That first job up north
The fact is a new pilot doesn't have to fly crap aircraft, put up with shonky bosses and earn peanuts. If you don't like a job or operator then don't apply. My first aviation job was flying brand new aircraft and payed above award. It also happened to have generous conditions and decent management. I knew where I wanted to work and at the time It was the first and only flying job I had applied for.
I had a well paying job and wasn't going to leave it for just any old operator. I was told I would be exploited etc. But it hasn't happened yet, and if it ever came to that I would seek work in another industry. It works both ways. Make your own informed decisions, don't let others dictate them for you.
I had a well paying job and wasn't going to leave it for just any old operator. I was told I would be exploited etc. But it hasn't happened yet, and if it ever came to that I would seek work in another industry. It works both ways. Make your own informed decisions, don't let others dictate them for you.
Mike it really sounds like you have zero experience in the real world, let alone aviation.
I'm not going to address the moving up north portion because people a lot more qualified to respond to this have already done so.
There are very few jobs out there, professional or otherwise, that do not require hard work (if you want to move up) and sacrifice, on very mediocre salaries.
Your perspective seems to be of a typical gen-Y, still firmly attached to mummies teet, brat who thinks the world is really as they see it while mooching off mum and dad in your city or suburban home.
How about we change scenario (read: perspective) a little.
Take someone who has grown up in the country, they love the country and couldn't think of anything more vile than living in an unfriendly, anonymous, grey concrete jungle; But they have a driving passion for computers, they know the job opportunities for IT just aren't there where they live, let alone educational institutes that can train them in the subject to a level that would make them employable.
Well, that gives them two choices.
1. move to somewhere that will offer the training and some job opportunities
2. do something they don't really want to do, nor have the passion for, for the rest of their life and always have that burning desire to do what makes them happy.
So the person decides to take the plunge, moves to a capital city, spends 4 years earning a degree and then walks out with a massive HECS debt and a bit of paper that qualifies them for nothing more than a minimum wage graduates position, where they are no more than a dogs body for the first year or two until they truly prove themselves. A job that all the other graduates from his course and other courses like it are vying for.
All of this could be likened to what pilots do, aviation is not an exception to the rule here. It may be "degrading", it may be hard, but the people that have gone through it and have come out the other end are all the better for it.
Now as for you, take it, leave it, I don't care, but if you decide to go for it, get ready to take a cup of concrete and HTFU princess, because this is the real world!
I'm not going to address the moving up north portion because people a lot more qualified to respond to this have already done so.
There are very few jobs out there, professional or otherwise, that do not require hard work (if you want to move up) and sacrifice, on very mediocre salaries.
Your perspective seems to be of a typical gen-Y, still firmly attached to mummies teet, brat who thinks the world is really as they see it while mooching off mum and dad in your city or suburban home.
How about we change scenario (read: perspective) a little.
Take someone who has grown up in the country, they love the country and couldn't think of anything more vile than living in an unfriendly, anonymous, grey concrete jungle; But they have a driving passion for computers, they know the job opportunities for IT just aren't there where they live, let alone educational institutes that can train them in the subject to a level that would make them employable.
Well, that gives them two choices.
1. move to somewhere that will offer the training and some job opportunities
2. do something they don't really want to do, nor have the passion for, for the rest of their life and always have that burning desire to do what makes them happy.
So the person decides to take the plunge, moves to a capital city, spends 4 years earning a degree and then walks out with a massive HECS debt and a bit of paper that qualifies them for nothing more than a minimum wage graduates position, where they are no more than a dogs body for the first year or two until they truly prove themselves. A job that all the other graduates from his course and other courses like it are vying for.
All of this could be likened to what pilots do, aviation is not an exception to the rule here. It may be "degrading", it may be hard, but the people that have gone through it and have come out the other end are all the better for it.
Now as for you, take it, leave it, I don't care, but if you decide to go for it, get ready to take a cup of concrete and HTFU princess, because this is the real world!
Thread Starter
you seem to have misread what I have written. My point was that the guys with the 2000 hours and a stack of multi time are being IGNORED by the airlines in favour of kids fresh out of high school with no flying experience at all.
I know a few from GA with over 3000 hours and 1000 hours multi and airlines havent given them a look. i know a couple who have been given cadetships (by rex and qlink) who of course had no or very minimal experience.
i am questioning whether GA is really the way to go given the fact that there are countless guys from GA with mountans of experience that the airlines dont seem to want and guys with absolutely nothing that the airlines accept and train from scratch...
I know a few from GA with over 3000 hours and 1000 hours multi and airlines havent given them a look. i know a couple who have been given cadetships (by rex and qlink) who of course had no or very minimal experience.
i am questioning whether GA is really the way to go given the fact that there are countless guys from GA with mountans of experience that the airlines dont seem to want and guys with absolutely nothing that the airlines accept and train from scratch...
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"stack of multi" well then best be handing u the keys to the millenium falcon...
I knocked in a "stack" of nails on the weekend - does that make me a carpenter?
What about the guy from school who never lifted a hammer in his life but has just signed up to a 4 year apprenticeship in carpentry?
I wrote a whole lot more only to delete it cause I'm sure ur fishing and I cbf trying to make my stupid analogy make sense... Besides noone is this naive... Go north have fun become a true territorian or whatever... Just don't forget the grey cardboard...
I knocked in a "stack" of nails on the weekend - does that make me a carpenter?
What about the guy from school who never lifted a hammer in his life but has just signed up to a 4 year apprenticeship in carpentry?
I wrote a whole lot more only to delete it cause I'm sure ur fishing and I cbf trying to make my stupid analogy make sense... Besides noone is this naive... Go north have fun become a true territorian or whatever... Just don't forget the grey cardboard...
Thread Starter
stack of multi = 500+ hours.
so im guessing you are favouring airline cadetships which dont require ANY multi....?
and what do you mean grey cardboard? i dont follow...
so im guessing you are favouring airline cadetships which dont require ANY multi....?
and what do you mean grey cardboard? i dont follow...
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you seem to have misread what I have written. My point was that the guys with the 2000 hours and a stack of multi time are being IGNORED by the airlines in favour of kids fresh out of high school with no flying experience at all.
You sound like a concerned parent not a wannabe pilot.
Am wondering why so many people refer to "Up North" etc as "the Middle of No where" etc
Kununurra, Broome, Jabiru and and most smaller towns you care to name all have post office, pubs, restaurants, supermarkets and sports clubs and the like.
They even have an art gallery or two!
What is the big deal about where one lives? Surely it is the people around you that make life interesting.
Most times one meets folks through their work anyway, so wouldn't have though it really matters where an individual resides.
Kununurra, Broome, Jabiru and and most smaller towns you care to name all have post office, pubs, restaurants, supermarkets and sports clubs and the like.
They even have an art gallery or two!
What is the big deal about where one lives? Surely it is the people around you that make life interesting.
Most times one meets folks through their work anyway, so wouldn't have though it really matters where an individual resides.
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Remember that other than post war, until 2007 there hadn't been a time when pilots got into an airline with less than 5000hours.
A few stick in my mind, none more so that the guy taking an offer from a major airline... it was conditional though. Subject to his passing a CPL.
This would have been in the '70s, he is still there and captaining large airliners.
My understanding was that there was a least one glitch, missing out on the CPL flight test. ooopps.
I can also remember the crazy period of 1986 to 1989 when expansion was in full swing. Some of the guys of that era will have huge smiles on their faces when they trot out their experiences.
I have a feeling we may be hearing some here soon.
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Hey mate, I agree with most of the comments people have said so far. Just a quick word of advice - if up north isn't that attractive for you, travel somewhere else.. My first job was in central queensland, and my second job was spotting whalesharks/shagging backpackers in Western Australia. Both for questionable pay, but awesome fun. Australia is a big place. Btw, I am working flying 310's in NT and have loved every minute of it. Peace 
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my second job was spotting whalesharks/shagging backpackers in Western Australia. Both for questionable pay
I reckon he probably had his fair share of shagging backpackers that looked like whale sharks too, 
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When I said it was questionable, I just meant it wasn't a large amount of money. Wouldn't have kept working there if the pay was below board/dodgy.
Out of interest, how much did the second part of that job pay, and what were the conditions?
It's all changed now, but the conditions were good and the pay varied depending on how busy we were.
I reckon he probably had his fair share of shagging backpackers that looked like whale sharks too,
Any port in a storm I always say..
Out of interest, how much did the second part of that job pay, and what were the conditions?
It's all changed now, but the conditions were good and the pay varied depending on how busy we were.
I reckon he probably had his fair share of shagging backpackers that looked like whale sharks too,
Any port in a storm I always say..
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It's not what you know it's who you meet.
Become likable, remain respectful (which some time means putting up with the crap shoved down your throat)
I'm about to be in the same boat as most people battling the NT looking for work so can hardly give advice in regards to aviation... but I'm slightly older then most kids looking for their 1st flying job and have had plenty of exp working bloody hard for next to nothing.
Slow down, be persistant, don't be afraid of rejection, make yourself known in the community your looking to work in (small things like go running at 7am in the morning near the operatator... you might get noticed, first impressions .....etc )
If your sensitive to living conditions or low pay or grumpy CP's... join the army, learn to take crap, sense or urgency.... all that stuff.
It usually helps if your training is self funded.... something changes in a person when he/she has spent years working 2 jobs to pay for their flying.... if at the very least you know how to live on $15 a day
Become likable, remain respectful (which some time means putting up with the crap shoved down your throat)
I'm about to be in the same boat as most people battling the NT looking for work so can hardly give advice in regards to aviation... but I'm slightly older then most kids looking for their 1st flying job and have had plenty of exp working bloody hard for next to nothing.
Slow down, be persistant, don't be afraid of rejection, make yourself known in the community your looking to work in (small things like go running at 7am in the morning near the operatator... you might get noticed, first impressions .....etc )
If your sensitive to living conditions or low pay or grumpy CP's... join the army, learn to take crap, sense or urgency.... all that stuff.
It usually helps if your training is self funded.... something changes in a person when he/she has spent years working 2 jobs to pay for their flying.... if at the very least you know how to live on $15 a day
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at the very least you know how to live on $15 a day
And looks like it's finally gonna pay off
yey
I don't know about you guys but being a young man it sounds to me like the great adventure I'm looking for.
It's gotta be so more fun than flying for an airline !
I know some people would say it's bad for pilot's futur to take a badly paid job; and I would agree with them, but I wouldn't mind spending my time cleaning planes, taking care of things plus flying and not being paid a lot.
When I was younger I use to sleep on my aeroclub's couch,cleaning planes,answering the phone...for free of course...and it felt great.
I know one day I might have to change my mind but right now I'm just in because I love aviation.
And I know it's gonna be tough.But...looking for a pilot's job in Northern Australia...damn... I had worst
.. And if I get one of those job....men...I'm gonna be so happy
And somehow it's good that people can hire someone without many rules.
Because if there are to many rules, they just don't hire.
In some country you can't even run a buziness like those in the NT.
So if you wanna be a pilot there is only one way. Witch is having a CPL/IR/ME/ATPL. And when you are self funded (
), it's... very difficult.Anyway... I just wanted to say, that sometime soon I might be heading North too, and personnaly, I'm really looking forward to it.
Just to add something positive in this thread.
Cheers everyone
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It usually helps if your training is self funded.... something changes in a person when he/she has spent years working 2 jobs to pay for their flying
Turban, that's got to be one of the worst wind-up posts I've ever read.
Nice try though.
morno
Nice try though.
morno
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Brian Abraham
agreeed mate, completely...... nothing wrong with those who have a bit of help from the olds.
There just seems to be a few among the many who expect everything on a golden platter, yesterday.
Some of these people might find it difficult to get that initial job.
Though there have been tales told of dad being a training captain with an airline who might be able to put in a good word for that CP who is looking at possible career advance....
but in the end what ever works really...
agreeed mate, completely...... nothing wrong with those who have a bit of help from the olds.
There just seems to be a few among the many who expect everything on a golden platter, yesterday.
Some of these people might find it difficult to get that initial job.
Though there have been tales told of dad being a training captain with an airline who might be able to put in a good word for that CP who is looking at possible career advance....
but in the end what ever works really...
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up North
I've never understood why it is that the colloquialism 'up North' seems to end at the Australian coastline. Northern Australia has been done to death. It's fine for a holiday but terribly lacking in imagination and initiative.
Why not go waaay up North.
Go to places where the only maps that you can find were printed before you were born and still have large blank sections that say "Terrain relief unknown", where local knowledge can't be found in a book but will keep you alive, where an English speaking white man is still a curiosity, where the living is primitive, where flying is still dangerous and where the scenery and the weather defies imagination.
Such places do still exist, though the world is rapidly shrinking.
A CPL is a ticket to adventure. Just be prepared for no one in isolationist Australia to believe your stories. You can also expect scenario based airline interviewers to look like this.
Why not go waaay up North.
Go to places where the only maps that you can find were printed before you were born and still have large blank sections that say "Terrain relief unknown", where local knowledge can't be found in a book but will keep you alive, where an English speaking white man is still a curiosity, where the living is primitive, where flying is still dangerous and where the scenery and the weather defies imagination.
Such places do still exist, though the world is rapidly shrinking.
A CPL is a ticket to adventure. Just be prepared for no one in isolationist Australia to believe your stories. You can also expect scenario based airline interviewers to look like this.