Why are ASL so inept?
Thread Starter
Why are ASL so inept?
I was booked in for ATPL(H) Flight Planning on Monday, only to turn up to find that the college could not connect to the exam. I waited for as long as I could, but then had to go to work.
Despite several phone calls from the College supervisor and myself to ASL the only response I get is "we'll let you know as soon as we can." Meanwhile I have no idea whether I'll get a day or a weeks notice or whether my exam wil be delayed a month.
Is this service really good enough? I think not. We pay a lot of money for the priviledge of sitting these tests, organise time off work and we get no support from the exam providers when you contact them. They try to fob you off with lame and vague excuses, stating everyone from telstra to the college to be at fault, but never them. Am I alone in this situation?
Bring back an envelope with an exam paper in it!
Despite several phone calls from the College supervisor and myself to ASL the only response I get is "we'll let you know as soon as we can." Meanwhile I have no idea whether I'll get a day or a weeks notice or whether my exam wil be delayed a month.
Is this service really good enough? I think not. We pay a lot of money for the priviledge of sitting these tests, organise time off work and we get no support from the exam providers when you contact them. They try to fob you off with lame and vague excuses, stating everyone from telstra to the college to be at fault, but never them. Am I alone in this situation?
Bring back an envelope with an exam paper in it!
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yes, I agree. The only benefit to all of this (for the aircrew that is) is an immediate result. The benefits are for ASL and CASA of course because they are the ones that really matter!
There was a yarn going around recently, that a candidate was contacted 3 hours prior to an ASL exam informing him/her that ASL was unable to provide the exam. It has to be disheartening to do all of the study then get told 'sorry, try again next week'.
Mind you, I would hate to see the old system re-intoduced, lets hope that the regulator and the contractor can keep moving forward and improve the way examinations are provided.
There was a yarn going around recently, that a candidate was contacted 3 hours prior to an ASL exam informing him/her that ASL was unable to provide the exam. It has to be disheartening to do all of the study then get told 'sorry, try again next week'.
Mind you, I would hate to see the old system re-intoduced, lets hope that the regulator and the contractor can keep moving forward and improve the way examinations are provided.
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Hey Dodgybros - do tell how does CASA benefit?
To the best of my knowledge there has been no change to the cost of the actual exam, and I am fairly positive that CASA is not getting any of the 'sitting' fees charged by ASL.
To the best of my knowledge there has been no change to the cost of the actual exam, and I am fairly positive that CASA is not getting any of the 'sitting' fees charged by ASL.
Let me count (some of) the ways:
* No printing costs
* No compilation costs
* No quality control costs for the above
* Reduced storage costs (Hard disk instead of a warehouse)
* No invigilators/exam supervisor wages
* No exam premises cost
* No marking costs
* No results notification costs
* Reduced amendment costs
* Virtually zero shipping/transport costs
Probably lots of others too.
As for ASLs performance & cost: They hold a licenced monopoly. From their point of view, what motivation is there to improve or reduce fees?
* No printing costs
* No compilation costs
* No quality control costs for the above
* Reduced storage costs (Hard disk instead of a warehouse)
* No invigilators/exam supervisor wages
* No exam premises cost
* No marking costs
* No results notification costs
* Reduced amendment costs
* Virtually zero shipping/transport costs
Probably lots of others too.
As for ASLs performance & cost: They hold a licenced monopoly. From their point of view, what motivation is there to improve or reduce fees?
Last edited by Tinstaafl; 2nd Apr 2004 at 10:15.
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ASL ineptitude
They are inept because they can be. They have a monopoly and don't give a *#@! When cyber exams were first mooted, there was no suggestion of a sole supplier. Many organisations went out and bought 10' s of 1000's of new hardware to cope with providing the new service. Where is this college that students can sit exams? Why can't other training organisations have students sit on there premises? Is ASL licensing some colleges to be able to conduct he exams? What is going on here? Why do students from Ballarat, Bacchus Marsh, Geelong etc (and other places further afield no doubt) have to drive for hours before sitting an exam or wear the cost of overnight accommodation prior to sitting an exam? ASL fess are a ripoff and the service is disgusting
Last edited by tealady; 5th Apr 2004 at 21:29.
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There are probably a great deal of "stories" going round.
Like the one where the person , living in the middle of Aus finally got days off to sit the exam, drove 5oo km to find that the venue hadn't reopened after christmas as yet.
ASL had booked the exam but had no idea.
although they were advised by the venue.
Monopoly, hah, things ya hear when ya don't have a baseball bat handy!
Like the one where the person , living in the middle of Aus finally got days off to sit the exam, drove 5oo km to find that the venue hadn't reopened after christmas as yet.
ASL had booked the exam but had no idea.
although they were advised by the venue.
Monopoly, hah, things ya hear when ya don't have a baseball bat handy!
Props are for boats!
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Monopolies in any industry usually lead to poor customer service and performance. I realise the current NAS Debate has hightened peoples dislike of us copying the USA, but keeping that aside.
I think we should take a feather out of the USAs cap, with regard to Computer Examination providers further.
In the USA there are a mutlitude of examination providers CATS being the largest and Many ATP schools and and Flight Schools.
People go to whom they please, be it on customer service or convenience. Why cant this happen here? ASL is really the CASA examinations department wholey and soley outsourced. Its still a disfunctional Monolyth with no complaint mechanism. Maybe they should deregulate this as well. Or atleast give a forum for complaint. If someone is unsatisfied with ASL service where does one go to complain. I bet CASA wouldnt take the complaint, all be it should, shouldnt it?
I believe this operation is very good now, we have computerisation and instant results. But maybe they need more coordination with their venues. Or outsource the venues. Gives people more jobs and give service with more flexibility. Training and Aviation is still a growth industry it isnt going to get smaller. Capacity to examin candidates and provides facilities is not going to diminish is it?
As I said at the begining of my post, Monoploies are just Garunteed Cash flows and really dont give the customer the option or choice. Give us the option CASA?
Regards
Sheep
I think we should take a feather out of the USAs cap, with regard to Computer Examination providers further.
In the USA there are a mutlitude of examination providers CATS being the largest and Many ATP schools and and Flight Schools.
People go to whom they please, be it on customer service or convenience. Why cant this happen here? ASL is really the CASA examinations department wholey and soley outsourced. Its still a disfunctional Monolyth with no complaint mechanism. Maybe they should deregulate this as well. Or atleast give a forum for complaint. If someone is unsatisfied with ASL service where does one go to complain. I bet CASA wouldnt take the complaint, all be it should, shouldnt it?
I believe this operation is very good now, we have computerisation and instant results. But maybe they need more coordination with their venues. Or outsource the venues. Gives people more jobs and give service with more flexibility. Training and Aviation is still a growth industry it isnt going to get smaller. Capacity to examin candidates and provides facilities is not going to diminish is it?
As I said at the begining of my post, Monoploies are just Garunteed Cash flows and really dont give the customer the option or choice. Give us the option CASA?
Regards
Sheep
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It's about time ppruners have a dig at ASL. I really find it hard to believe how hopeless they are. They seem to enjoy creating problems!
I have not heard of one person who has had a smooth run with them. If you have...please post... ....please....
I have not heard of one person who has had a smooth run with them. If you have...please post... ....please....
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ACCC
Mayhap it is time for Professor Alan Fels successors and inheritors to take a long and close look at this situation.
I suspect this cosy situation contrvenes the Governments own laws and determinations.
Be a real pity if their bodies had to abide by their own rules. NOT!
I suspect this cosy situation contrvenes the Governments own laws and determinations.
Be a real pity if their bodies had to abide by their own rules. NOT!
Thread Starter
It's two weeks down the line and the computer problem still hasn't been fixed.
By the time I get to sit the exam it will have changed to cranial implant testing of your retained knowledge.
What a load of bollox
By the time I get to sit the exam it will have changed to cranial implant testing of your retained knowledge.
What a load of bollox
Bugsmasherdriverandjediknite
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I wouldn't be worried about that pohm1. they don't test you on the subject knowledge anyway. your tested on your ability to out think some padantic f''cks interpratation and ability to trick you.
And then after all that, there will be the ,apparently acceptable, wrong answer in the data base being the correct answer in the exam.
Its a farce and the ACCC should be looking into it.
I am in the desert also, and the closest exam center is a return trip of 500kms, they have one sitting of one candidate every fortnight and are currntly booked for about three months. If I wish too sit this exam I am forced to do a return trip of 1800kms to the next available testing center. this makes the cost of the exam nearly a grand.................and the chances of being tested on what I am being examined on a fairly low, as well as having to compete with the corrupted data base (right answers being marked as incorrect (proven over several exams)). The difficult and useless complaints mechanism may as well not be there for all the good it does...........no-one replies to emails and there isn't a phone no. Its supposed to be illegal to copy the questions and answers..........so how are you supposed to prove that the answers were marked incorrect without specifics?.
the whole show is a f**ckup, and they have no intention of trying to fix it.
And why would they? after having to buy a whole new exam set because you missed a pass by 1 or 2%, on a question that had an incorrest answer marked on the data base as the correct one.
how many people would be lining up for a refund when they discover there are problems with the system and they could have passed easily if the exam was marked correctly?
What is the story with putting one incorrect answer and three correct answers up to choose from? the MOST correct answer being the one that will get you the mark.........thats just Bolloks!
And then after all that, there will be the ,apparently acceptable, wrong answer in the data base being the correct answer in the exam.
Its a farce and the ACCC should be looking into it.
I am in the desert also, and the closest exam center is a return trip of 500kms, they have one sitting of one candidate every fortnight and are currntly booked for about three months. If I wish too sit this exam I am forced to do a return trip of 1800kms to the next available testing center. this makes the cost of the exam nearly a grand.................and the chances of being tested on what I am being examined on a fairly low, as well as having to compete with the corrupted data base (right answers being marked as incorrect (proven over several exams)). The difficult and useless complaints mechanism may as well not be there for all the good it does...........no-one replies to emails and there isn't a phone no. Its supposed to be illegal to copy the questions and answers..........so how are you supposed to prove that the answers were marked incorrect without specifics?.
the whole show is a f**ckup, and they have no intention of trying to fix it.
And why would they? after having to buy a whole new exam set because you missed a pass by 1 or 2%, on a question that had an incorrest answer marked on the data base as the correct one.
how many people would be lining up for a refund when they discover there are problems with the system and they could have passed easily if the exam was marked correctly?
What is the story with putting one incorrect answer and three correct answers up to choose from? the MOST correct answer being the one that will get you the mark.........thats just Bolloks!
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A recent search of the vh register showed the current ACCC commisioner to be the owner of two very nice senecas based at ymmb.
I'm sure he would be sympathetic to having a look at ASL and although I've had no problems (touch wood) the stories I've heard and read justify concern.
Someone on the airport must know him, we need to tap into that network and applie some pressure.
I'll be waiting untill the rest of my ATPL's are finnished
Imagine the damage these incompetants could do if they turned malicious
I'm sure he would be sympathetic to having a look at ASL and although I've had no problems (touch wood) the stories I've heard and read justify concern.
Someone on the airport must know him, we need to tap into that network and applie some pressure.
I'll be waiting untill the rest of my ATPL's are finnished
Imagine the damage these incompetants could do if they turned malicious
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I went in to sit a CPL Aerodynamics exam last year and in the middle found a question on the formation of thunderstorms! Very interesting! Odd if I got it wrong ( I had already done MET 
) and have Thunderstorms on my KDR for Aerodynamics! I knew the answer anyway ..
Pick up your act ASL - we pay you enough to do so.
) and have Thunderstorms on my KDR for Aerodynamics! I knew the answer anyway ..Pick up your act ASL - we pay you enough to do so.
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My run in with ASL
I had my computer screen go blank and lose all of my answers with 3 questions and 15mins to run in my last ATPL exam. (So much for a backup power source) The bloke next to me had kicked the power board.
Was promptly told it could take a few weeks while an investigation was done. Was also informed that I may have to pay for a new set of exams and a new sitting fee.
Let me just say I was nothing short of infuriated.
I had 3 hours until my flight left from Maroochydore to Perth.
For a happy ending I p!ssed and moaned so hard they let me re sit with the next group almost straight away and 2 hours later was drinking crownies on the drive to the airport celebrating.
All I can say is don’t take no for an answer. The examination minders don't know anything and can't help you. RING the people who run ASL and take it up with them.
Was promptly told it could take a few weeks while an investigation was done. Was also informed that I may have to pay for a new set of exams and a new sitting fee.
Let me just say I was nothing short of infuriated.
I had 3 hours until my flight left from Maroochydore to Perth.
For a happy ending I p!ssed and moaned so hard they let me re sit with the next group almost straight away and 2 hours later was drinking crownies on the drive to the airport celebrating.
All I can say is don’t take no for an answer. The examination minders don't know anything and can't help you. RING the people who run ASL and take it up with them.
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Thankfully, I don't give a **** anymore, they won't be getting any of my money again. Sorry for the rest of you tho. Actually, the only problems I had with them and CASA is the ripoff fees. Apart from my own terminal dumbness of course.
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My complaint would be quite different, for me i wish it was possible to book additional dates, i.e. other than what they offer, for people that work it is quite often not possible to attend.
I'd be happy to pay extra, within reason, for an additional date type option, chances are this would benefit many student and employers/employees.
I'd be happy to pay extra, within reason, for an additional date type option, chances are this would benefit many student and employers/employees.
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I would suggest emailing Niel Hyland at ASL and let him know specifically, in what way you were delivered substandard service from his organisation.
I did and the response was absolutely pathetic. Keep the pressure on these lame people.
MJB
I did and the response was absolutely pathetic. Keep the pressure on these lame people.
MJB
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I must add my 2c worth, if ASL were a charter company, resturant or any other form of customer based business (with competition) they would have gone bust ages ago.
Like the Wiz I'm in the middle of nowhere. The nearest centre is a 600km drive. It caters for about 25 fixed wing and 30-40 rotary pilots locally and who knows how many within the region yet there are only 2 sittings a month - UNACCEPTABLE. Especially considering that the (one) computer used is soley for ASL and the supervisor is a staff member of the college who is at work all week regardless. After several unanswered emails I rang ASL to try and organise a sitting as the venue is currently booked 2 months ahead. I was told that "regional centres are not profitable and so are only allocated a minimum number of sittings per month. I could organise an additional sitting at their convenience for an additional cost of $200 (on top of the sitting fee)" This option still only brought the next available spot forward a week from 8 weeks to 7.
I don't see why (since its all computer based) that education facilities could not submit their own availability and ASL simply provide the exam when required.
Best of luck to everyone.
VneII
Like the Wiz I'm in the middle of nowhere. The nearest centre is a 600km drive. It caters for about 25 fixed wing and 30-40 rotary pilots locally and who knows how many within the region yet there are only 2 sittings a month - UNACCEPTABLE. Especially considering that the (one) computer used is soley for ASL and the supervisor is a staff member of the college who is at work all week regardless. After several unanswered emails I rang ASL to try and organise a sitting as the venue is currently booked 2 months ahead. I was told that "regional centres are not profitable and so are only allocated a minimum number of sittings per month. I could organise an additional sitting at their convenience for an additional cost of $200 (on top of the sitting fee)" This option still only brought the next available spot forward a week from 8 weeks to 7.
I don't see why (since its all computer based) that education facilities could not submit their own availability and ASL simply provide the exam when required.
Best of luck to everyone.
VneII