Rex current minimums?
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Rex current minimums?
Can anyone out there shed any light on the current Rex minimums for F/O entry?
Have MECIR and 700TT but barely any twin PIC, hearing the occasional rumour that the actual minimums are somewhat less than that published on the website. Can anyone confirm?
Have MECIR and 700TT but barely any twin PIC, hearing the occasional rumour that the actual minimums are somewhat less than that published on the website. Can anyone confirm?
reality
Gidday Roger'
Current mins are....
750 hours total time.
350 Multi-IFR.
Not so long ago the min was 1500 total, 500 multi-IFR and Class 1 ATPL. In reality unless you had at least 2500 total and around 1000 multi, you wouldn't have got a look in! Things certainly have changed.
With 700 Total it would take you between 3-4 years to attain the minimum (2000 hours) for a command, provided you had your ATPL. The problem is your low multi time. At REX command time cannot be logged unless you are a Captain or under training for upgrade. Therefore under the current Regs, you will be a permanent F/O!
I'm not trying to be mean, but these are the facts.
Current mins are....
750 hours total time.
350 Multi-IFR.
Not so long ago the min was 1500 total, 500 multi-IFR and Class 1 ATPL. In reality unless you had at least 2500 total and around 1000 multi, you wouldn't have got a look in! Things certainly have changed.
With 700 Total it would take you between 3-4 years to attain the minimum (2000 hours) for a command, provided you had your ATPL. The problem is your low multi time. At REX command time cannot be logged unless you are a Captain or under training for upgrade. Therefore under the current Regs, you will be a permanent F/O!
I'm not trying to be mean, but these are the facts.
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new CAO comming out or already has stating if you have a command endorosement on type (which QL now provides) and you are an F/O all time can be logged as ICUS, it doesnt matter if the Captain is a check or trainer. Anyway before this new reg came out you could still ICUS on some sectors..
A very good question One Day soon.
Under the High Capacity Air OperatorsCertificate (HCAOC) to which QFlink operate they are able to reduce the amount of Multi-IFR command down to 250 hours. As well as that, the HCAOC will soon have some sort of provision to allow IN Command Under Supervision (ICUS) to be logged by Prospective Captains whilst operating line ops from the right seat. The reasons for this latitude is because traditionally HCAOC holders such as Qantas mainline and the other Jet operators would typically see the F/O in the right seat for many years learning the "ropes" of the operation. Also, in years gone past the Training and Checking programs of these larger airlines were seen as superior.
Unfortunately the powers to be at QFlink seem to be using the provisions of the HCAOC to fast track Captains with little command time as a means to mitigate their crewing shortage. I believe that the minimum total aeronautical experience of 2000 hours for command would still apply, but someone may wish to verify that. As REX does not posess a HCAOC, they are restricted to promoting their Captains only after they have acquired the minimum number of hours. My sources at CASA inform me that especially after recent events in Queensland, it is highly unlikely that this situation will change. IMHO, and I may add also those of others, this is the only safe way to go given the nature of these operations.
QFlink may however be able to take a more expeditious route due to the technical loophole of the HCAOC. Ironically, the nature of both operations are virtually identical!
So in answer to your question, QFlink will probably be able to promote low time IFR candidates more readily than REX.
Hopefully the wisdom of this course of action will not have to be determined by history?
Under the High Capacity Air OperatorsCertificate (HCAOC) to which QFlink operate they are able to reduce the amount of Multi-IFR command down to 250 hours. As well as that, the HCAOC will soon have some sort of provision to allow IN Command Under Supervision (ICUS) to be logged by Prospective Captains whilst operating line ops from the right seat. The reasons for this latitude is because traditionally HCAOC holders such as Qantas mainline and the other Jet operators would typically see the F/O in the right seat for many years learning the "ropes" of the operation. Also, in years gone past the Training and Checking programs of these larger airlines were seen as superior.
Unfortunately the powers to be at QFlink seem to be using the provisions of the HCAOC to fast track Captains with little command time as a means to mitigate their crewing shortage. I believe that the minimum total aeronautical experience of 2000 hours for command would still apply, but someone may wish to verify that. As REX does not posess a HCAOC, they are restricted to promoting their Captains only after they have acquired the minimum number of hours. My sources at CASA inform me that especially after recent events in Queensland, it is highly unlikely that this situation will change. IMHO, and I may add also those of others, this is the only safe way to go given the nature of these operations.
QFlink may however be able to take a more expeditious route due to the technical loophole of the HCAOC. Ironically, the nature of both operations are virtually identical!
So in answer to your question, QFlink will probably be able to promote low time IFR candidates more readily than REX.
Hopefully the wisdom of this course of action will not have to be determined by history?
A can of worms Capt....
Sadly the mistakes of the past are sometimes difficult to learn from, especially by the Regulator. The crash at Lockhart River not only exposed systemic failures within the airline in question, but also a failure by the Regulator to adequately "police" the operation.
As a result, we may see a more "gun-shy" Casa, especially in the QLD office. Same sort of thing happened over a decade ago with Monarch and Seaview. It all boils down to the fact that when the sh!t hits the fan someone has to be held accountable. Changing the provisions of an AOC to facilitate an operator's commercial imperative may seem like a good idea at the time, but if a future incident can be linked to such a course of action, then heaven help the people who's signature is on the document.
Sadly the mistakes of the past are sometimes difficult to learn from, especially by the Regulator. The crash at Lockhart River not only exposed systemic failures within the airline in question, but also a failure by the Regulator to adequately "police" the operation.
As a result, we may see a more "gun-shy" Casa, especially in the QLD office. Same sort of thing happened over a decade ago with Monarch and Seaview. It all boils down to the fact that when the sh!t hits the fan someone has to be held accountable. Changing the provisions of an AOC to facilitate an operator's commercial imperative may seem like a good idea at the time, but if a future incident can be linked to such a course of action, then heaven help the people who's signature is on the document.
So what are you saying spike.
The bureacrats at CASA are actually going to stick their heads up in the name of fast tracking candidates for the regional airlines? A level of bravado that I for one would be surprised to see!
If they do, and anything negative in the future can be linked to that course of action, then heads will roll. I have seen it before. As I said, my sources in CASA have told me that nobody they know in the organisation is prepared for that sort of greif.
If they are, then we are talking about a different CASA to the one I know!
The bureacrats at CASA are actually going to stick their heads up in the name of fast tracking candidates for the regional airlines? A level of bravado that I for one would be surprised to see!
If they do, and anything negative in the future can be linked to that course of action, then heads will roll. I have seen it before. As I said, my sources in CASA have told me that nobody they know in the organisation is prepared for that sort of greif.
If they are, then we are talking about a different CASA to the one I know!
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G'Day Krusty
You seen to have yr hand on the pulse of REX very well.
Just as a thread drift, something that you won't see from CW soon (trust me I'll be shot soon
) I recently sent off an email to the recruitment section of REX asking the T&C's for REX pilots & mentioned that I had many hrs above their mins & it's now about a week & nufin' heard back.
Pilot shortage? I don't think so!
It's not that I want to join them (the last place I'd go) but I was just curious to see how they handled such an enquiry.
I didn't want to start a sep thread on this, been enough started anyway.
yr thoughts?
CW
You seen to have yr hand on the pulse of REX very well.Just as a thread drift, something that you won't see from CW soon (trust me I'll be shot soon
) I recently sent off an email to the recruitment section of REX asking the T&C's for REX pilots & mentioned that I had many hrs above their mins & it's now about a week & nufin' heard back. Pilot shortage? I don't think so!
It's not that I want to join them (the last place I'd go) but I was just curious to see how they handled such an enquiry.
I didn't want to start a sep thread on this, been enough started anyway.
yr thoughts?
CW
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I'd guess that you haven't got a snowflakes chance Wal, you're way too experienced and not likely to be forced to stay with Rex for the long(ish) term, so they won't waste their training dollars on you.
Plus, you'd never find another job that allows you surf Prune or sleep, while on duty, as much as your current one!
Plus, you'd never find another job that allows you surf Prune or sleep, while on duty, as much as your current one!
Gidday Wal, ABX.
I'm still not sure what their rationale is either. You hear stories all the time about experienced guys not getting a look in, but the company is already bypassing command candidates because they do not meet the min legal requirements. When you consider the majority of people that they are now employing do not meet those legal mins also, then it will only be a matter of time before we see even more schedule cuts.
The stated position is that REX will continue to reduce services if necessary rather than even attempt to retain or attract experienced pilots. They have made it clear, that because of REX's superior debt/equity ratio, this course of action will not threaten the long term viability of the company. Perhaps they're right, but the angst already being felt by the travelling public does not seem to factor into their way of thinking.
The question is of course, how low will they go? Lots of variables, the problem with the price of jet fuel and the high debt of some of the major recruiters of REX pilots may play into their hands. In fact the cheif pilot of REX has mentioned this on several ocassions. My guess is that even REX will finally sit up and take notice if their business is faced with being cut in half! If that time comes, they will probably seek to employ DEC's. The T&C's would have to be far superior to attract them however. When and if that day comes Wal, then just maybe they'll appreciate people such as yourself.
Untill that day comes, REX pilots will continue to leave for greener pastures, and the travelling public will be the real losers.
I'm still not sure what their rationale is either. You hear stories all the time about experienced guys not getting a look in, but the company is already bypassing command candidates because they do not meet the min legal requirements. When you consider the majority of people that they are now employing do not meet those legal mins also, then it will only be a matter of time before we see even more schedule cuts.
The stated position is that REX will continue to reduce services if necessary rather than even attempt to retain or attract experienced pilots. They have made it clear, that because of REX's superior debt/equity ratio, this course of action will not threaten the long term viability of the company. Perhaps they're right, but the angst already being felt by the travelling public does not seem to factor into their way of thinking.
The question is of course, how low will they go? Lots of variables, the problem with the price of jet fuel and the high debt of some of the major recruiters of REX pilots may play into their hands. In fact the cheif pilot of REX has mentioned this on several ocassions. My guess is that even REX will finally sit up and take notice if their business is faced with being cut in half! If that time comes, they will probably seek to employ DEC's. The T&C's would have to be far superior to attract them however. When and if that day comes Wal, then just maybe they'll appreciate people such as yourself.
Untill that day comes, REX pilots will continue to leave for greener pastures, and the travelling public will be the real losers.
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too true ABX, I guess I have got it easy
I didn't mention what exact exp I have so to them I'm just a pilot with hrs beyond their mins, no more no less.
I did some time ago now apply to just about all operators, majors, regionals, (more for curiosity than anything else, you know stale at current work place etc) you name it that had anything bigger than a small turbo prop & a few said without HSC ( I don't have it) thanks but no thanks. Unbelievable, I need to spell correctly in order to push a few buttons in a bus/jet & to think I've done OS medivacs in a jet as capt with very little support on the ground 24/7 with not having flown anything better prior to the LR35 than a bloody PA31!
No matter getting too old anyway, shall just sit back watch TV at work & save the odd fool
Tnxs Krusty & ABX, I suspect you won't see CW around too much more in here, I believe I'm about to be banned probably 4ever, for just being ME
CW
I didn't mention what exact exp I have so to them I'm just a pilot with hrs beyond their mins, no more no less.
I did some time ago now apply to just about all operators, majors, regionals, (more for curiosity than anything else, you know stale at current work place etc) you name it that had anything bigger than a small turbo prop & a few said without HSC ( I don't have it) thanks but no thanks. Unbelievable, I need to spell correctly in order to push a few buttons in a bus/jet
& to think I've done OS medivacs in a jet as capt with very little support on the ground 24/7 with not having flown anything better prior to the LR35 than a bloody PA31!No matter getting too old anyway, shall just sit back watch TV at work & save the odd fool
Tnxs Krusty & ABX, I suspect you won't see CW around too much more in here, I believe I'm about to be banned probably 4ever, for just being ME
CW
Last edited by Capt Wally; 19th Jun 2008 at 11:04.
What a shame that a once iconic Australian company can be so stuffed by pig headded bean counters.
It was before I started, but I remember when a gig with the Wagga based RPT operation flying a PA31 or Reily Herron was something worth doing. In those times RPT was still Reg 203, ATPLs were only issued to employees of the 'Big Three' and the DCA required a minimum pilot experience for Reg 203 pilots of 5,000 hours (that's three zeros).
Now days, I'd be quite happy contributing to the company as a DEC but the T&Cs would have to be competitive & fair. Rumor has it that they are not, so I won't hold my breath.
PITHBLOT
It was before I started, but I remember when a gig with the Wagga based RPT operation flying a PA31 or Reily Herron was something worth doing. In those times RPT was still Reg 203, ATPLs were only issued to employees of the 'Big Three' and the DCA required a minimum pilot experience for Reg 203 pilots of 5,000 hours (that's three zeros).
Now days, I'd be quite happy contributing to the company as a DEC but the T&Cs would have to be competitive & fair. Rumor has it that they are not, so I won't hold my breath.
PITHBLOT
When there are lots of airlines hiring why would anyone apply for Rex?
Abusive phone calls at home late at night from the CP or head of C & T.
Similar emails from the big man him self LKH.
Crews tiptoeing around a certain skipper, in fear of uttering a profanity. The swear jar in this case means a failed check or bad writeup. Obviously devout Christians dont beliee in forgiveness.
Abusive phone calls at home late at night from the CP or head of C & T.
Similar emails from the big man him self LKH.
Crews tiptoeing around a certain skipper, in fear of uttering a profanity. The swear jar in this case means a failed check or bad writeup. Obviously devout Christians dont beliee in forgiveness.
