Mid - Air @ Caboolture
Historically most mid airs in Australia have occurred in CTA, in the circuit of Secondary Airports.
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From this ATSB report (with my additions in red):
Easy to see how, in the absence of notification of crossing helicopter traffic as part of the landing clearance, you're relying on pure luck to miss them if you do go around. Lucky that ZVO's passenger saw the Cherokee. Lucky that they were flying something that allowed visibility over the nose in the climb. Lucky they went around when they did, and not 2 seconds later... When I go around in the RV, particularly without a passenger, my pitch attitude is 15-20* nose up depending on atmospherics with the RoC in the vicinity of 1500-1800FPM and I'm completely blind under the nose when climbing at Vy. I'd say there's several other aircraft where that might be the case too.
Relying on luck to miss another aircraft by 200m (best case) or 30m (worst case) when that was only due to the helicopter taking avoiding action after its' passenger - not the pilot - first saw the traffic going-around is not acceptable anywhere, yet alone in controlled airspace. But the ATSB and ATCO's still puts it back on us as pilots to avoid traffic we may not even know about.
Easy to see how, in the absence of notification of crossing helicopter traffic as part of the landing clearance, you're relying on pure luck to miss them if you do go around. Lucky that ZVO's passenger saw the Cherokee. Lucky that they were flying something that allowed visibility over the nose in the climb. Lucky they went around when they did, and not 2 seconds later... When I go around in the RV, particularly without a passenger, my pitch attitude is 15-20* nose up depending on atmospherics with the RoC in the vicinity of 1500-1800FPM and I'm completely blind under the nose when climbing at Vy. I'd say there's several other aircraft where that might be the case too.
Relying on luck to miss another aircraft by 200m (best case) or 30m (worst case) when that was only due to the helicopter taking avoiding action after its' passenger - not the pilot - first saw the traffic going-around is not acceptable anywhere, yet alone in controlled airspace. But the ATSB and ATCO's still puts it back on us as pilots to avoid traffic we may not even know about.
Doesn't have to be crossing RWY's. A go around of a lighty off the old BNE 14 nearly put someone in front of an arriving 737 on RWY 19. Simultaneous approaches were stopped forthwith after that.
Was that when the lady in the Cirrus bounced her way down 14 past the intersection?
Originally Posted by Squawk
Was that when the lady in the Cirrus bounced her way down 14 past the intersection?
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We have an aircraft hangared at YCAB and have been flying out of there for many years. Obviously keen to see what the final report says, but comms arrangements at YCAB have always been a personal concern, and I can't help but wonder if comms was a factor in this latest tragedy.
- One frequency (125.85) essentially covers D629C, D, E plus two busy ALA's (YCAB and YCDR). It does get congested. YRED has a defined area with its own discrete CTAF frequency. In my view, YCAB and YCDR need a similar arrangement.
- Carriage and use of radio is now required (great!) but if the radio is not checked and confirmed working before going full noise it can be deadly. Earlier this year, having just commenced my take-off roll on RWY11, a gyrocopter entered and rolled on RWY29. I aborted and came to a stop, he took off over the top of me. The subsequent aero club investigation found the gyrocopter had a faulty radio.
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I've said it many times, but it bears repeating: We should all assume that there are 'no radio' aircraft out there, because they literally aren't fitted with a radio or, if it is fitted with a radio, it's malfunctioning, is tuned to the wrong frequency or is otherwise the subject of finger trouble in the cockpit.
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It also pays to remember that anything could suddenly block a runway and create a go-round. In this case it may have been a taxiing Cessna, but it could be a car, child, horse, cow, UFO, flock of birds etc etc etc, none of the later will care what you said on the radio... Anything planned too close to the wind will then turn into a mess involving luck as to whether you survive or not.
There is a large diversity of traffic in that area. Has anybody seen those big parachutes with engines strapped to the back of the pilot? I've seen a few of them around Caboolture. A radio is not going to help you miss them.
I do believe we have the best ATC controllers in Australia at Moorabbin.
I've said it many times, but it bears repeating: We should all assume that there are 'no radio' aircraft out there, because they literally aren't fitted with a radio or, if it is fitted with a radio, it's malfunctioning, is tuned to the wrong frequency or is otherwise the subject of finger trouble in the cockpit
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Sounds like he snuck in under the radar.
It would be interesting to find out accurate stats on the number of times Centre tells an aircraft their CTAF call was on Area. If what I hear is indicative, I reckon the number would be 'lots'. At least in those cases a third party has let the aircraft know - or at least tried to let it know.
One tricky issue that I fear could loom large in the Caboolture tragedy is the 'regulatory status' of the local 'Operations Manual' and 'Local Traffic Regulation' in ERSA that says: "Carriage and use of radio is required by the AD OPR". I doubt whether the local 'Operations Manual' modifies or otherwise changes the legislated rules of the air, including the take-off/landing rules. And while the owner of a (sort of) flat piece of land can set just about any rules the owner likes about the use of that patch of land by aircraft - like you're not allowed to use it unless you carry and use a radio, I don't think that turns the area into a Mandatory Broadcast Area from a regulatory perspective.
One tricky issue that I fear could loom large in the Caboolture tragedy is the 'regulatory status' of the local 'Operations Manual' and 'Local Traffic Regulation' in ERSA that says: "Carriage and use of radio is required by the AD OPR". I doubt whether the local 'Operations Manual' modifies or otherwise changes the legislated rules of the air, including the take-off/landing rules. And while the owner of a (sort of) flat piece of land can set just about any rules the owner likes about the use of that patch of land by aircraft - like you're not allowed to use it unless you carry and use a radio, I don't think that turns the area into a Mandatory Broadcast Area from a regulatory perspective.
Had a student on a solo navex down to YLTV get in front of a SAAB and cause it to go round, many years ago. The student landed and stopped feeling a bit shaken as he thought he had done something very wrong and apologized over the radio. One of the SAAB crew (Pretty sure it was Hazos) came over and apologized as they had been on the wrong frequency or something and realized at 7 nm going for a 5nm final, and made a quick call, by that time the student was already on base and didn't realize how fast the SAAB is. SAAB crew decided it was better to go round, and the student heard this and thought they were in big trouble. I think from what the student described it was a check ride with three crew up front...
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Well that’s a new one for me: turning the radio volume down for engine runup. I’m guessing the product of someone’s strongly held opinion.
Tragic, turning the volume down, surely it’s not taught
Fixed it for the ATSB:
[YCAB] is located within class G non-controlled airspace, where pilots of radio-equipped aircraft make and monitor radio positional broadcasts on a designated common traffic advisory frequency (CTAF) - if the radio equipment is serviceable and operated correctly - to ensure increase the probabilities of separation from other aircraft.
I would suggest it is not wise to start a takeoff roll when you cannot visually clear an intersecting runway and you know someone is in the process of landing on that runway. Even if they made a call to indicate they would be holding short, even if this unnofficial LAHSO was a routine procedure at the field.