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ASIC card renewals

Old 7th Nov 2007, 22:56
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Australia
Age: 51
Posts: 12
ASIC card renewals

Hi Guys,
I haven't been on pp for a while and I'm not sure if anybody has touched on the matter of ASIC renewals. I not complaining about having to get one in the first place but I think it's an absolute rip off paying the $196 every two years because we need a "criminal check", well! Thatís what the lovely lady at the department told me. You don't have to change anything on a passport for ten years so why do we put up with this crap and what about all the guys and girls who fly in internationally? Do they need to go through all this rot?
All the boys at our employment are writing a letter to our local member telling him to pass the message on that the powers to be can get stuffed and stop taking our money, I urge you to do the same.
Fuzzy Bear is offline  
Old 8th Nov 2007, 00:39
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Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Sydney
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I've posted before that I'm not bothering to renew mine (I'm mostly a hobbyist PPL who flies for business a few times a year).

At country airfields at least, no one ever checks, and the old one looks good at a distance.

At capital city airports, they'll usually accept that your renewal is pending if you show them some other ID.
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 01:14
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I don't want to be the best pilot in the world - Just the oldest
 
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Location: Here and there
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At country airfields at least, no one ever checks, and the old one looks good at a distance.
Really smart advice to give on a professional website - NOT!

Yes you might get away with it at regional airports, you will probably also get away with it at a capital city airport. But don't go crying when you are locked on the other side of the fence looking at your aircraft parked on the apron.

I don't like this ASIC business any more than anyone else here. However as as an airport manager, myself and all other airport staff have a responsibility to enforce the DOTARS legislation no matter how flawed, ineffective or unnecessary we may feel that it is.

you can get ASICs cheaper than $196. I have heard that Aviation ID Australia are doing them for substantially less. THe thing that pushed up the cost of the cards was the transition from AFP doing the security checks at $49ea to Auscheck (AGs Dept) at $86 ea. They are however a bit faster in turning the request around and usually an issuing body will receive the response within 5 working days. The ony delay then is actually getting the card printed. Another good reason to use Aviation ID Aust as they are one of the few bodies Australia wide that have their own, "mega expensive" printing machine.
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 03:30
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Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Australia
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thanks for the comments boys, all we are suggesting is that the renewal be stretched out to at least five years to cut the cost and stuffing around. As Australians we are the most sensible people in the world and all because 9/11 we are paying for it, for what? Can anyone tell me how many other countries in the world are doing this sort of thing? I believe your current card is not recognised when reapplying for a renewal without a drivers licence birth certificate and so on which is crazy.Anyway,looks like we are beating our heads against the wall again!
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 07:21
  #5 (permalink)  
I'll get me coat......
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
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There is some common sense left in Aus though. A safety/security officer let onto a major airport recently to collect an aircraft that I had to fly home. Not unusual you say except that it wasn't my aircraft and I'd left my ASIC at home. The bit that tested the officer though was the fact that I had a big set of bolt cutters with me as there was a lock on the controls that I had to remove! I showed my drivers licence, he took down my details and let me in and watched me take to the padlock with the bolt cutters!
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 10:13
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Join Date: Jan 2005
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However as as an airport manager, myself and all other airport staff have a responsibility to enforce the DOTARS legislation no matter how flawed, ineffective or unnecessary we may feel that it is.
This statement really makes me sad.
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 10:37
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Join Date: Aug 2002
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All the boys at our employment are writing a letter to our local member telling him to pass the message on that the powers to be can get stuffed and stop taking our money, I urge you to do the same.
you can write all the letters you want but it wont do jackshit. Just grow up and pay the money like everyone else does. And if you choose not to wear it I hope the AFP pick you up at a capital city airport, the fine is $550...
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 10:43
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Join Date: Feb 2005
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G'day All,

In my current position, we are now required to have an MSIC as well as an ASIC. The cost of the MSIC is about the same, the security check is identical and the only reason we went for a new security check was that using the ASIC check would mean that our MSIC would expire at the same time as the ASIC, in my case 04/08. The MSIC is valid for 5 yrs and my next ASIC can use my MSIC security check. Figure that one out DOTARS !!!!

Phew, that was a mouthful......

Cheers,
SFB
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 11:00
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Capt SFB,

What is a MSIC?

W

Last edited by werbil; 8th Nov 2007 at 11:01. Reason: spelling
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 11:03
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After reading all this, Osama must laugh himself to sleep
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 11:16
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Werbil,

As you;d expect, a Maritime Security Identification Card
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 11:47
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Join Date: Feb 2005
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Werbil,

As Lasiorhinus says an MSIC is the maritime equivalent iof an ASIC, required if you need to be inside the fence at Australian commercial ports, on Australian registered ships (don't know what the cutoff size is) or on offshore installations in Australian waters (read oil rigs and platforms, etc.). They are cracking down on rotary wing aircrew in offshore and MPT operations.

Cheers,
SFB
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 18:46
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Join Date: Oct 2006
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After reading all this, Osama must laugh himself to sleep
Oh, probably!

Let's all remember to maintain an appropriately high level of fear at all times. Thanks for reminding us.
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 23:15
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Toronto, Australia
Age: 34
Posts: 33
Got my ASIC (Renewal) done by Aviation ID Australia, took less than a week from filling out the application to having the ASIC in my hand. Cost was around $150, I highly recommend them!

toronto_flyer
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Old 8th Nov 2007, 23:26
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Are ASIC cards good for anything else?
ie. getting though security at domestic quicker?
deanojj is offline  
Old 8th Nov 2007, 23:47
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: Darwin, Mostly.
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ASIC Renewal

Mine expires 01/08 so I thought I'd better give them some lead time. Applied/paid for about 16th Sep................................
Waiting......waiting.......waiting........
and my security clearances have always been a real bastard cos of previous places of work, secret and better so they take for ever to get back.
You'd think cos of previous history they'd be easier as you do more of them NOT more difficult and take longer to sort out.
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Old 9th Nov 2007, 07:00
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Join Date: Feb 2003
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Originally Posted by deanojj View Post
Are ASIC cards good for anything else?
ie. getting though security at domestic quicker?
Yeah, they're good for getting staff discount at food outlets in the terminal building!



PS, Werbil, my "" before was aimed at the concept of requiring MSICs, ASICs and other nonsense, NOT at your question!
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Old 9th Nov 2007, 08:50
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Lasiorhinus

- I didn't think it was that stupid a question - appreciate the last post.

W
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Old 9th Nov 2007, 12:12
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: australia
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For interest I emailed Aviation ID Australia 4-5 weeks ago to confirm, as per their website, it appears the only people who can certify documents are pretty well JoP's whilst through CASA can be a whole lot more - including the local postmaster who did my passport 6 months ago.

I am assuming they received my email (didn't bounce back) but no reply.

Regardless of pricing differences (which seems to have narrowed in the last few months) to a similar cost, having looked at local JoP's it's all to hard to find one; on that basis alone I'll do mine through CASA and certified by my local postmaster.

By no means commenting on the efficiency (or otherwise) of any one organisation, just commenting on it seems far easier/more options to certify the paper trail with CASA.

If I have mistaken/missed something regarding Aviation ID Australia certainly would appreciate info.

Cheers
galdian is offline  
Old 9th Nov 2007, 16:43
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: PH 298/7.4DME
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ASIC renewal, and airport security in general

You know, this is the sort of stuff that really makes you wonder where it is all going to end. Regardless of where it does, it will all come to a crashing halt one day whether we all renew, wear and pay for asics or not.

I had an experience recently which took the little respect I had for these things away. The card issuing office at Perth Airport, operated by WAC or whatever they're called this week appear to want to make an ASIC application the most difficult, bureaucratic and nonsensical experience as it can conceivably be. It was easier, simpler, and quicker to get my initial ASIC issued two years ago (through CASA, to their credit) when everyone had to get one quickly when they first became mandatory than what it was to get mine renewed at Perth Airport.

Despite explaining to the smiley dolls behind the desk that I already held an ASIC previously, apparently this was not sufficient to satisfy them that I had any idea of airport security, and therefore I was required to sit their own home made "Security Induction". Yay. Luckily, they offer this facility on the internet, so you can run it in the background while you do other stuff on your
PC which actually has some importance.

So effective was the induction, that even without watching/listening to their fantastic presentation, I passed the quizz at the end with a mark of 100% which then produced a 'certificate' which had to be presented to the service minded chicks at the WAC office, who then tell me that despite my employer paying the processing fee, I have to fork out a "$50 security card deposit".

"Oh, ok. Yeah sure. Just invent whatever fee you like and slap that on as you see fit." Pfft.

Now, bear in mind that I am actually all for heightening airport security, but without taking it to a level where it becomes a waste of time.

Given the above rigmarole, maybe we should have a look at what the ASIC actually gives us:

1) Exemption from security screening? NO.
2) Clearance through all airside areas? NO.
3) Access through airside entry points that aren't controlled by your employer? NO.

So, really, it means nothing, does it? Yet, we pay these ridiculous fees and get screened every day when we go to work, when, as flight crew, we have a pretty big weapon in our hands if we really want to hurt people.

Each time I get frisked, I smile as I recall an occasion where I was stopped by one of these frankenstein's for having a metal pen in my shirt pocket, and he was taking a close look at it before he told me he'd "let it through this time", when the bag in my hand had just been X-rayed with a Leatherman Tool which had been inadvertantly left in it. There you have it, airport security at its best.

This is all just a knee-jerk reaction and a method of keeping the unemployment figure low. DoTARS ought to be ashamed of themselves, frankly.



520.
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