OzRunways and Jeppensen
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OzRunways and Jeppensen
I have seen people suggest the best iPad EFB would include both OzRunways and Jeppensen FD. Why both? What does Jeppensen FD add to the mix that is absent on OzRunways or a similar product?
Thanks
Dicky
Thanks
Dicky
Essentially, Jeppesen is an IFR product, Ozrunways is a VFR product. Jepp on the iPad gives commonality / back up with other Jepp products. Its free if you have a Jepp subscription. Ozrunways requires a separate subscription.
The Jepp version of the AIP is searchable and easier to use. ERSA on Ozrunways is better / easier than the airport section of Jepp. I prefer the Jepp chart layout, so it wins there too. In my opinion the Jepp app is more stable. It gets better satellite lock and highlights if it loses satellites. Ozrunways can go into a dead reckoning mode where the aircraft icon continues to move without satellite reception or making it obvious that satellites have been lost. I find Ozrunways to be unreliable in the flight levels (on my old iPad 2, havent yet tried the IPad 3). OzRunways can be confusing about which maps are downloaded to the iPad and which are cloud based. Jepp has everything all the time. I think Jepp is a bit more clear about version status.
They're both good products. If I fly VFR, I use Ozrunways. Navigating the terminal area with the aircraft position on VTC is fantastic. IFR I use Jepp. But IFR, I also have Flitedeck on a Motion CL900 tablet and paper charts as well. In the Sim, I just use Jepp on the iPad.
I use a BT GPS unit with the Motion CL900, but not the iPad. I think a lot of my criticisms of Ozrunways on the iPad disappear with an external GPS. I see that Garmin have just released a bluetooth GPS / Glonass unit aimed at aviation which looks like a good thing.
The Jepp version of the AIP is searchable and easier to use. ERSA on Ozrunways is better / easier than the airport section of Jepp. I prefer the Jepp chart layout, so it wins there too. In my opinion the Jepp app is more stable. It gets better satellite lock and highlights if it loses satellites. Ozrunways can go into a dead reckoning mode where the aircraft icon continues to move without satellite reception or making it obvious that satellites have been lost. I find Ozrunways to be unreliable in the flight levels (on my old iPad 2, havent yet tried the IPad 3). OzRunways can be confusing about which maps are downloaded to the iPad and which are cloud based. Jepp has everything all the time. I think Jepp is a bit more clear about version status.
They're both good products. If I fly VFR, I use Ozrunways. Navigating the terminal area with the aircraft position on VTC is fantastic. IFR I use Jepp. But IFR, I also have Flitedeck on a Motion CL900 tablet and paper charts as well. In the Sim, I just use Jepp on the iPad.
I use a BT GPS unit with the Motion CL900, but not the iPad. I think a lot of my criticisms of Ozrunways on the iPad disappear with an external GPS. I see that Garmin have just released a bluetooth GPS / Glonass unit aimed at aviation which looks like a good thing.
Bottums Up
I don't use the GPS functionality other than on the odd occasion for interest sake. I have both Jeppesen FD and OzRunways. I'd be quite pleased if my employer dropped the requirement to use Jeppesen, as then I'd go to OzRunways/AIP solely.
The Jeppesen airways manual is a dogs breakfast. Two separate manuals covering the whole world, so finding what one wants can be quite difficult. It is NOT just an electronic version of the Aus subscription paper airways manual. Further, it doesn't have an amendment list to draw ones attention to changes from one revision to the next!
Despite being almost 2 years old, Jeppesen FD still cannot reliably accept a route entered with airways designators. This is because where a VOR and an NDB share the same identifier, say AS, the FD App defaults to the NDB, which is not part of the airway (the airway using the VOR). For example, instead of being able to enter the route between Alice and Cairns as "AS J64 CS", on has to enter "AS ANZAC J64 BIB CS". AND, there is no save function, so the route has to be typed each time it is used.
Compare this to OzRunways, the AIP is also searchable (though deciding which result is the desired one can be difficult, one can scroll through the pages, note the change bars and therefore easily see what the changes are since the last revision. ERSA is included.
The Jeppesen airways manual is a dogs breakfast. Two separate manuals covering the whole world, so finding what one wants can be quite difficult. It is NOT just an electronic version of the Aus subscription paper airways manual. Further, it doesn't have an amendment list to draw ones attention to changes from one revision to the next!
Despite being almost 2 years old, Jeppesen FD still cannot reliably accept a route entered with airways designators. This is because where a VOR and an NDB share the same identifier, say AS, the FD App defaults to the NDB, which is not part of the airway (the airway using the VOR). For example, instead of being able to enter the route between Alice and Cairns as "AS J64 CS", on has to enter "AS ANZAC J64 BIB CS". AND, there is no save function, so the route has to be typed each time it is used.
Compare this to OzRunways, the AIP is also searchable (though deciding which result is the desired one can be difficult, one can scroll through the pages, note the change bars and therefore easily see what the changes are since the last revision. ERSA is included.
Bottums Up
Technically OZrunways is 'Not for use in Air Navigation'.
Originally Posted by Jepp FD EULA (Found under Settings > Apps > Jepp FD
This application may be used only for flight planning, and situational awareness purposes during flight and must not be used or relied upon to operate or navigate an aircraft or for any other purpose whatsoever.
Last edited by Capt Claret; 14th Jul 2012 at 05:15.
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Free?
Its free if you have a Jepp subscription
I downloaded the "JeppTC" App for free but an electronic charting subscription serial number is needed to activate the App.
Is this included with my paper Jeppesen subscription service? If not, how much does this cost in addition to the paper service?
Thanks,
PG
Bottums Up
Jepp TC & Jepp FD are free Apps. To load the charts however, one must have a subscription to JeppView. Subscribing to a Jeppesen paper service and JeppView would aproximately double the subscription charge of only one service.
My company has a subscription to Jepp View...I don't suppose I am able to use that to gain access???
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My understanding is that the feds will approve an application to use IPad as an electronic document READER for Jepp products. It cannot be used for navigation and there is some scuttlebutt about that Ozrunways may be about to start having problems with Airservices over copyright or some other issue. Dont quote me on that as my info is second hand.
Ozrunways may be about to start having problems with Airservices over copyright or some other issue. Dont quote me on that as my info is second hand.
The FAA HAS approved IPad with Jepps as sole navigation reference for a number of airlines on the basis that the co-pilots iPad backs up the captains one. I think the count is 4 airlines however, I'm not sure, but I think there are a number of corporate operators as well. Its been widely reported on AVWEB.
Jeppview is a subscribed service that updates every two weeks vs. three months for AIPs. When you obtain a Jeppview subscription you still recieve paper maps, terminal area charts and have to print what you intend to be using for each flight. Don't think the company will want you pinching their maps from the library, Popgun.
Considering issues such as the notam about Broome airspace being incorrectly printed on Airservices maps, (just been issued so we're stuck with them for another 5 months), how exactly are you supposed to amend them? What about WAC amendments?
Starting to see why Ozrunways (and don't get me wrong, it is a fantastic program) can't be used for sole reference?
As for the copyright infringements, noticed this at the beginning of AIC H74/11;
Considering issues such as the notam about Broome airspace being incorrectly printed on Airservices maps, (just been issued so we're stuck with them for another 5 months), how exactly are you supposed to amend them? What about WAC amendments?
Starting to see why Ozrunways (and don't get me wrong, it is a fantastic program) can't be used for sole reference?
As for the copyright infringements, noticed this at the beginning of AIC H74/11;
MANUSCRIPT AMENDMENTS Information Effective 17/11/2011
1. Add following additional words “, republished or“ after “redistributed,” in copyright note.
© AIRSERVICES AUSTRALIA
This publication is copyright. Unless specified otherwise, you may use this publication only for information purposes. Except as permitted by the Copyright Act 1968, no part of this publication may be reproduced, stored in a retrieval system, transmitted, redistributed, republished or commercially exploited in any way without the prior written permission of Airservices Australia. If you wish to use any part of this publication in any way not permitted by this notice, contact Airservices Australia Publications about a licence.
1. Add following additional words “, republished or“ after “redistributed,” in copyright note.
© AIRSERVICES AUSTRALIA
This publication is copyright. Unless specified otherwise, you may use this publication only for information purposes. Except as permitted by the Copyright Act 1968, no part of this publication may be reproduced, stored in a retrieval system, transmitted, redistributed, republished or commercially exploited in any way without the prior written permission of Airservices Australia. If you wish to use any part of this publication in any way not permitted by this notice, contact Airservices Australia Publications about a licence.
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Do these airlines with iPads use any form of moving map (like Jepp FD) with a bluetooth GPS?
QANTAS has decided (after extensive testing - with no published or freely available results) that bluetooth (~GPS) on the flight deck only interfere with navigation instruments, and therefore can't be used. Bluetooth in the cabin for the use of 200-400 odd people is however perfectly acceptable.
As you can imaging such results may be perfectly true - and it is their train set as such - but given it is not banned throughout the cabin - one would possibly be a little skeptical about the validity of the testing.
QANTAS has decided (after extensive testing - with no published or freely available results) that bluetooth (~GPS) on the flight deck only interfere with navigation instruments, and therefore can't be used. Bluetooth in the cabin for the use of 200-400 odd people is however perfectly acceptable.
As you can imaging such results may be perfectly true - and it is their train set as such - but given it is not banned throughout the cabin - one would possibly be a little skeptical about the validity of the testing.
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Bluetooth in the cabin for the use of 200-400 odd people is however perfectly acceptable.
Wi-Fi interference with Honeywell avionics prompts Boeing action
Do these airlines with iPads use any form of moving map (like Jepp FD) with a bluetooth GPS?
I hate the slothfulness of blanket statements such as "interferes with navigation instruments" What? How? Is this the mobile phone myth all over again? It took a properly conducted study in the British Medical Journal to debunk that for medical equipment, what does it take here? If Qantas really did a proper study and it found adverse effects, wouldn't it be unethical bordering on unconscionable not to share those results with the aviation community in order to improve safety? If the "Navigation Instruments"are really that susceptible to interference from Bluetooth, then there is a whole lot of other EMI in the big bad world that is potentially a bigger problem.
Lets just remember that the bulk of airliners flying are still pre-glass cockpits. Some are still pre-GPS. The navigation instruments on these rely mainly on gyro's & wires.
