What's up down there?
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What's up down there?
I've been reading with great interest the musings of the Aussie and Kiwi forum users re: airline life there, and by and large I'm seeing many similar issues that we have here in the States.
One of the more telling insights I've come across were several comments made on a late Feb post re: VB's plans for intl expansion and who might be flying the new routes. A question was asked about the large number of layed off American airline pilots (in the neighborhood of 5000 across the US majors). Then a comment came in about the fact that most wouldn't leave the US for expat duty. As a widebody Capt for a major US airline, with 20 yrs senority and a lifetime of experience in this industry, I'd like to add my two cents worth and then ask a few questions myself.
First, I'll agree wholeheartedly that many people do not like Americans. I've been an American my entire life, one who has travelled all over the world and lived abroad, and over the past 4-5 years I've come to feel the same way myself about many of my countrymen. It might surprise many of you (maybe not) to know, however, that there are an increasing number of us (airline types and civilians) who are taking steps to leave the "Good ole USA" because of the way we feel about things here (both on and off the job).You're right if you say that the grass isn't always greener, but in my case, I'm just looking for some healthier, taller grass that doesn't have so many weeds in it.
In looking at different places to live, I'm trying to strike a balance between work and personal life, like most of us are. I am seriously looking at NZ as our next home and would welcome some feedback re: the NZ airline flying scene. Comments from anyone who flys for Pacific Blue, Jetconnect, Air New Zealand would be helpful. One concept I don't fully understand is the Direct Entry Captain. Any help? This is something I've not come across before. Also, more day to day items such as rostering, days off, length of duty days, pay, QWL items, union membership (or not), LOL or other insurance, etc. Then the more subjective things like pilot/mgmt relations, flt opns commitment to a safe, quality operation. (ie: will the office back up the Captain for tough decisions made?) Maybe I'm naive, but I'd really like some insight if you guys can help. These are the things we're grappling with here... and losing ground very fast.
For the record, I'm a strong union man, have been for 20 years, and grew up in an airline union family. I'm also trying to be as pragmatic as possible and trying to understand as many sides of the arguements as possible. It's been very, very interesting reading the forum comments from you guys and very helpful for me. I hope nobody thinks that I'm thinking about coming down to NZ to "take someone's job", rather that I'm just another working stiff looking for a new and better place to set up my tent.
Thanks fellas.
One of the more telling insights I've come across were several comments made on a late Feb post re: VB's plans for intl expansion and who might be flying the new routes. A question was asked about the large number of layed off American airline pilots (in the neighborhood of 5000 across the US majors). Then a comment came in about the fact that most wouldn't leave the US for expat duty. As a widebody Capt for a major US airline, with 20 yrs senority and a lifetime of experience in this industry, I'd like to add my two cents worth and then ask a few questions myself.
First, I'll agree wholeheartedly that many people do not like Americans. I've been an American my entire life, one who has travelled all over the world and lived abroad, and over the past 4-5 years I've come to feel the same way myself about many of my countrymen. It might surprise many of you (maybe not) to know, however, that there are an increasing number of us (airline types and civilians) who are taking steps to leave the "Good ole USA" because of the way we feel about things here (both on and off the job).You're right if you say that the grass isn't always greener, but in my case, I'm just looking for some healthier, taller grass that doesn't have so many weeds in it.
In looking at different places to live, I'm trying to strike a balance between work and personal life, like most of us are. I am seriously looking at NZ as our next home and would welcome some feedback re: the NZ airline flying scene. Comments from anyone who flys for Pacific Blue, Jetconnect, Air New Zealand would be helpful. One concept I don't fully understand is the Direct Entry Captain. Any help? This is something I've not come across before. Also, more day to day items such as rostering, days off, length of duty days, pay, QWL items, union membership (or not), LOL or other insurance, etc. Then the more subjective things like pilot/mgmt relations, flt opns commitment to a safe, quality operation. (ie: will the office back up the Captain for tough decisions made?) Maybe I'm naive, but I'd really like some insight if you guys can help. These are the things we're grappling with here... and losing ground very fast.
For the record, I'm a strong union man, have been for 20 years, and grew up in an airline union family. I'm also trying to be as pragmatic as possible and trying to understand as many sides of the arguements as possible. It's been very, very interesting reading the forum comments from you guys and very helpful for me. I hope nobody thinks that I'm thinking about coming down to NZ to "take someone's job", rather that I'm just another working stiff looking for a new and better place to set up my tent.
Thanks fellas.
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trimotorman, I presume that's an MD11?? Now that's the only BIG aircraft I ever got sticky in the pants over. What a great looking aircraft.
Now down to leaving home. My advice would be don't do it, just as it is to Australians back home. If you have a job that pays the bills, and you're working in your home country, no matter what the shorcomings, stick with it.
Airline pilots round the world are losing ground, so you'll only be climbing out of the frying pan and falling into the fire. Most managements are hostile, and contracting is a lousy way to spend your days.
Contract violations are rife, and if you complain either to the contracting company or airline, you'll get no/little satisfaction.
Stay at home and if you really need to leave the country, and that means REALLY need, then do it in retirement.
Now down to leaving home. My advice would be don't do it, just as it is to Australians back home. If you have a job that pays the bills, and you're working in your home country, no matter what the shorcomings, stick with it.
Airline pilots round the world are losing ground, so you'll only be climbing out of the frying pan and falling into the fire. Most managements are hostile, and contracting is a lousy way to spend your days.
Contract violations are rife, and if you complain either to the contracting company or airline, you'll get no/little satisfaction.
Stay at home and if you really need to leave the country, and that means REALLY need, then do it in retirement.
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Well, thanks for the input gentlemen.
Yes, I know things are not rosy anywhere anymore, but we're talking about degrees. And a change of scenery will do us good!! Things had a lot further to fall here, and for us, they've really crashed. So what I thought was going to be "retirement" won't be, meaning at my airline we've all lost our defined benefit retirement plan, in addition to taking upwards of a 60% paycut, plus turning the clock back 50 years on our basic working conditions. Bankruptcy has taken care of all that. Myself, I can expect only appox 5 - 10% of what I was planning on before, from the govt agency that insures private pension plans. Yeah, and it's all legal. It's happening to ALL major industries in this country, what's left of it. There's mounting concern that even General Motors Corp, once the world's largest corporation, may soon file for bankruptcy in part to wipe out it's enormous pension and healthcare liabilities. Throw in a lying, cheating, corrupt administration in Wash DC that's well on the way to bankrupting the whole country, starting wars when they feel like it, and ... well, you get the picture. Without getting into a big social, political and economic discussion, we know it's time to leave.
So, I'm actually looking forward to picking up and starting all over again. And with a little help from my friends there in the neighborhood, I can get a feel for what's in store when we get there.
Thanks again fellas!!
P.S. - ys120fz, the tri motors are 12 yrs in the B-727 (all 3 seats) and 3 yrs in the DC-10 right seat. Now, those were the days!!!
Yes, I know things are not rosy anywhere anymore, but we're talking about degrees. And a change of scenery will do us good!! Things had a lot further to fall here, and for us, they've really crashed. So what I thought was going to be "retirement" won't be, meaning at my airline we've all lost our defined benefit retirement plan, in addition to taking upwards of a 60% paycut, plus turning the clock back 50 years on our basic working conditions. Bankruptcy has taken care of all that. Myself, I can expect only appox 5 - 10% of what I was planning on before, from the govt agency that insures private pension plans. Yeah, and it's all legal. It's happening to ALL major industries in this country, what's left of it. There's mounting concern that even General Motors Corp, once the world's largest corporation, may soon file for bankruptcy in part to wipe out it's enormous pension and healthcare liabilities. Throw in a lying, cheating, corrupt administration in Wash DC that's well on the way to bankrupting the whole country, starting wars when they feel like it, and ... well, you get the picture. Without getting into a big social, political and economic discussion, we know it's time to leave.
So, I'm actually looking forward to picking up and starting all over again. And with a little help from my friends there in the neighborhood, I can get a feel for what's in store when we get there.
Thanks again fellas!!
P.S. - ys120fz, the tri motors are 12 yrs in the B-727 (all 3 seats) and 3 yrs in the DC-10 right seat. Now, those were the days!!!
Good luck with it. I hear NZ is a great place to live. With a bit of time as a Capt. im sure you wont have to much trouble finding a job.
It's funny that every one talks about jumping ship into Asia and the sand pit, but no-one wants to go to the US to work
I would say your getting out of the fire and back into the pan.
It's funny that every one talks about jumping ship into Asia and the sand pit, but no-one wants to go to the US to work
I would say your getting out of the fire and back into the pan.
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Yay the Americans are coming
Wow, yeah...C'mon over. Things sound terrible over there. Luckily for you we're desperately short of pilots these days. Hey I know maybe one of us should stand down to guarantee you a position. Do you need someone to fill in the work permt paperwork for you?
Then you will understand why you would be as popular here as a dose of Herpes on a wedding night.
Seriously, we have enough pilots in this part of the world already.
Duh...Yeah! Unless you're from NZ or OZ, that sounds exactly like what you're planning to do!!
For the record, I'm a strong union man, have been for 20 years,
Seriously, we have enough pilots in this part of the world already.
I hope nobody thinks that I'm thinking about coming down to NZ to "take someone's job"
Originally Posted by psycho joe
Wow, yeah...C'mon over. Things sound terrible over there. Luckily for you we're desperately short of pilots these days. Hey I know maybe one of us should stand down to guarantee you a position. Do you need someone to fill in the work permt paperwork for you?
Then you will understand why you would be as popular here as a dose of Herpes on a wedding night.
Seriously, we have enough pilots in this part of the world already.
Duh...Yeah! Unless you're from NZ or OZ, that sounds exactly like what you're planning to do!!
Then you will understand why you would be as popular here as a dose of Herpes on a wedding night.
Seriously, we have enough pilots in this part of the world already.
Duh...Yeah! Unless you're from NZ or OZ, that sounds exactly like what you're planning to do!!
If trimotorman can jump through the hoops to get a job here (I'd try NZ trimotor, for purely lifestyle reasons, I'll be there myself once I get sick of my current job
) then good luck to him.
