It's official.Flight training to be HECS as of may 08
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another flood??
The whole idea of having thousands of desperate, broke young CPL holders fighting for a few jobs in GA, just so the airlines have a great big pool to pick from is horribly wrong.
It does enormous harm to GA, which is just as important to the country as the major airlines.
The airlines must keep running sensible cadet schemes, and give some commitment to the people who are dedicating their lives to flying big aircraft. Planning ahead is necessary, and the airlines that do this will do better than those that do not.
The traditional "obscene lottery" is just that-obscene.
It does enormous harm to GA, which is just as important to the country as the major airlines.
The airlines must keep running sensible cadet schemes, and give some commitment to the people who are dedicating their lives to flying big aircraft. Planning ahead is necessary, and the airlines that do this will do better than those that do not.
The traditional "obscene lottery" is just that-obscene.
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I was able to get an interest free loan from parents many moons ago
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If the things true, this is what I have been waiting for and thought would never come. I highly doubt those who say there will be an influx of idiots who have no commitment and decide to do it just because they now have the resources to do so. You may get some but I believe they will be far between, Lest We Forget that you still have to pay off everything in the end anyway! Anyone who can't see that coming has something to think about. And I also believe that if people are informed on the complete process of the scheme beforehand it will make the people who are doing it for kicks think again.
If your aware that you've just been given a 'suspended sentence' on the money so to speak your not going to rush at something you've thought little about just for the sake of it(especially when you have in excess of 50k knocking at your back door!)
And for those who are fair dinkum' people who have the commitment, passion and drive to get there then I say what a fantastic scheme although probably well overdue. They had to do something about the pilot shortage as many already have and I think its a step in the right direction. The pessimistic attitude of many here doesn't do anyone any favours especially the youngens.
Rant Over.
If your aware that you've just been given a 'suspended sentence' on the money so to speak your not going to rush at something you've thought little about just for the sake of it(especially when you have in excess of 50k knocking at your back door!)
And for those who are fair dinkum' people who have the commitment, passion and drive to get there then I say what a fantastic scheme although probably well overdue. They had to do something about the pilot shortage as many already have and I think its a step in the right direction. The pessimistic attitude of many here doesn't do anyone any favours especially the youngens.
Rant Over.
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another flood??
The whole idea of having thousands of desperate, broke young CPL holders fighting for a few jobs in GA, just so the airlines have a great big pool to pick from is horribly wrong
The whole idea of having thousands of desperate, broke young CPL holders fighting for a few jobs in GA, just so the airlines have a great big pool to pick from is horribly wrong
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What would you rather? No pilots, or a flood of them? Besides nobody knows what affect this is going to have anyway, its mere hearsay and nothing more. There just seems to be no pleasing anyone, there really doesn't
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Wow, way to make things personal. How's that chip on your shoulder going? I still don't see why you think CPL level pilot training should be subsidised by the government.
if i extend your argument then the government shouldn't subsidise medical students either pal.
what about those who have the ability but not the money?
you keep saying you don't see why the gov should subsidise training but you never say why.this seems to me nothing more than a snobby attitude and you have to be a member of the club.
i'll ask again what about all the other students at uni that the gov subsidises?
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Sorry but I'm not feeding this troll any more. I made my reason clear on page 2 and I'm not turning this thread into a 1 on 1 argument between people with clearly split ideologies.
Good luck to the wannabes that can take advantage of any new system that comes out, but read the fine print and make sure you're committed.
Good luck to the wannabes that can take advantage of any new system that comes out, but read the fine print and make sure you're committed.
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Summary:
- Commercial pilots that paid their own way don't want competition from perceived "freeloaders"; and
- Kids that don't have rich Daddies would appreciate financial help to achieve their dreams.
Tail Wheel
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The Facts from DEEWR
Hasselhof has the fact straight.
I may or may not work with the customer service centre for DEEWR (was DEST). This legislation was drafted by the Howard Govt last year and was put into parliment prior to the changeover. It is still going through as it was supported by both sides, expect May but it depends on what else goes before the Senate.
VET FEE-Help is aimed at RTOs (Registered Training Orginasitions) that are running Diploma and above courses (can you say integrated CPL courses?).
It provides for UP TO $80,000 in funding to the institution to be paid back by the student once employeed and earning over $xx (I don't have those figures to hand but they're the same payback rates as HECS used to be and FEE-HELP is now).
I see a lot of 150hr CPL couses turning into $80,000 govt. financed propositions.
Personally, I think it's good. It's not a free ride, it's a manner in which a student can get a loan they would have had to work their balls off for in the past while also trying to complete their education.
N.b. While interest free, it is indexed to CPI.
Flog.
I may or may not work with the customer service centre for DEEWR (was DEST). This legislation was drafted by the Howard Govt last year and was put into parliment prior to the changeover. It is still going through as it was supported by both sides, expect May but it depends on what else goes before the Senate.
VET FEE-Help is aimed at RTOs (Registered Training Orginasitions) that are running Diploma and above courses (can you say integrated CPL courses?).
It provides for UP TO $80,000 in funding to the institution to be paid back by the student once employeed and earning over $xx (I don't have those figures to hand but they're the same payback rates as HECS used to be and FEE-HELP is now).
I see a lot of 150hr CPL couses turning into $80,000 govt. financed propositions.
Personally, I think it's good. It's not a free ride, it's a manner in which a student can get a loan they would have had to work their balls off for in the past while also trying to complete their education.
N.b. While interest free, it is indexed to CPI.
Flog.
A requirement for the schools to realistically promote flying training. Schools need to inform potential students of the realistic expected earnings in that first few years between flying school and achieving their ultimate goal. they need to be able to service the debt. Bearing in mind that if supply exceeds demand then there could be a reduction in what are already low incomes. Apart from that "' a big thumbs up"'
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?????
And do you think they will do that? Flying schools are commercial businesses, and the more they train the more profit they make. There has been a surplus of commercial pilots for decades. The job situation has never been as good as it is now since the mid sixties. There really is no shortage of CPL holders now either. It is about how it should be. Qualified people can get jobs.
Will it stay this way? Yes, for as long as it takes to train more.
It has been said that airlines select about one out of every hundred applicants.
I wish all the trainees well, and I can understand how HECS etc would be a great help. But do your research first. Are those golden, skygod jobs really so easy to get?
Will it stay this way? Yes, for as long as it takes to train more.
It has been said that airlines select about one out of every hundred applicants.
I wish all the trainees well, and I can understand how HECS etc would be a great help. But do your research first. Are those golden, skygod jobs really so easy to get?
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As previously mentioned, it is all about management of the scheme...
Here in NZ, prior to about 1999-2000, you could only get the academic portion of an aviation degree funded via loans... around $3000 worth of course fees per year... but the actual flying (something like $60k over 3 years) was out of your own pocket...
Then they changed the rules and fully funded aviation... this created the concept of 'Sausage Factories'... where schools were just trying to enrol as many people as possible (cue outrageous claims about flying jets after 18 months etc. etc) so they could milk the student loan funding...
This resulted in large amounts of dropouts with large loans and nothing to show for it, as well as new 200Hr CPLs with large loans who had no chance of getting a job (unless they were flipping burgers/pumping gas)...
So they changed the rules again... now schools are given X number of student loan placements for a year and they have to be more picky as the placements are reassessed based on student performance... ie. get a bunch of muppets in one year who all drop out/fail... and your placements get reduced...
This is why the schools are now running interviews/assessments and taking the cream... they have to be more selective about who they take.
Works out quite well from what I hear... Keen, dedicated and passionate people now have access to aviation regardless of personal circumstance...
Here in NZ, prior to about 1999-2000, you could only get the academic portion of an aviation degree funded via loans... around $3000 worth of course fees per year... but the actual flying (something like $60k over 3 years) was out of your own pocket...
Then they changed the rules and fully funded aviation... this created the concept of 'Sausage Factories'... where schools were just trying to enrol as many people as possible (cue outrageous claims about flying jets after 18 months etc. etc) so they could milk the student loan funding...
This resulted in large amounts of dropouts with large loans and nothing to show for it, as well as new 200Hr CPLs with large loans who had no chance of getting a job (unless they were flipping burgers/pumping gas)...
So they changed the rules again... now schools are given X number of student loan placements for a year and they have to be more picky as the placements are reassessed based on student performance... ie. get a bunch of muppets in one year who all drop out/fail... and your placements get reduced...
This is why the schools are now running interviews/assessments and taking the cream... they have to be more selective about who they take.
Works out quite well from what I hear... Keen, dedicated and passionate people now have access to aviation regardless of personal circumstance...
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Yes
This is the sort of thing we need, but the airlines should be involved in both the assessment and the financing. They should also be assessing the numbers they are likely to need.
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Progress - of a sort
Bit of a bump here but I got some more info today.
The VET-FEE-HELP scheme is still waiting to be ratified. As an RTO you can now register your interest with DEWA to find out more later.
Cheers,
Flog.
The VET-FEE-HELP scheme is still waiting to be ratified. As an RTO you can now register your interest with DEWA to find out more later.
Cheers,
Flog.