Go West, young man - or should it be North, South or East?
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Go West, young man - or should it be North, South or East?
This Pprune member was fortunate enough to get into the RAAF at 19 for flying training and never looked back. For that reason I don't envy today's new CPL who, unable cannot find a job in his immediate vicinity, is forced to up-sticks and go looking elsewhere - commonly heading the well worn track for many new pilots and that is "Up North". There are numerous success stories of course of pilots who found jobs in NT and over the next few years were successful in getting into an airline. For example many of my former students are now flying domestic or international 737's, 777's and other jet transports after 3-5 years up North.
Friend of mine is just completing his multi-engine instrument rating and with 250 hours in his log book is soon going (you guessed it) up North to seek his first paid flying job. He has already previously visited Broome to assess the job situation and found several new CPL pilots waiting in a queue while keeping the wolf from the door by meanwhile packing shelves at the local supermarket. How long should they wait before moving to try their luck elsewhere? How long is a piece of string?
It occurred to me that Pprune readers include many pilot employers. Would it be safe to say most employers don't always live "Up North." And I wonder if statistically there are more chances of a walking into a flying job in the south and east of Australia (coastal or in land) than `up north`?
Getting your first flying job is often a combination of who you know, networking, and goodluck. One new pilot embarked on the long car journey ` up north` with a new CPL and CIR in his pocket and travelled to Darwin via Mount Isa and all airports in between. No luck so he came back via Tennant Creek and Alice Springs arriving back at home jobless several months later. It was back to driving a fork lift truck. Six months passed and suddenly came a call from Alice Springs to fly a Cessna 206 in the NT. His CV dropped in six months earlier had finally paid off. Be there in the next 48 hours or miss out said the phone call. . He was there for several months of full on flying during the tourist season. Then the job disappeared and it was back to square one.
There were BN2 Islanders in PNG but no replies to CV's and it cost a lot of money to fly there hoping to land a job. But having saved up enough money driving a fork lifter he decided to give PNG a go and first obtained an Islander endorsement. To his delight the chief pilot of the Islander company offered him a job after the endorsement. It was the break most CPL's would dream about. Years down the track he obtained an airline command. In order to help current and future CPL graduates it would be appreciated if those reading this thread could offer their views on the chances of young pilots finding flying work in the Eastern states compared with the accepted ritual of going `Up North` to find their first job.
Friend of mine is just completing his multi-engine instrument rating and with 250 hours in his log book is soon going (you guessed it) up North to seek his first paid flying job. He has already previously visited Broome to assess the job situation and found several new CPL pilots waiting in a queue while keeping the wolf from the door by meanwhile packing shelves at the local supermarket. How long should they wait before moving to try their luck elsewhere? How long is a piece of string?
It occurred to me that Pprune readers include many pilot employers. Would it be safe to say most employers don't always live "Up North." And I wonder if statistically there are more chances of a walking into a flying job in the south and east of Australia (coastal or in land) than `up north`?
Getting your first flying job is often a combination of who you know, networking, and goodluck. One new pilot embarked on the long car journey ` up north` with a new CPL and CIR in his pocket and travelled to Darwin via Mount Isa and all airports in between. No luck so he came back via Tennant Creek and Alice Springs arriving back at home jobless several months later. It was back to driving a fork lift truck. Six months passed and suddenly came a call from Alice Springs to fly a Cessna 206 in the NT. His CV dropped in six months earlier had finally paid off. Be there in the next 48 hours or miss out said the phone call. . He was there for several months of full on flying during the tourist season. Then the job disappeared and it was back to square one.
There were BN2 Islanders in PNG but no replies to CV's and it cost a lot of money to fly there hoping to land a job. But having saved up enough money driving a fork lifter he decided to give PNG a go and first obtained an Islander endorsement. To his delight the chief pilot of the Islander company offered him a job after the endorsement. It was the break most CPL's would dream about. Years down the track he obtained an airline command. In order to help current and future CPL graduates it would be appreciated if those reading this thread could offer their views on the chances of young pilots finding flying work in the Eastern states compared with the accepted ritual of going `Up North` to find their first job.
Last edited by Centaurus; 23rd Sep 2014 at 13:29.
He has already previously visited Broome to assess the job situation and found several new CPL pilots waiting in a queue while keeping the wolf from the door by meanwhile packing shelves at the local supermarket. How long should they wait before moving to try their luck elsewhere? How long is a piece of string?
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In answer to your question I was in the same position 30 years ago. So yes the age old tradition of travelling north looking for work is nothing new. I also got a call to go flying Scenics around the rock (thanks Chris and Luke at ARAS). That was after travelling around the nation seeing operators. It was about a year later though and I had completed Senior Commercial subjects and an instructor rating in that time. I had kept in touch as they seemed the most likely to give me a crack.
There is no rhyme or reason to it all mostly just luck. As a previous poster put it make your own luck. Make friends, be respectful and help others where you can.
I feel a holiday up north for a bit is a good thing for an inspiring pilot, sort of grounds you. Go home east or wherever you live if nothing comes up, let's face it, it can be pretty lonely. Keep educating yourself, it does not have to be aviation related, fork lift or truck driver, whatever. Keep working keep positive and trying. It will happen eventually.
Centaurus looks as though the fellas you helped got lucky to have you as a mentor. If you can find a Mentor it helps too.
There is no rhyme or reason to it all mostly just luck. As a previous poster put it make your own luck. Make friends, be respectful and help others where you can.
I feel a holiday up north for a bit is a good thing for an inspiring pilot, sort of grounds you. Go home east or wherever you live if nothing comes up, let's face it, it can be pretty lonely. Keep educating yourself, it does not have to be aviation related, fork lift or truck driver, whatever. Keep working keep positive and trying. It will happen eventually.
Centaurus looks as though the fellas you helped got lucky to have you as a mentor. If you can find a Mentor it helps too.
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The more adventurous would head north in search of their first job, but don't stop in Darwin; keep heading north in to south east asia where there is still some expansion going on with local airlines. Just in the last month, I came across three young French pilots with FAA licenses in 'Indochina' who scored their first regional airline job with only around 300 hours TT. Admittedly, a lot of luck was involved, and also being at the right place at the right time, and being persistent but patient with the airline management got them a foot in the door.
So next time you're on holidays to places like Laos, Vietnam, Cambodia and Myanmar, bring your CV and license along and some smart casual clothes, and drop in to the regional airline offices. You'll never know your luck.
So next time you're on holidays to places like Laos, Vietnam, Cambodia and Myanmar, bring your CV and license along and some smart casual clothes, and drop in to the regional airline offices. You'll never know your luck.
Dunno about that, matey, when I was looking for my first Aviation job, I didn't have enough money left over to feed myself and put petrol in the car.......and you are suggesting that these kids are holidaying in South East Asia. Seriously?
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Cheaper to fly to SEA than drive all over Australia in my experience. Have you seen the cost of living in Broome/Darwin/etc? With a cheap flight to Bangkok, you can get around on next to nothing. Indo (Susi Air) is even cheaper.
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It should be noted that I have some French friends who when unable to find work had A320 endorsement fully subsidised by the Government.
Also whilst looking for work overseas many of them still receive benefits for unemployment to help fund the trip.
It's a very tough industry at the moment, he with the greatest amount of money wins.
Tell your student if he is still young to go to university and get into Engineering.
Also whilst looking for work overseas many of them still receive benefits for unemployment to help fund the trip.
It's a very tough industry at the moment, he with the greatest amount of money wins.
Tell your student if he is still young to go to university and get into Engineering.
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errm... Pardon?
What for? How did that affect his log book entries?
What for? How did that affect his log book entries?
Thread Starter
So Centaurus, how was the RPM set without a tacho?
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I am an LAME (50 yrs exp) and much of it remote areas maintaining piston aircraft. What you suggest can't be done. You are suggesting that an operator would have an LAME open the instrument and wind it back. Would have to be done in instrument shop.
Total rubbish and libellous!!!
Total rubbish and libellous!!!
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Tell your student if he is still young to go to university and get into Engineering.
My first two jobs were on the east coast, albeit further north than Sydney (not instructing or meat bombing) and my next two were "up north".
As mentioned here and in countless threads, aviation is a matter of networking, being persistent and timing. There is no quick fix, however much you hope and pray. You get lucky quite quickly or you WILL get lucky if you practice patients and don't act like the world owes you something.
One guarantee though, you will not find a job sitting on your derriere and sending out resumes from a capital city.
If you don't have the money to go north now, suck it up, get a job and save some money. Yes it might mean saying no to your mates when they want to hit town and it may mean doing a job you don't particularly like, but it'll get you somewhere where the jobs are.
Also, if you have gone from high school to flying school and never held a job (even if it's making coffee, stacking shelves or delivering pizza) you will find it even more difficult to get a job flying as very few operators want to teach you how to fly their planes AND the realities of working a full time job.
Just my two cents.
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The post was describing events at Ayers Rock 25 years ago. The statement in brackets at the end of paragraph 4 (the company disconnected the tacho most of the time) is not a suggestion, more a statement of fact. I have had personal involvement at that location, so Jack it is verging on libel.
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Well it might change in the summer, but i just did entire QLD coast, 420TT MECIR, G3 instructor. no one was even interested, the given reasons where, no need for pilots, downsizing, loss of contracts, not enough hours(most common). Broom and perth are the same, except its mainly excess pilots. Not a good time to look for work in aus. Especially east coast, but jobs do happen, it cant hurt to try, just be aware, that your probably not even the first guy that day to knock on the door,
The "another kiwi dropping a CV syndrome".
On speaking to some people recently it has come to be noticed that so many operators are so tired of seeing Kiwis hanging around to see the CP that the CV is chucked away as soon as they leave.
How many Aussies do you see flying in NZ we pondered? In the Links a few but in NZ GA you can count them on one hand. Also, when jobs are advertised in NZ it's perfectly clear its for Kiwis only.
On speaking to some people recently it has come to be noticed that so many operators are so tired of seeing Kiwis hanging around to see the CP that the CV is chucked away as soon as they leave.
How many Aussies do you see flying in NZ we pondered? In the Links a few but in NZ GA you can count them on one hand. Also, when jobs are advertised in NZ it's perfectly clear its for Kiwis only.
In my experience the tacho and airswitch on charter aeroplanes work just fine. You just don't use them as everything is done by clock times.
The only time this seems dodgy is for the newly minted CPL engrained in flying school culture in their first job.
Once you move over to something a little bigger, you release they don't even have a tacho or an airswitch. Commercial aviation works on chock and clock times
The only time this seems dodgy is for the newly minted CPL engrained in flying school culture in their first job.
Once you move over to something a little bigger, you release they don't even have a tacho or an airswitch. Commercial aviation works on chock and clock times
Last edited by Blueskymine; 23rd Sep 2014 at 01:30.