Cross country naving
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Join Date: May 2007
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Cross country naving
G'day all.
I've recently got my PPL and have thought about doing a cross country nav from perth, through the middle of wa to Broome, Darwin, then Cairns and back again. I've never done a nav this size before so I was wondering if anyone who has, has any tips?
Cheers.
I've recently got my PPL and have thought about doing a cross country nav from perth, through the middle of wa to Broome, Darwin, then Cairns and back again. I've never done a nav this size before so I was wondering if anyone who has, has any tips?
Cheers.
Take another pilot with you.
This is not only for the benefit of their experience, but if you're going to do a trip like that, share! Many people would love to go along for a trip like that!
This is not only for the benefit of their experience, but if you're going to do a trip like that, share! Many people would love to go along for a trip like that!
Join Date: Sep 2004
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That round trip will take around 40 to 50 hours.
Take money..., lots of money... Fuel (and most things) are more expensive away from the major centres.
Have all the applicable WACs.
Take several books to read for when it's not VFR.
Have an emergency pee-bottle on board and handy.
Yeah..,,, I will say it,,,, take along a (handheld) GPS.
Take money..., lots of money... Fuel (and most things) are more expensive away from the major centres.
Have all the applicable WACs.
Take several books to read for when it's not VFR.
Have an emergency pee-bottle on board and handy.
Yeah..,,, I will say it,,,, take along a (handheld) GPS.
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Take another Pilot, after 3 or so hours, maybe a bit turbulent, arriving into a busy port, you will find you are not as sharp as the last day you did circuits. My first long trip with maybe 100 hrs behind me, i discovered that hand flying for a long period of time out west took some getting used to.
Do not plan stages more than 3 hours, and perhaps only 2 stages in a day, particularly if over the interior, thermal activity will wear you down after a while.
Sounds like fun though!
J
Do not plan stages more than 3 hours, and perhaps only 2 stages in a day, particularly if over the interior, thermal activity will wear you down after a while.
Sounds like fun though!
J
"Whenever ATC see the letters GPS on any plan filed by a PPL there are loud groans of pain and anguish to be heard."
Just curious, but where on a flightplan does it say the pilot is a PPL, CPL or ATPL ?
Dr
Just curious, but where on a flightplan does it say the pilot is a PPL, CPL or ATPL ?
Dr
Mr L
This is no big deal!
but ....... it is a big adventure!
Just treat it as one nav after another, after another, after another ..... you get the idea.
Be well prepared.
Carry a good supply of water (in particular).
Carry an EPIRB (I carry 2 x EPIRBs and a Sat Phone when operating in remote areas).
Carry and use a GPS, but don't miss the opportunity to hone your nav and map reading skills. Every 30 min or so, fix your position based on the nav/map reading/heading holding skills that you have been taught - and then check it with the GPS. Try to know where you are on a line on the map at all times (can be hard in some of the more remote parts but you should still be able to work out where you should be based on 10nm intervals).
Safely operating a light aircraft is an exercise in risk management.
Be conservative in what you set out to do each day.
I don't know what sort of aircraft you plan to take but even in the Bonanza (with 5.25 endurance) I rarely plan more than 3-3.5 hr legs.
That said, I doing 6 hrs TL-ROM-CB tomorrow.
Maybe one long leg (3 - 3.5) or two smaller legs (1 - 2 hr) in a day is a good place to start.
If the weather looks crap - stay in the pub.
Hope you have a great trip - let us know how its going!
Cheers
Dr
This is no big deal!
but ....... it is a big adventure!
Just treat it as one nav after another, after another, after another ..... you get the idea.
Be well prepared.
Carry a good supply of water (in particular).
Carry an EPIRB (I carry 2 x EPIRBs and a Sat Phone when operating in remote areas).
Carry and use a GPS, but don't miss the opportunity to hone your nav and map reading skills. Every 30 min or so, fix your position based on the nav/map reading/heading holding skills that you have been taught - and then check it with the GPS. Try to know where you are on a line on the map at all times (can be hard in some of the more remote parts but you should still be able to work out where you should be based on 10nm intervals).
Safely operating a light aircraft is an exercise in risk management.
Be conservative in what you set out to do each day.
I don't know what sort of aircraft you plan to take but even in the Bonanza (with 5.25 endurance) I rarely plan more than 3-3.5 hr legs.
That said, I doing 6 hrs TL-ROM-CB tomorrow.
Maybe one long leg (3 - 3.5) or two smaller legs (1 - 2 hr) in a day is a good place to start.
If the weather looks crap - stay in the pub.
Hope you have a great trip - let us know how its going!
Cheers
Dr
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Use a GPS by all means but do yourself a favour and navigate at least some of the time via the WAC.
Do not be tempted to go direct to, navigate.
REF ATC / PPL: Most times you do not have to be a rocket scientist to realize a PPL is working the radio.
Do not be tempted to go direct to, navigate.
REF ATC / PPL: Most times you do not have to be a rocket scientist to realize a PPL is working the radio.
"Whenever ATC see the letters GPS on any plan filed by a PPL there are loud groans of pain and anguish to be heard"
"REF ATC / PPL: Most times you do not have to be a rocket scientist to realize a PPL is working the radio"
Such statements, if true (and I am not suggesting otherwise), are an indictment on the current standard of flying training in this country.
Dr
"REF ATC / PPL: Most times you do not have to be a rocket scientist to realize a PPL is working the radio"
Such statements, if true (and I am not suggesting otherwise), are an indictment on the current standard of flying training in this country.
Dr
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You'd be surprised how unprofessional some of the calls from commercial pilots around Sydney and Newcastle sound, compared to some of us PPL holders.
Mr. L, g'day, a fellow pilot and I are taking two mates and flying round the country next month, starting in Newcastle and visiting Canberra, Adelaide, Alice Springs, Darwin, Hamilton Island and then back down the coast, in an Arrow. We have GPS but are going to try as much as possible not to use it, but yeah its great to know that its there if you need it, especially in the remote areas. I would recommend from past experience on a previous nav that you take another pilot with you, and take GPS just for the comfort of having it.
Thanks everyone for the tips.
toronto_flyer
Mr. L, g'day, a fellow pilot and I are taking two mates and flying round the country next month, starting in Newcastle and visiting Canberra, Adelaide, Alice Springs, Darwin, Hamilton Island and then back down the coast, in an Arrow. We have GPS but are going to try as much as possible not to use it, but yeah its great to know that its there if you need it, especially in the remote areas. I would recommend from past experience on a previous nav that you take another pilot with you, and take GPS just for the comfort of having it.
Thanks everyone for the tips.
toronto_flyer
Go for it. One year ago I did a trip in a 172 from Perth to Kununurra and back for my honeymoon. That took 35 hours.
It is a fantastic trip, well worth it and Austrlaia is very well set up for outback flying. I disagree with the requirement for a second pilot, go for it solo.
Make it easy for yourself, start with short days and aim to be on the ground by 12pm at the latest to avoid the heat and turbulence of the afternoons. There is little CTA up there, and heading north the nav is pretty easy (keep the blue on the left, brown on the right) to get your confidence up and allow you to focus on things.
I did find a satphone useful in more out of the way places, but not essential.
PM me if you would like any more information.
Cheers
CS
It is a fantastic trip, well worth it and Austrlaia is very well set up for outback flying. I disagree with the requirement for a second pilot, go for it solo.
Make it easy for yourself, start with short days and aim to be on the ground by 12pm at the latest to avoid the heat and turbulence of the afternoons. There is little CTA up there, and heading north the nav is pretty easy (keep the blue on the left, brown on the right) to get your confidence up and allow you to focus on things.
I did find a satphone useful in more out of the way places, but not essential.
PM me if you would like any more information.
Cheers
CS
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Great tips guys. Cheers.
I'll be leaving in 4-5 weeks in hope of good weather up the top end. I'll make sure I post my photos on the photo thread within the forum for you to have a look at if your interested.
Thanks again.
Mr.L.
I'll be leaving in 4-5 weeks in hope of good weather up the top end. I'll make sure I post my photos on the photo thread within the forum for you to have a look at if your interested.
Thanks again.
Mr.L.
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Flight plan on wacs and take a gps. Just because the technology is frowned upon by some for doing what technology does-making it easier it also provides a safety factor, both in terms of workload reduction in some circumstances and precision of location. A gps will tell you where you are, exactly. As a bushy in a recent article said: "you'd be mad to fly out here without a gps"
I'm coming after you, east coast to west coast and back. Soon.
I'm coming after you, east coast to west coast and back. Soon.
Join Date: Apr 2002
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Enjoy
I'm sure apart from the NW cloud bAND AND ITS ODD (soorry for caps} low vis and cloud base you'll have a ball. Be ready for broken thermals and cross-winds once the SEs are in.
Drop in to YMKT when close to Darwin and say g'day to the TopEnd Flying Club!! Cold Coopers, free parking and lots of war stories.
Gliders too!
Phil
Drop in to YMKT when close to Darwin and say g'day to the TopEnd Flying Club!! Cold Coopers, free parking and lots of war stories.
Gliders too!
Phil
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Make sure that you plan a few spare days on the end of your trip.
Nothing worse than having the pressure of "have to get home" with poor wx etc. Same goes for hotel bookings. If you have to miss them bad luck.
A couple of quotes to remember
"Time to spare, go by air"
"Its better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air than in the air wishing you were on the ground"
Enjoy the trip, it will teach you lots.
Nothing worse than having the pressure of "have to get home" with poor wx etc. Same goes for hotel bookings. If you have to miss them bad luck.
A couple of quotes to remember
"Time to spare, go by air"
"Its better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air than in the air wishing you were on the ground"
Enjoy the trip, it will teach you lots.
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sprocket check
GPS are usually not frowned upon, what is usually frowned upon is the use of GPS by those who who should be consolidating their basic Nav skills. GPS is a great thing but when the batteries run out/cable to cigerette lighter breaks or forgotten/no signal then you need to revert to those basics.
I didn't use my hand held GPS for six months when I first got to the Territory. Best thing I could have done to help my Nav work and overall airmanship skills.
Mr.L.
Take and read the ERSA, many take it but don't read the damn thing. If it says a right hand circuit, do one.
You are in for a great trip, give yourself plenty of time and money so you can enjoy the trip and not stress.
GPS are usually not frowned upon, what is usually frowned upon is the use of GPS by those who who should be consolidating their basic Nav skills. GPS is a great thing but when the batteries run out/cable to cigerette lighter breaks or forgotten/no signal then you need to revert to those basics.
I didn't use my hand held GPS for six months when I first got to the Territory. Best thing I could have done to help my Nav work and overall airmanship skills.
Mr.L.
Take and read the ERSA, many take it but don't read the damn thing. If it says a right hand circuit, do one.
You are in for a great trip, give yourself plenty of time and money so you can enjoy the trip and not stress.
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Did a trip of about 35hrs in a Duchess from syd to cairns via adelaide and alice springs. Then down the east cost back to Sydney.
Best experience in Aviation ive ever had. Hard work but worth the learning curve.
Do take a GPS but be strict on yourself to Navigate using DR prinicbles as you do want to get the most out of it. Any PPL holder can do a large trip with A GPS but you want to improve you newly learnt navigating skills.
Take lots of food, tent warm clothes, and another pilot to share some of the flying with. Take lots of photos and have make sure you take your time so you can actualy stay and enjoy the places you travel to.
Best experience in Aviation ive ever had. Hard work but worth the learning curve.
Do take a GPS but be strict on yourself to Navigate using DR prinicbles as you do want to get the most out of it. Any PPL holder can do a large trip with A GPS but you want to improve you newly learnt navigating skills.
Take lots of food, tent warm clothes, and another pilot to share some of the flying with. Take lots of photos and have make sure you take your time so you can actualy stay and enjoy the places you travel to.
