Where should Avalon Airshow go?
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Give them a break!
Ian Honnery and his team deserve credit for putting on a fine show for so many years.
It is a venue that has exposed hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of non-aviation punters to our industry in an era where security greatly restricts access to aeroplanes the general public. Plus provided a venue for our local aviation industries to showcase their wares.
yes go to them as well.
Avalon may be a mixed bag. Part trade show & part air show and is certainly not quite in the league of Oshkosk or Farnborough... but as an "every other year" alternate to Singapore they have done a bloody good job for many years.
Airshows are expensive and difficult things to organise! Good on them for their past commitment, and although room for improvement / evolution, hope there are many more to come!
Ian Honnery and his team deserve credit for putting on a fine show for so many years.
It is a venue that has exposed hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of non-aviation punters to our industry in an era where security greatly restricts access to aeroplanes the general public. Plus provided a venue for our local aviation industries to showcase their wares.
"Go to Narromine, Temora, Wanaka, Oshkosh, Farborough etc"
Avalon may be a mixed bag. Part trade show & part air show and is certainly not quite in the league of Oshkosk or Farnborough... but as an "every other year" alternate to Singapore they have done a bloody good job for many years.
Airshows are expensive and difficult things to organise! Good on them for their past commitment, and although room for improvement / evolution, hope there are many more to come!
ASD got the gig as a gift from the Hawke government.
Avalon is money for jam. Mega entry fees. Extraordinary mega site fees for concessions. Granted, there is a cost for bringing out some of the civilian talent, I would be surprised if the military iron is costed. Going by what was supposed to happen at Richmond, the military also have to pay for their fuel.
Staffing is predominantly voluntary, no cost there except freeby clothing if you are lucky enough to score a jacket. They do get a cheesy DVD which is a pretty good insight into the background behind the scenes. The Temora and Tyabb warbirds are conspicuous at times by not attending. Tyabb was there last time....politics?
I am getting at the idea that ASD may well not be the best people for running such a show. Military sales? Where are the Russians and Europeans? Bizjets are well represented. GA and RAAus could be better catered for if ALL aeroplanes were available to the public instead of behind barricades.
Time for some new blood and a different venue. If I was running it, Mangalore would be on the list. Great country venue close to Melbourne and Bendigo as well as the huge population of NE Vic. Albury/Wodonga. The show would have a north south display line with an easterly aspect...photographers would understand...the sun is at the spectator's back so the display is well lit by afternoon sun. There are equally spectacular civilian displays of working aircraft than just military. The only limiting factor for Mangalore would be length and the PCN for the heavier displays. No RPT and no airspace restrictions except those imposed by the fun police. Bottom line? Time for ASD to lose the franchise!
Avalon is money for jam. Mega entry fees. Extraordinary mega site fees for concessions. Granted, there is a cost for bringing out some of the civilian talent, I would be surprised if the military iron is costed. Going by what was supposed to happen at Richmond, the military also have to pay for their fuel.
Staffing is predominantly voluntary, no cost there except freeby clothing if you are lucky enough to score a jacket. They do get a cheesy DVD which is a pretty good insight into the background behind the scenes. The Temora and Tyabb warbirds are conspicuous at times by not attending. Tyabb was there last time....politics?
I am getting at the idea that ASD may well not be the best people for running such a show. Military sales? Where are the Russians and Europeans? Bizjets are well represented. GA and RAAus could be better catered for if ALL aeroplanes were available to the public instead of behind barricades.
Time for some new blood and a different venue. If I was running it, Mangalore would be on the list. Great country venue close to Melbourne and Bendigo as well as the huge population of NE Vic. Albury/Wodonga. The show would have a north south display line with an easterly aspect...photographers would understand...the sun is at the spectator's back so the display is well lit by afternoon sun. There are equally spectacular civilian displays of working aircraft than just military. The only limiting factor for Mangalore would be length and the PCN for the heavier displays. No RPT and no airspace restrictions except those imposed by the fun police. Bottom line? Time for ASD to lose the franchise!
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Re Mangalore. Interesting idea, but I can't see 100,000+ (or whatever the figure is) Melburnians travelling 122kms on average to travel to Mangalore for this airshow. They need those crowd numbers to bring in the required amount of income to support it.
Last edited by VH-XXX; 8th Jan 2013 at 22:11.
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I hope 2015 is not the last event at Avalon.
However, the same speculation has popped up during the last few events.
Maybe it's the LF way of playing a bit of brinkmanship when it comes to negotiating for future events....
At least LF is a bit more subtle with aviation than Clive Palmer is with golf!.
However, the same speculation has popped up during the last few events.
Maybe it's the LF way of playing a bit of brinkmanship when it comes to negotiating for future events....
At least LF is a bit more subtle with aviation than Clive Palmer is with golf!.
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in an era where security greatly restricts access to aeroplanes the general public.
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Well if it goes anywhere else it won't be an Avalon Airshow will it...
The only two airshows I've been to are Avalon and RIAT*. Each is different, both were a good day out, but I don't know if i'd be in a hurry to visit either again soon. Difference is I suppose is that Avalon is 20 minutes away and RIAT is on the other side of the world.
* There appears to be a danger of this becoming a "what o/s shows I've been to thread
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Oshkosh seems to have more "spirit" where people hang around their aircraft and love talking to you about it. In comparison at Avalon is seems only a few hang around them to talk to you which isn't very exciting. Not sure what te difference is really, perhaps the large number of overseas visitors to Oshkosh? But it seems that it's not the GA or RAA lineup that the crowd come to see, it's the Caribou's Blackhawks and fast jets. They grab their spot, park their arses and settle in for the weekend.
Avalon is a general publics airshow.
Oshkosh is an enthusiasts airshow. (By comparison but not in isolation)
Avalon is a general publics airshow.
Oshkosh is an enthusiasts airshow. (By comparison but not in isolation)
Some good things in the works for Avalon this year.
Bigger things in 2015.
Sure it's no Oshkosh but what the hell could be?? Come on guys really!!
We are at the ass end of the Aviation world miles from anywhere, what do you expect??
Oh and if you want to fly in and camp then there is a little strip called Avalon East that will accommodate most if not all GA A/C.
Free shuttle to the show too.
Friends work high up in the show and work their asses off bringing Aircraft and operators to the show from all over so please have a little respect for their work.
Bigger things in 2015.
Sure it's no Oshkosh but what the hell could be?? Come on guys really!!
We are at the ass end of the Aviation world miles from anywhere, what do you expect??
Oh and if you want to fly in and camp then there is a little strip called Avalon East that will accommodate most if not all GA A/C.
Free shuttle to the show too.
Friends work high up in the show and work their asses off bringing Aircraft and operators to the show from all over so please have a little respect for their work.
Last edited by nitpicker330; 9th Jan 2013 at 10:11.
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I expect value for money. I don't care if we are at the arse end, if a decent act can't be got at a reasonable price don't buy it.
I expect some educational seminars, some that I'd pay for, some that should be provided by the tax dollar I'm charged (CASA) and some from the products I've purchased. (Lycoming, Garmin, etc).
I expect that any airshow organiser would look at what's done around the world, take the best parts & improve the product. Not have an almighty god complex about who does what best. Avalon, you don't, far from it.
I expect it to be made easy and cheap for aircraft to fly in, park and camp. When **** loads of lighties are parked in areas the PUNTERS LOVE IT. The non flying public love staring at aeroplanes. I recently did a flight out bush, I made sure I bought the fuel from aerodromes that didn't charge landing fees & approach fees. I spent a bit of money in the towns. I expect the organisers to have the brains to build something so that the punters will come rather than rip pilots off,
Kind of expecting a lot eh? NOT.
I expect some educational seminars, some that I'd pay for, some that should be provided by the tax dollar I'm charged (CASA) and some from the products I've purchased. (Lycoming, Garmin, etc).
I expect that any airshow organiser would look at what's done around the world, take the best parts & improve the product. Not have an almighty god complex about who does what best. Avalon, you don't, far from it.
I expect it to be made easy and cheap for aircraft to fly in, park and camp. When **** loads of lighties are parked in areas the PUNTERS LOVE IT. The non flying public love staring at aeroplanes. I recently did a flight out bush, I made sure I bought the fuel from aerodromes that didn't charge landing fees & approach fees. I spent a bit of money in the towns. I expect the organisers to have the brains to build something so that the punters will come rather than rip pilots off,
Kind of expecting a lot eh? NOT.
Jack. Avalon east is FREE to land at. They will once again have 2 strips available and ATC RFF. What else do you want for free??
The main Rwy 18/36 at YMAV will be way too busy with Airshow traffic and Jetstar RPT movements to let you in there with your bug smasher...fair enough?
Do you have any idea how much people like M Hall and HARS charge to appear?? Thought not.
The guys running the show do work closely with most large Airshows around the world and attend the same shows in a working capacity to both help and learn.
Maybe you could do a better job with the limited budget they have but I doubt it....
The main Rwy 18/36 at YMAV will be way too busy with Airshow traffic and Jetstar RPT movements to let you in there with your bug smasher...fair enough?
Do you have any idea how much people like M Hall and HARS charge to appear?? Thought not.
The guys running the show do work closely with most large Airshows around the world and attend the same shows in a working capacity to both help and learn.
Maybe you could do a better job with the limited budget they have but I doubt it....
Last edited by nitpicker330; 9th Jan 2013 at 11:25.
as an aside....
Quite some years ago I was flying an aircraft that we had exhibited at a small Airshow at Cambridge then took it to Avalon the following weekend. The difference in the crowd behaviour was incredible.
At Cambridge, everyone lined up politely, I let kids sit in the cockpit with their dad, noone touched anything they shouldn't have and everyone was so respectful. One week later after 30 mins of the Avalon folk, noone was let near the cockpit as every second kid - and often their dad - was trying to move the control column, push and pull power levers and flick any switch they could find
A totally different psyche and crowd behaviour.
At Cambridge, everyone lined up politely, I let kids sit in the cockpit with their dad, noone touched anything they shouldn't have and everyone was so respectful. One week later after 30 mins of the Avalon folk, noone was let near the cockpit as every second kid - and often their dad - was trying to move the control column, push and pull power levers and flick any switch they could find
A totally different psyche and crowd behaviour.
Last edited by compressor stall; 9th Jan 2013 at 20:43.
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A totally different psyche and crowd behaviour.
At Oshkosh some 15,000 people camp there and literally hundreds of RV's (campers
) hit the town and the local Kmart car park, now surely they aren't all pilots or aircraft owners? They must be coming to Oshkosh for the people and aircraft, probably meeting up with the same people each year. Unlike Avalon, these visitors have a genuine interest in your aircraft, how it flies, how it was built, how much fuel it uses. At Avalon they just seem to want to press on the fabric, laugh at the rag and tube and see what they can get away with or steal from you!This is not a criticism of Avalon but rather a challenge. I don't know what it would take to change it to be like Oshkosh and I don't believe the organisers would necessarily even want that. It's just an interesting comparison. Maybe it's just the difference in population and in the US there are THAT many more people interested in aircraft?
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A totally different psyche and crowd behaviour.
Critical--- Junket? My mate paid his own airfare on his days off to attend the Airshows in the UK......... has a full time job in the left seat of an A330 and does all the hard work ( CASA Approvals etc ) to run this show on HIS DAYS OFF.....
What do you do mate?
And as for bogans attending Avalon, they're everywhere now, just look around, tatts and thongs everywhere you go in Oz..
has a full time job in the left seat of an A330 and does all the hard work ( CASA Approvals etc ) to run this show on HIS DAYS OFF.....What do you do mate?
And as for bogans attending Avalon, they're everywhere now, just look around, tatts and thongs everywhere you go in Oz..
Last edited by nitpicker330; 9th Jan 2013 at 23:25.
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Nobody is forcing you to go...and based on that contribution better for all if you don't
appols Critical i'll put my glasses back on
Last edited by Avgas172; 10th Jan 2013 at 01:45. Reason: wrong perp.
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To be clear that was Cynical Pilot not me!
well he calls himself critical so I guess the hat fits, I went to Avalon 2011 & had a ball, best part for me was the Redbird Sim. Would be happy to go this year but NW Qld is a bit to far to do it this time.
Nobody is forcing you to go...and based on that contribution better for all if you don't