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Mega Merged: REX Recruitment/Cadetship and Working for REX

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Mega Merged: REX Recruitment/Cadetship and Working for REX

Old 16th Nov 2007, 10:02
  #61 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Australia
Posts: 151
Military time does not count for much nowadays.

The Japanese airlines via Parc recruiting even specify that in their ads now.

Position:
2 Crew Turbo Prop Captains For Dash 8-Q400

Experience/ Skills:
ATPL Licence

Details:
W A N T E D : 2 CREW TURBO-PROP CAPTAINS TO FLY DASH 8-Q400

Parc Aviation on behalf of our client Air Nippon Network (A-net) are recruiting Rated and Non Rated Captains to be trained and type rated on to the Dash 8-Q400. This is a three year assignment commencing March 2007. Selection will commence November 2007. Excellent Terms and Conditions for this assignment apply.

Please be advise we are not recruiting First Officers for this phase of screening.

Should you wish to apply you must satisfy the following minimum requirements:

- Totals flight time in excess of 3000 hours (including 1500hrs of PIC time. ½ (one half) of co-pilot time is calculated as PIC time) PLUS 500 PIC hours on 2 man commercial turboprop aircraft.

- No helicopter time, no military time to be included in total hours

- Valid Class 1 Medical

- Valid ICAO ATPL

- Licence must display current ‘2 man turboprop type rating’.

Please quote FC1196 on all correspondence

Location:
Japan
Type (perm/con):
Contract

Duration:
3 1/2 Year Contract (Renewable)

Start Date:
March 2008

Contact:
Jacquei Breslin
Ph: +353-1-8161747
Fax: +353-1-8161711
Email: [email protected]
Captahab is offline  
Old 16th Nov 2007, 11:15
  #62 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Asia
Posts: 86
UrlocalAZn,
Weird? Not at all. Infact, I've averaged 300hrs per year on helo. By the way, who said the boys were still in the military? Joined up to fly with CPL in tow, things didn't work out on Pilot's course, and that was that.

Remember, it's quality not quantity.
"Littlebird" is offline  
Old 16th Nov 2007, 12:56
  #63 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: On the water
Posts: 602
Sorry to defer from the subject, but why wouldn't military time count??? Training is usually much more intense and more emphasis on stick and rudder as well as flying more complex types.

Could this maybe be just the asian airlines? As I know Korean and JAL had some cowboy pilots scare the out of passengers..
WannaBeBiggles is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2007, 01:18
  #64 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Alice Springs
Posts: 1,744
Why not military?

The military teach things other than flying, which are necessary for military life, and much of it is not compatible with civilian life.
bushy is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2007, 04:18
  #65 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: NSW
Posts: 6
rex cadetship

Hey guys,
First ever blog, thought id throw my two bobs in about the rex cadetship.

I applied by filling out the application form about a month ago and got called up on Wednesday asking if i could come in for a interview in the next day or two.(It must be noted i never sent my HSC results in, only ever filled out their form)

Down I went, with a negative view of their cadetship (attitude formed from this site and other student pilots) but thinking the testing/interview would be a good experiance for other airlines/jobs etc.

Im 20, got gfpt and less then 30 hours, one cpl subject, studying full time, expect to complete cpl/atpl/irex and multi in the next year. i got the impression i was the type of demographic they are after.
(in 2005 i recieved UAI of 79, HR chick thought that was good, so that tells you what type of brains they are after)

I left believing what they are offering isnt as bad as some people without the full knowledge are making it out to be. I was interviewed for more then an hour by the senior pilot and a senior HR chick.

The 80k is a one off cost, includes everything such as lodgeing, food, casa and medical fees, text books and documents. Includes cpl and irex on brand new full glass cockpit warrior3s, and a multi. After the 32 odd weeks, right hand seat in a aircraft in the rex GROUP, if you want to know their wages look up the REX pilot agreement on google. Im currently studying full time and expect to pay around 65k including atpl- i believe the other 15grand isnt a major rip off (considering the average outlay is around 2K before a student start flying - medicals, license, headset, books/documents, plus ongoing living and eating and travel costs, and then start looking for work...)Also, cadets with some of the above (like myself) wont have to pay the full 80k.

The training is "acadamy style" similar to boarding school/military. The training will be a crash course, without much opportunity to kick back, which is logical, and you will be trained the way they want you to be, which also makes sense.

a few questions i asked is how do rex promote FO to Captains, and was told about the seniority system, and how currently it takes about "12 to 18"months to be offered captain. Im assuming those pilots had enough before the joined to make it to the 2000 hours in that time... Can anyone in the know vouch for that time frame?

Also not really mentioned is that Rex will be offering 20k scholarships (to 10 out of 20 cadets). the only catch is this will be repaid if leaving the company before serving 5 or 6 years, cant remember which.

And ATPL isnt being offered at the moment as its not a priority, however will be offered later.

This would be an awesome opportunity if a student had a lazy 80k lying around as it would be a quick training period and then gauranteed hours in twins. For me personally, if i was offered the cadetship(and after considering it VERY carefully), i may not be able to afford it as im paying for my training at the moment but will have to borrow, beg and perhaps steal to complete it all.

Something else i found out from one of their prospectus lying around their offices was that the rex group made a profit of 25 mil last year, up a lazy 54%... so maybe there is room to be paying pilots more????

Anyways, im sure ive left lots of stuff out, but will be interested to hear what you guys all think.

thanks
anon121 is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2007, 16:12
  #66 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Sydney
Posts: 819
I really hope that your phrase
crash course
is NOT accurate.
apache is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2007, 01:47
  #67 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NOne
Posts: 20
anon121:
The 20k scholarships will be offered to ALL 20 cadets accepted for the 1st batch.
cx587 is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2007, 06:15
  #68 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 2,069
anon121.

The 8th paragraph in your post goes to the heart of the problem.

Flying training has always been expensive. Hideously expensive for that matter. Relatively speaking, it no worse today than it has always been. Why then is the industry in this situation, and why does an operator like REX need to go down this path?

What REX has offered is not unreasonable except for one undeniable fact. You will be shackled to them for a long period of time on what is essentially less than street sweepers wages, (certainly no offence to those hard working people as I used to do it myself!), with very dubious prospect of advancement within REX itself. The minimum qualification for command at REX is...
  • Class 1 ATPL
  • 500 hours multi-engine command under the IFR of which 150 may be ICUS
These are the REGs and any changes to these are for CASA to make. I can assure you that although these requirements may be different under the proposed MPL course, it is still some time off, and is not what is being proposed here.

The mention of the REX seniority system is a furfi'. It is part of the industrial agreement and all REX pilots are covered by it. To even bring it up suggests to me that it may have been used to deflect attention. The reality is that at the moment commands at REX are running to less than 12 months! With the company losing captains virtually by the week, this short timeframe will continue into the future. As a graduated Cadet you will not be entitled to command untill you have satified the above legal requirements.

As a result, you will be bypassed.

The hours in your logbook whilst serving as a Saab F/O will not move you any closer to the legal requirement.

The major airlines also require at least a Class 1 ATPL and the minimum command time, nominally 500 hours for a first officers position. Not surprising as they are not interested in candidates that cannot be upgrade when the time comes.

The problem for REX and all it's employees is, what happens when the seniority list moves down to the next candidate, and they do not meet the legal min requirement for command? This will undoubtably leed to further contraction of the business. It will come to point that the viability of REX itself will come into question. Aother consideration before parting with large sums of cash!

the REX cadetship will, provided you pass the process, give you a garenteed path into the industry. But at what cost? You owe it to yourselves to ask the question. Where will this put me in the future?
KRUSTY 34 is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2007, 07:17
  #69 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Alice Springs
Posts: 1,744
DEC?

Does this system put them in a position where they are compelled to take direct entry captains?
Is it the start of the erosion of the seniority system?
bushy is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2007, 07:40
  #70 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Living next door to Alan
Posts: 1,522
Smile

Not yet, Bushy. We have just put an EBA through which retains seniority. I suspect that if the company wants to put that one through next time it would require a huge trade-off on its behalf. Hence the reason it never popped up on the table this time.

In fact, I think that no proposed trade-off would ever get up in my company. Sacrosanct springs to mind, regardless of IR laws.
Hugh Jarse is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2007, 07:48
  #71 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 1998
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 601
bushy.............

Good question! Buggered if I know.

But, if you carefully 'digest' KRUSTY's last post, then I reckon the answer's got to be YES to DECs (provided that you're prepared to take all the supposed sh1t that the REX C&T system throws at its crews with respect to a simple turboprop aircraft).

Particularly if you've got an ATPL, you're >60, you're looking for a nice little retirement job, you've got command time on high capacity aircraft (turboprop and/or jet), and you can put up with the crap.

Personally, I couldn't be bothered.

EDIT: Hugh...............we 'crossed' each other with our posts!

With (now) the benefit of hindsight having read your post re the EBA, I retract my statement re the 'YES' relating to DECs.
SIUYA is offline  
Old 18th Nov 2007, 08:11
  #72 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 2,069
The option of direct entry captains has always been available during periods of exceptional circumstances. These can range from the introduction of a new type, to the almost farsical situation that REX finds itself in today.

Under the current industrial agreement it would require the permission of the majority of the pilot group. Faced with the real threat of the business collapsing, the negotiations for such a move would be welcomed by the pilots.

Please note the term negotiation, because that is what it would be. The company will have no currency to try and impose any sort of "solution" without input from the wider pilot body.

Some issues will very quickly arise.
  • Type rated and experienced captains would be a pre-requesite
  • The remuneration package required to attract these rare birds will be somewhat higher than what current serving captains are being paid!
  • The remuneration package for DEC's will have to be incorporated into the existing package for current pilots. The notion of paying the higher rate to only the DEC's will fail in the IRC as these pilots are no more qualified, and perhaps less so, than existing current REX captains.
So you see bushy, the seniority system is quite safe, although it can be relaxed in times of crisis. Notwithstanding that, once a cadet is bypassed it is quite acceptable to move onto the next "employed" pilot on the list that can be upgraded.

Wait a minute? Why didn't REX just pay their existing pilots more to begin with? The result would have been the same, and the company would not be facing all this heartache!

Last edited by KRUSTY 34; 18th Nov 2007 at 10:16.
KRUSTY 34 is offline  
Old 21st Nov 2007, 06:06
  #73 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The Dark Side
Posts: 156
Thumbs up Rex Cadetship - Anyone accepted it?

Hi,

Just wondering if any "Pprunes" have taken up the REX cadetship? I know there plans where to start on the 10th December. Best of luck for those that decided to take it!!

TOJP.
The Original Jetpipe is offline  
Old 21st Nov 2007, 06:26
  #74 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Sydney NSW Australia
Posts: 3,049
i was thinking about it, had the paperwork in front of me, but the $80K! nope. cant do it.
Ultralights is offline  
Old 21st Nov 2007, 06:29
  #75 (permalink)  
ABX
AustralianMade
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Out in the weather!
Age: 49
Posts: 926
Exactly the same with me Ultralights, wouldn't do it.
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Old 21st Nov 2007, 07:12
  #76 (permalink)  
ABX
AustralianMade
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Out in the weather!
Age: 49
Posts: 926
No Doc, I sent in the E.O.I. then from that point on couldn't convince myself to commit to it, so I never pursued my application further.

I'm guessing (?) TOJ has applied, but I did not.

Cheers,
ABX is offline  
Old 21st Nov 2007, 12:35
  #77 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: NSW
Posts: 6
I have been offered a spo on the 10th dec course, waiting on the legal fineprint....
anon121 is offline  
Old 21st Nov 2007, 13:31
  #78 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: ˙ǝqɐq ǝɯ ʇ,uıɐ ʇɐɥʇ 'sɔıʇɐqoɹǝɐ ɹoɟ uʍop ǝpısdn ǝɯɐu ɹıǝɥʇ ʇnd ǝɯos
Age: 40
Posts: 714
What, $80k!!!

A little self-respect please.
FRQ Charlie Bravo is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2007, 07:01
  #79 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: NSW
Posts: 6
80k, minus the 20k scholarship for the first 20, get a loan for 5% for 40k, which leaves me with a bill of 20k. To me, thats a lot more affordable then $60 - 70 to go through the GA route, and gauranteed FO spot come august september next year is pretty good!

So i may have to spend the next 5 to 7 years at REX. dont laugh, but im young, and i know where ill be sending my resumes when im 27 with 3000+ hours on turboprobs and hopefully 1000+ command.

whats five years in a (hopefully) 30+ year career? to me it beats doing a 4-5 year uni degree or apprenticeship, which is how im viewing it.

And if i get a job on a jet, get a loan, leave and pay off rex, and triple my salary.

Still waiting for the fineprint before signing though!
anon121 is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2007, 07:03
  #80 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: NSW
Posts: 6
oops, that should have been get a loan for $40k at 5%...
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