a good place to look for work. I admit, not millions of operators but not many think I trying this area of Australia. Everyone heads to Kununurra, Darwin and cairns. Of course there are plenty of operators but there are ridiculous amounts of 200-1000 hr. drivers looking for work.
Just a thought.
Boney
You are correct, just like the time you set up that light at the BBQ, and we were just giving you a hard time time saying you were 5C3SD.
Yes, get out of Sydney, it is a s&*%hole anyway. Great place to live if you make 100K a year.
I reckon the Queensland coast between Rocky and Townsville would be a good place to look for work. I admit, not millions of operators but not many think I trying this area of Australia. Everyone heads to Kununurra, Darwin and cairns. Of course there are plenty of operators but there are ridiculous amounts of 200-1000 hr. drivers looking for work.
Just a thought.
Boney
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The Gravy is already too salty!!!
Do share Boney..!
Bet ya it doesn't beat the time that a certain meat product was at a certain Uni Ball!!!
Hey ya Gravy... yeah yeah, you know who I am and where I live... come and get me...
How are those parking meters in Oz?
Gravox is completely right..
I think you might be pushing s#it uphill to get a night bank run at 200 hrs CPL.. you'd might as well aim for the LHS of a B747 while yer at it!!!!
Aim for a nice quiet VFR single engine job, a C172 or a C206.. and go from there...
Progression is slow, the road is long, yadda yadda yadda..blah blah blah.... but nothing beats the feeling when your in a plane by yourself at altitude, watching the sun go slowly down....
Bet ya it doesn't beat the time that a certain meat product was at a certain Uni Ball!!!
Hey ya Gravy... yeah yeah, you know who I am and where I live... come and get me...
How are those parking meters in Oz?
Gravox is completely right..
I think you might be pushing s#it uphill to get a night bank run at 200 hrs CPL.. you'd might as well aim for the LHS of a B747 while yer at it!!!!
Aim for a nice quiet VFR single engine job, a C172 or a C206.. and go from there...
Progression is slow, the road is long, yadda yadda yadda..blah blah blah.... but nothing beats the feeling when your in a plane by yourself at altitude, watching the sun go slowly down....
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And GeeBeeZee,
Don't let anyone tell you that u need to get a 210 endoresement to get a job cos you are already qualified to fly it. Hours in the big cessna would be nice but if someone is interested in giving you a job, your gonna be doing some icus (at least some route/company familiarity with a senior pilot) anyways so save the cash for the trip up here.
Oh and open up your road atlas and just put a black mark through Kununurra, i heard its chocckas and no prospects til nov, but i guess dwn is the same. Although up there, there are companies with posts out in the sticks which is what you could think bout getting...
Above all else remain positive and just try and meet as many connected people as possible.... something will happen and probably when u lest expect it!
cheers
Don't let anyone tell you that u need to get a 210 endoresement to get a job cos you are already qualified to fly it. Hours in the big cessna would be nice but if someone is interested in giving you a job, your gonna be doing some icus (at least some route/company familiarity with a senior pilot) anyways so save the cash for the trip up here.
Oh and open up your road atlas and just put a black mark through Kununurra, i heard its chocckas and no prospects til nov, but i guess dwn is the same. Although up there, there are companies with posts out in the sticks which is what you could think bout getting...
Above all else remain positive and just try and meet as many connected people as possible.... something will happen and probably when u lest expect it!
cheers
Have a search on here for similar topics - there should be a wealth of information.
Only thing I have to add to the above comments is to "think outside the square". Investigate some of the smaller towns and operators and if you can help it, try not to plonk yourself in the bigger places like Darwin and Broome competing with every other 200hr bloke. Of course you might not be able to avoid it, because if the need to find some part time non-flying work arises you will logically have more success in the major centres.
Almost everyone has their own story and theories about how they cracked it for their first gig, so listen to every person you meet for some valuable advice.
Cheers,
TL
Only thing I have to add to the above comments is to "think outside the square". Investigate some of the smaller towns and operators and if you can help it, try not to plonk yourself in the bigger places like Darwin and Broome competing with every other 200hr bloke. Of course you might not be able to avoid it, because if the need to find some part time non-flying work arises you will logically have more success in the major centres.
Almost everyone has their own story and theories about how they cracked it for their first gig, so listen to every person you meet for some valuable advice.
Cheers,
TL
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Hey I reckon that saturation of the market counts for quite a bit, not with cv's but with turning up and meeting people and then giving them your cv. I guess it is much easier for them to give you a job if they have met you and know that you are not completely different to them. I drove 11,000km and was meeting with the 80th operator I had visited when the 8th operator I had visited rang and said there might be something there for me if I could get there by the weekend, 1200km later I was there two days early and got a job within three onths of getting CPL. The market was a little better then but My point is that it is a gamble for an operator to get someone up just from a cv , I dont even know if any of them do it, and when one of the many operators out there has an opening, you really want to have met him/her.
It can be a great trip as well. good luck
It can be a great trip as well. good luck
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hey
you just have to get out there and early
Try getting to places like Kunn, and broome, by feb, even though there will be no jobs then, this is the time you get yourself known. then by march when the recruitung begins, people already know you. Plus they like it if you make the effort to base yourself somewhere.
I know that in broome about 4 guys were employed with abot 230 hours. C210 time will help so at least get a few hours before you come.
Good luck
you just have to get out there and early
Try getting to places like Kunn, and broome, by feb, even though there will be no jobs then, this is the time you get yourself known. then by march when the recruitung begins, people already know you. Plus they like it if you make the effort to base yourself somewhere.
I know that in broome about 4 guys were employed with abot 230 hours. C210 time will help so at least get a few hours before you come.
Good luck
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GBZ. Go bush. You will hardly ever get a job with 200hrs in a capital city unless you know someone.
An instructor rating can help but is not essential. 1000klm into my trip a chap said to me "mate if you had an instructor rating...". You know what? He had everything from 172's to Barons from memory. An ideal first job.
Try all the little places along the QLD coast and if you have the time and fuel try for a few inland ventures before making the pilgrimage to the NT. The key is to pump your contacts or to ask the local pilots "where do you reckon I should go..." "do you know anyone thats looking..". Most of these chaps have been where you are and will try to help you.
Have your feelers out everywhere and don't be afraid to go for the smaller operations. Often they will have a twin. 210's in WA is great but not everyone is lucky enough to score that so you might have to think laterally. Be up front and ask people like HA "where do you reckon the next job will be". There are a thousand and one 172's on propertys in the middle of nowhere.
I thought at times that it was never going to happen and 12 months after my cpl there i was with my fist job. A fantastic feeling that I will never forget.
Make sure you are not just another pilot on the dole forever hanging around, getting up at midday whinging and bitching. Get a job doing whatever, visit the operators and prepare for your next trip to wherever.
Good luck.
Mr. Hat
An instructor rating can help but is not essential. 1000klm into my trip a chap said to me "mate if you had an instructor rating...". You know what? He had everything from 172's to Barons from memory. An ideal first job.
Try all the little places along the QLD coast and if you have the time and fuel try for a few inland ventures before making the pilgrimage to the NT. The key is to pump your contacts or to ask the local pilots "where do you reckon I should go..." "do you know anyone thats looking..". Most of these chaps have been where you are and will try to help you.
Have your feelers out everywhere and don't be afraid to go for the smaller operations. Often they will have a twin. 210's in WA is great but not everyone is lucky enough to score that so you might have to think laterally. Be up front and ask people like HA "where do you reckon the next job will be". There are a thousand and one 172's on propertys in the middle of nowhere.
I thought at times that it was never going to happen and 12 months after my cpl there i was with my fist job. A fantastic feeling that I will never forget.
Make sure you are not just another pilot on the dole forever hanging around, getting up at midday whinging and bitching. Get a job doing whatever, visit the operators and prepare for your next trip to wherever.
Good luck.
Mr. Hat
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I would also suggest you try Karumba. This is often the main base for operators who have C206 or C210 based in Aboriginal communities.
The hours are long, the pay is minimal, but the logbook ticks over steadily if you put in the effort, and can offer more than just a pilot licence (e.g. Sales experience, Ability to deal with public etc.)
Try and think of a different angle other than the "I'll wash your aircraft for you", as that goes without saying. If you can offer more than just a licence and are prepared to travel to meet these operators face-to-face, you will succeed. Don't spend another cent on postage as you are just wasting your money.
I hope this helps.
Good Luck.
The hours are long, the pay is minimal, but the logbook ticks over steadily if you put in the effort, and can offer more than just a pilot licence (e.g. Sales experience, Ability to deal with public etc.)
Try and think of a different angle other than the "I'll wash your aircraft for you", as that goes without saying. If you can offer more than just a licence and are prepared to travel to meet these operators face-to-face, you will succeed. Don't spend another cent on postage as you are just wasting your money.
I hope this helps.
Good Luck.
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200 hour dude,
I went to the NT and got a job within five weeks when I had 221.2 hours. And I knew no one at all. Now I am in Africa, and if I had my time over again I would skip the NT and come here.
I think it is quite hard to score a break here but once you do things are much better than in OZ. That is if you are after progression.
If I was you I would try Botswana. Get there in DEcember and you will probablly be the first dude of the season looking for a job. I got there at that time and three companies said I could have a job. But I had to wait for the season to start. So I kept looking and found work in Tanzania. Here the requirements are higher though. But you could get work with a big company on a C206. There are three 206 slots going here that I know of.
Pay. Much better than oz. I am on a good deal though. Most jobs give you a house, transport, and expenses on overnights. So when times are slow I earn 3X what I got in the NT and if I fly heaps I get 6X or more.
Just have to be here dude. Be persistant though, and take what you can at first, then things can go really well for you here.
dog
I went to the NT and got a job within five weeks when I had 221.2 hours. And I knew no one at all. Now I am in Africa, and if I had my time over again I would skip the NT and come here.
I think it is quite hard to score a break here but once you do things are much better than in OZ. That is if you are after progression.
If I was you I would try Botswana. Get there in DEcember and you will probablly be the first dude of the season looking for a job. I got there at that time and three companies said I could have a job. But I had to wait for the season to start. So I kept looking and found work in Tanzania. Here the requirements are higher though. But you could get work with a big company on a C206. There are three 206 slots going here that I know of.
Pay. Much better than oz. I am on a good deal though. Most jobs give you a house, transport, and expenses on overnights. So when times are slow I earn 3X what I got in the NT and if I fly heaps I get 6X or more.
Just have to be here dude. Be persistant though, and take what you can at first, then things can go really well for you here.
dog
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helldog was intrigued by your story..do tell more.
Sounds like a great experience. What is the standard of machines over there...what about atc...?
What is the living like? Is it safe?
I'm not looking for a job just interested in hearing what its like over there.
I dare say that the living conditions might be better than some first jobs in the NT.
Sounds like a great experience. What is the standard of machines over there...what about atc...?
What is the living like? Is it safe?
I'm not looking for a job just interested in hearing what its like over there.
I dare say that the living conditions might be better than some first jobs in the NT.
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Or come to Europe and pay £17.000 GBP and work for RyanAir, with less than 200 hours.
I feel for you. I truly do because the system in AUS is quite a ridiculous one. By the time you get your first job you will be told that you are too old to fly anyway.
Firstly, if you have a load of cash, approach an operator and offer to pay them for the right seat time ICUS???. Maybe 200 hours or so will be enough for the company to be able to determine if you can fly from A to B and offer you a job.
Secondly, you have to spend a few months travelling, then find a place where there are aeroplanes, join the ‘’Q’’, work at the local Bottle’O’, get to know the locals, try to brown nose your way and then after all that you just might be in with a chance.
Thirdly, travel the world. You are bound to find something if you are determined enough. After all this then you will have your DDay with a lucrative company????? HR department, to have your say on: ‘’So tell me why did you chose to become a pilot’’.
In other words this is proof that HR is a load of S%^t, an invented science that employs people with no clue about the real world.
I did my thousand hours and I shall never return because the Aus mentality is quite a cynical, demoralising as well as unrewarding.
I wonder what the requirements will be for a DF/O on B-757 in Aus, if there was one?
10.000 hours +.Couple of flapless space shuttle approaches, bla bla bla????
Mine was 975.3 hours.
On my course, the experience ranged from 170 hours to 1200 hours, no multi-time.
And of course every one passed with no problem.
In other words, some experience plays a part, but the rest is up to a company to recognise one’s talent and invest in them.
So my dear chap/chappes, don’t give up and keep plugging away.
The Don.
I feel for you. I truly do because the system in AUS is quite a ridiculous one. By the time you get your first job you will be told that you are too old to fly anyway.
Firstly, if you have a load of cash, approach an operator and offer to pay them for the right seat time ICUS???. Maybe 200 hours or so will be enough for the company to be able to determine if you can fly from A to B and offer you a job.
Secondly, you have to spend a few months travelling, then find a place where there are aeroplanes, join the ‘’Q’’, work at the local Bottle’O’, get to know the locals, try to brown nose your way and then after all that you just might be in with a chance.
Thirdly, travel the world. You are bound to find something if you are determined enough. After all this then you will have your DDay with a lucrative company????? HR department, to have your say on: ‘’So tell me why did you chose to become a pilot’’.
In other words this is proof that HR is a load of S%^t, an invented science that employs people with no clue about the real world.
I did my thousand hours and I shall never return because the Aus mentality is quite a cynical, demoralising as well as unrewarding.
I wonder what the requirements will be for a DF/O on B-757 in Aus, if there was one?
10.000 hours +.Couple of flapless space shuttle approaches, bla bla bla????
Mine was 975.3 hours.
On my course, the experience ranged from 170 hours to 1200 hours, no multi-time.
And of course every one passed with no problem.
In other words, some experience plays a part, but the rest is up to a company to recognise one’s talent and invest in them.
So my dear chap/chappes, don’t give up and keep plugging away.
The Don.
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Sir Don we are just dealing with it the best way we can over here.
If your country would recognise any part of my licence/experience I'd be over there in flash.
Unfortunately I don't have the time/patience/money to have some instructor go thru straight and level with me again.
Over here we pretty much require the euro licences to do a medical and cpl written/practical and away you go - as you'd know.
Thats life
And if I'm too old well who cares - I got old ticking the farken boxes I was asked to tick.
If your country would recognise any part of my licence/experience I'd be over there in flash.
Unfortunately I don't have the time/patience/money to have some instructor go thru straight and level with me again.
Over here we pretty much require the euro licences to do a medical and cpl written/practical and away you go - as you'd know.
Thats life
And if I'm too old well who cares - I got old ticking the farken boxes I was asked to tick.
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Mr Hat, I am a fellow Australian and i know the hardship of getting the first job, but the quest for that elusive job did take me half way accross the world. Otherwise i still would have been bashing around the outback or chasing cattle only to be told that i do not have enough twin time for a baron job, let alone for a turbo prop. Hence the move.
For Licence coversion over here, the authority recognises any qualification gained from a ICAO member country.
The requirements are:
15 hrs for the CPL,
15 hrs for the IR,
14 ATPL subjects pass, approx 6 months,
Radio Licence exam,
All in all £12.000 GB pounds.
It is worth every penny of it at the end.
I just think it is sad for a talented and determined individual who has just qualified that has to deliver pizza in order to prove their enthusiasm for a C210 job.
What about all the fees that QF is requesting for one's assessment. If a company is not willing to invest in you, well that says a lot about the company.
Best of luck to all of you out there.
The Don.
For Licence coversion over here, the authority recognises any qualification gained from a ICAO member country.
The requirements are:
15 hrs for the CPL,
15 hrs for the IR,
14 ATPL subjects pass, approx 6 months,
Radio Licence exam,
All in all £12.000 GB pounds.
It is worth every penny of it at the end.
I just think it is sad for a talented and determined individual who has just qualified that has to deliver pizza in order to prove their enthusiasm for a C210 job.
What about all the fees that QF is requesting for one's assessment. If a company is not willing to invest in you, well that says a lot about the company.
Best of luck to all of you out there.
The Don.
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I agree with you Sir Don, in terms of a possible entry route, and thank you for higlighting this to the masses. However, there is the slight issue of raising the Au$25K for the conversion, plus the lights, accommodation, etc. These may be a little barrier for most folks.
Sir Don,
I believe the employment situation isn't too great in Europe at the moment either. And companies such as Ryanair and EasyJet will also charge for parts of their employment screening I believe.
However, I still agree with you and have sold my house to do the "conversion." At least that will be some motivation not to stuff up
Oh and the girlfriend over there helps too 
I believe the employment situation isn't too great in Europe at the moment either. And companies such as Ryanair and EasyJet will also charge for parts of their employment screening I believe.
However, I still agree with you and have sold my house to do the "conversion." At least that will be some motivation not to stuff up
Oh and the girlfriend over there helps too