Pilot Pay Comparison
Grandpa Aerotart
The command training charge is only if you try and bid back.
Example would be FO A320 gains command on A330 International Ops and then decides some years down the track he is sick of long haul and wants to go back to domestic A320 command.
In this case the training costs for his A330 command are paid for by the company...if he then decides he wants back to A320 left seat there is a charge for that training.
If you think about it it's not that unreasonable.
Glad to see some facts being posted re pay in the US.
The pay might be good in the US when you make the top pay rung on your career ladder...but the lower 99% of the rungs are abismal...compare a Eastern/Sunnies Dash FO on 50k and 5 or 6 weeks annual leave to a CRJ FO on 1/2 the pay and 1/6th the annual leave and thank your lucky stars you're not working in the US. Career earning are the important thing...it's no use comparing the top pay rates when you don't get them until the last 5- 10 years of your career...and maybe not then if you've been unlucky with furloughs...yet another system you don't suffer in Oz.
Then take a look at what the beancounters are doing with peoples retirement benefits...their system gave you great retirement plans because your first 25 years of pay was not great...deferred pay if you like...then the beancounters worked out how to take that off them via Chapter 11.
FOs in some US regionals flying jets actually qualify for food stamps...in Oz a regional FO flying a turboprop is paid about 20% more than the average wage in Oz...think about that for a minute.
There is nothing I find attractive about the US system compared to the Aussie one.
Example would be FO A320 gains command on A330 International Ops and then decides some years down the track he is sick of long haul and wants to go back to domestic A320 command.
In this case the training costs for his A330 command are paid for by the company...if he then decides he wants back to A320 left seat there is a charge for that training.
If you think about it it's not that unreasonable.
Glad to see some facts being posted re pay in the US.
The pay might be good in the US when you make the top pay rung on your career ladder...but the lower 99% of the rungs are abismal...compare a Eastern/Sunnies Dash FO on 50k and 5 or 6 weeks annual leave to a CRJ FO on 1/2 the pay and 1/6th the annual leave and thank your lucky stars you're not working in the US. Career earning are the important thing...it's no use comparing the top pay rates when you don't get them until the last 5- 10 years of your career...and maybe not then if you've been unlucky with furloughs...yet another system you don't suffer in Oz.
Then take a look at what the beancounters are doing with peoples retirement benefits...their system gave you great retirement plans because your first 25 years of pay was not great...deferred pay if you like...then the beancounters worked out how to take that off them via Chapter 11.
FOs in some US regionals flying jets actually qualify for food stamps...in Oz a regional FO flying a turboprop is paid about 20% more than the average wage in Oz...think about that for a minute.
There is nothing I find attractive about the US system compared to the Aussie one.
Last edited by Chimbu chuckles; 31st Jul 2006 at 13:40.
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Back to the original thread.
As I/we learned in 89, the truth about pay, matters not a bit. Its who controls the media. Joyce thru QF have all the control (Packer on the QF board).
The punters already think we are way overpaid and ACA at 6:30 every night will feed the perception if things turn ugly for the QF pilots association.
Ground hog dog from 17 years ago.
As I/we learned in 89, the truth about pay, matters not a bit. Its who controls the media. Joyce thru QF have all the control (Packer on the QF board).
The punters already think we are way overpaid and ACA at 6:30 every night will feed the perception if things turn ugly for the QF pilots association.
Ground hog dog from 17 years ago.
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compare a Eastern/Sunnies Dash FO on 50k and 5 or 6 weeks annual leave to a CRJ FO on 1/2 the pay and 1/6th the annual leave and thank your lucky stars you're not working in the US. Career earning are the important thing....
Thread Starter
The point is that Alan Joyce is claiming Australian Pilots are grossly over paid and should be paid less. I was just showing that Australian pilots are actually a little cheaper than what Alan says they are. If someone wants to find out how cheap QF drivers are start doing a Long Haul comparison with a few other airlines around. To be fair you would have to compare it against major carriers with good safety records, as you get what you pay for. No use saying that Air China or Garuda are cheaper when they've killed a few thousand people over the last 20 years!
Out of United, BA, Emirates, Cathay, KLM, Lufthansa etc QF would come close to having the cheapest pilots when all things considered. Now consider that they haven't kill anyone over the last 30 years and that in that time they have had only one serious incident, I think management should be happy with what they've got.
Out of United, BA, Emirates, Cathay, KLM, Lufthansa etc QF would come close to having the cheapest pilots when all things considered. Now consider that they haven't kill anyone over the last 30 years and that in that time they have had only one serious incident, I think management should be happy with what they've got.
Grandpa Aerotart
Is it reasonable for the company to cop the costs of a pilot getting bored doing one type of flying and bidding back to another?
Or you go long haul as a singleton subsequntly get married and have a few children and want to be home all the time...not an unreasonable desire with young kids...but should the company cop the retraining costs?
This has been one cost, among many, that has driven beancounters nuts of the years.
I dislike Beanies as much as the next pilot, but really, they do have a point. They are not tieing you in to longhaul for life....you can go back (slots permitting) but you will pay...your decision.
Or you go long haul as a singleton subsequntly get married and have a few children and want to be home all the time...not an unreasonable desire with young kids...but should the company cop the retraining costs?
This has been one cost, among many, that has driven beancounters nuts of the years.
I dislike Beanies as much as the next pilot, but really, they do have a point. They are not tieing you in to longhaul for life....you can go back (slots permitting) but you will pay...your decision.
Last edited by Chimbu chuckles; 2nd Aug 2006 at 13:01.
