Is it just me or...?
Thread Starter
Is it just me or...?
I am a SEP PPL lapsed (Cutlass/Warrior etc) who used to fly just enough hours to stay dangerous. I recently paid for a sightseeing jolly ride (lets not discuss who or where) and was quite surprised at the way the professional pilot flew. Fired it up, taxied, dropped flap, power on in the turn and away. He was clearly very competent and I in no way felt at risk but I had to compare with my own typical flights: Pax briefing, after start checks inc dead mag cut, taxi to run-up point, mag drop, cycle prop & operate/set all controls with memorised check list, taxi to hold, TO briefing with speeds, line up & check DI / compass before applying power. Check list after TO. In fairness, I know he did many of these things unobtrusively but certainly not all of them. And yes, I have had people behind me keying their mics (which flusters me and makes me start all over again..!)
So, was I working in another world where I did all the checks etc. but in the real world people leave half the stuff out?
So, was I working in another world where I did all the checks etc. but in the real world people leave half the stuff out?
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Hey james ozzie, almost sounds like you flew with me, lol.
I think you'll find the pilot did all run up checks and engine warm prior to your arrival, most operators i know will do one run up at the start of the day.
Knox.
I think you'll find the pilot did all run up checks and engine warm prior to your arrival, most operators i know will do one run up at the start of the day.
Knox.
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Hi Ozzie,
Don't worry, keep flying the way you are. As a PPL it is best to be conservative and stay safe. The pilot who did your scenic probably knew the aircraft and airspace like the back of his hand was probably just a run of the mill flight for him. Maybe some mag checks had already been done that day but it is fair to expect them to be done before every take-off as some aircraft don't take much to foul up. He may have known the checklist by heart but again it is fair to expect a proper checklist to be used.
Don't worry, keep flying the way you are. As a PPL it is best to be conservative and stay safe. The pilot who did your scenic probably knew the aircraft and airspace like the back of his hand was probably just a run of the mill flight for him. Maybe some mag checks had already been done that day but it is fair to expect them to be done before every take-off as some aircraft don't take much to foul up. He may have known the checklist by heart but again it is fair to expect a proper checklist to be used.
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Agreed,
In the scenic charter ops all the run ups and checks are done prior to the punters arrival so if there is a problem it can be fixed or the aircraft swapped prior to the scheduled departure. I used to still do a quick L & R check prior to lining up as part of my generic TIMPFISH check as I once had a mag failure in a twin which checked fine on the run ups but failed on the taxi out to the runway.
This is also why a PPL up the front can be a hindrance to a commercial flight and start unfair and untruthful rumours about a CPL or the CPL's organization.
I've had PPL's question me in front of the other punters why I am not marking my position on a map at the required intervals (Flying a multi engine IFR charter) and I've had them go bazerk for flying in cloud.
Sometimes it was a nice experience sharing your love of flying with them and explaining what your bells and whistles did, other times it was a down right nuisance (especially when they wanted to have a fly)
Having said that I had a QF 744 skipper and his family once on board and he was very interested in the airvan I was flying and was sitting in the right seat. I offered him the controls and let him fly for the rest of the flight (as it was him and his family on board) He thanked me at the end and said he had not had that much fun flying in 20 years and was now considering buying a lighty for family trips. I got a nice tip at the end of it too
GG
In the scenic charter ops all the run ups and checks are done prior to the punters arrival so if there is a problem it can be fixed or the aircraft swapped prior to the scheduled departure. I used to still do a quick L & R check prior to lining up as part of my generic TIMPFISH check as I once had a mag failure in a twin which checked fine on the run ups but failed on the taxi out to the runway.
This is also why a PPL up the front can be a hindrance to a commercial flight and start unfair and untruthful rumours about a CPL or the CPL's organization.
I've had PPL's question me in front of the other punters why I am not marking my position on a map at the required intervals (Flying a multi engine IFR charter) and I've had them go bazerk for flying in cloud.
Sometimes it was a nice experience sharing your love of flying with them and explaining what your bells and whistles did, other times it was a down right nuisance (especially when they wanted to have a fly)
Having said that I had a QF 744 skipper and his family once on board and he was very interested in the airvan I was flying and was sitting in the right seat. I offered him the controls and let him fly for the rest of the flight (as it was him and his family on board) He thanked me at the end and said he had not had that much fun flying in 20 years and was now considering buying a lighty for family trips. I got a nice tip at the end of it too
GG
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james ozzie, keep sticking to the way you do your checks. What your doing is excellent and you should not change it.
I must agree with GG though. The plane would have most definately been pre-flighted and engine runs carried out prior to your arrival. A commercial pilot in his situation would be doing that flight 3-4 times a day if not more. Even if he/she has only been there 3 months thats alot of flying. It's not complacency, it is confidence and knowledge that has come from repeating procedures many times in a short period of time. There is alot to be said for a pilot with 500hrs that has accrued that time in the last 6 months, and a pilot with 800-1000hrs that has accrued it over 5-10 years.
Another point I must agree with GG on is the PPL pax that try and big note themselves to them friends (am in no way implying that this is you james ozzie
). They are a downright pain in the 
just so they can talk themselves up. A smooth flight and good landing normally has their mates/spouse giving them **** about all those hard landings. The stammering responses are music to the CPL's ears.
Some are ws, others are genuinly good people that are just curious about how we do things.
I must agree with GG though. The plane would have most definately been pre-flighted and engine runs carried out prior to your arrival. A commercial pilot in his situation would be doing that flight 3-4 times a day if not more. Even if he/she has only been there 3 months thats alot of flying. It's not complacency, it is confidence and knowledge that has come from repeating procedures many times in a short period of time. There is alot to be said for a pilot with 500hrs that has accrued that time in the last 6 months, and a pilot with 800-1000hrs that has accrued it over 5-10 years.
Another point I must agree with GG on is the PPL pax that try and big note themselves to them friends (am in no way implying that this is you james ozzie
). They are a downright pain in the just so they can talk themselves up. A smooth flight and good landing normally has their mates/spouse giving them **** about all those hard landings. The stammering responses are music to the CPL's ears. Some are ws, others are genuinly good people that are just curious about how we do things.
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Hi james ozzie, your pre-take off system appears to neglect the use of a written checklist to confirm your memory items, prior to take off. Only referring to same after take off. Why is that?
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I agree with most of the comments so far. If you got on an IFR charter with me flying, the only things you'd really notice me doing after start would be things I couldn't have done before your arrival. You'll obviously notice me doing a control check on the taxi out to the runway, a few items related to the airways clearance (setting AAI, inputting data into GPS etc.) and the usual flicking of switches - but all the main stuff is done before you arrive, e.g. runups, radio and navaid setup, trims etc. All checklists are completed, but generally on the move. There's nothing wrong at all with sitting in the runup bay with a printed checklist on your lap, and if you're relatively inexperienced it's almost certainly the best way to do things - but this isn't the way it's normally done in charter ops, where block-to-block time is all-important. Note, this isn't to say safety or accuracy is compromised in any way - but when you fly 10-20 of these sectors a week, you start to develop an efficient way of doing things that to some onlookers may seem rushed or insufficient.
Thread Starter
Thanks everyone for the informative responses.
tio540: to clarify, the checklists were all memorised (by mnemonic/nursery rhyme etc) as required by the flight school. The written version of the check lists was not used, though handy in the flight bag/on clip-board in case of memory "freeze".
tio540: to clarify, the checklists were all memorised (by mnemonic/nursery rhyme etc) as required by the flight school. The written version of the check lists was not used, though handy in the flight bag/on clip-board in case of memory "freeze".
During the cruise on a charter a private pilot sitting in row 2 behind me reach over the right hand seat and plugged his headset in without asking!
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During the cruise on a charter a private pilot sitting in row 2 behind me reach over the right hand seat and plugged his headset in without asking!
dont forget to delouse it.FRQ CB
Sprucegoose
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Fired it up, taxied, dropped flap, power on in the turn and away.
PS: Would like to know did he do a passenger brief?
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During the cruise on a charter a private pilot sitting in row 2 behind me reach over the right hand seat and plugged his headset in without asking!
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Turn off the intercom or put it on isolate 
You always know when you've got a PPL beside you (even if they don't make it known before the flight) when they have paid top money for a scenic flight and spend more time watching you like a hawk than they do looking out the window.
ummm...mixture 
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You always know when you've got a PPL beside you (even if they don't make it known before the flight) when they have paid top money for a scenic flight and spend more time watching you like a hawk than they do looking out the window.
Not forgetting the ones who wear their ASIC when they are being picked up at a dirt strip in the middle of nowhere