PPRuNe Forums - RAF Beards...?

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A question or two for those in opposition to face fungus.

Are there any specific triumphs in the RAF’s 100 year history that can be attributed to lack of beards, or where a beard would have eroded the chance of success?

Are there any obvious ways in the 100 years to come that the presence of a beard might spell disaster?

stevef,

Bedpacks once a year!!! Used to be every day when I joined, not a great problem but it did not make us any better/efficient!

Times they are a'changing!

Bill

Quote:

Originally Posted by BEagle (Post 10545564)

Presumably someone will produce guidance? Otherwise the RAF could find itself with a few ZZ Top lookalikes...

Pony tails next?

Issued already, it will be the same as Navy regs

Quote:

Originally Posted by FantomZorbin (Post 10545555)

Do the bearded folk have to cover the beard in Vaseline (other products are available!) before donning a face-wellie?

complete falacy!

I know a couple of fireman, an SO15 officer and seen plenty SF with beards, none have had issues with smoke/CS getting in due to facial hair.

Quote:

Originally Posted by orca (Post 10546201)

I'm 100% certain that some of my check-ins at 5 star hotels wouldn't have run as smoothly were I to have had a "beard".... :ok:

The RN allows sailors 2 weeks to grow a 'substantial' beard - I could never have done that as after two weeks I have no more than an extended 5 o'clock shadow!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davef68 (Post 10546570)

The RN allows sailors 2 weeks to grow a 'substantial' beard - I could never have done that as after two weeks I have no more than an extended 5 o'clock shadow!

SWO’s beard parade at RAF Little Snoring late Sep 19
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....912c83efe.jpeg

Training Risky , he was seen going round and round in a vertical direction yesterday [ Thurs ] . The stude was saying '' Tiger at 8 o'clock low , 8 o'clock high , 8 o'clock low '' etc. 'til energy ran out .

rgds condor .

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevef (Post 10545282)

Airmen leave because they're not allowed a beard? What! Perhaps they should grow some b****cks instead. God-knows how they'd have survived in the old Number 2 uniforms and had to share a billet & make bed packs once a year for the AOC's inspection. I can feel the snowflakes melting as I type... :ouch:

Beards alone wont change anything but it was one more thing in a long list of bull**** that only we have to put up with, that civilian occupations don't.

Servicemen PVR because they feel they would be better off working elsewhere. The RAF has to offer some perks to retain people and unfortunately we are haemorrhaging qualified and experienced guys quicker than they can be replaced.

Oi, careful, I used to live in Little Snoring.....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wander00 (Post 10549253)

Oi, careful, I used to live in Little Snoring.....

They put the Valiants out to grass there 55 years ago?

Whilst it would have been preferable to allow this thread to stay dormant it now seems that the RAF’s hierarchy has decreed that beards are not compatible with the wearing of oxygen masks so they are now banned for all aircrew, at least in 1 & 2 Gps. Not sure if it’s ok for those rotary fellows. It seems it is ok for engineers etc who fly on aircraft to be bearded as they are not aircrew, even if they might have to use a mask in an emergency (much like the aircrew then).

I’m sure it all makes sense to somebody but I don’t know whether they will apply the ruling to those who wear beards on religious grounds.

It it will be interesting to see whether they extend the ruling to everyone on the grounds that their respirators might leak. I’m not sure how FAA jet pilots used to/ do cope?

Oh, what a mess. At least aircrew will be identifiable by being clean-shaven (as gentlemen should be) without having to do high-G manouvres with their hands in the Bar. As for the rest ... tacky!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Scott (Post 10605274)

Still ok for aircrew to have a beard in 22Gp.

Just as there are no atheists in foxholes, there would be no beards in a high threat NBC environment.

If someone wouldn’t mind passing on to the various AOCs that I took two different jets up to above FL400 today, wearing an oxygen mask, avec beard and funnly enough no one died. 95% of my Sqn brethren wear beards and there have been zero reported hypoxia incidence in the Xyears I’ve been here. Recent chamber course proved no issue either including the pre soak. If they don’t agree with the official ruling just say so rather than making up a b*****t excuses.

ok - maybe the term ‘brethren’ isn’t appropriate ;-)

No issues whatsoever wearing a beard under an oxygen mask.

Clearly the problem has long been solved in Nature ...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bearded_seal

Never mind oxygen, think novichok or whatever. If I had a beard, and NBC conditions were possible , I would be looking for a razor. I could always grow another beard if I survived.
Which is not an argument against beards, but an argument to retain the razor.

I think what is making this such an emotive issue, is the lack of consistency across our organisation.How is it possible in an Air Force that is now so small, that we have VSO's knee jerking and coming to seemingly contradictory conclusions. Over the last 2 weeks there's been a myriad of different permutations to the beard / oxygen mask rulings, the latest being (I think):-

- All 1 Gp FJ pilots (Navy and RAF) are prohibited from wearing beards in aircraft that require oxygen masks. It's a simple issue of Flight Safety, and the risk to the relevant ODH/DDH is intolerable.
- All 22 Gp pilots may however, continue to wear beards with oxygen masks. Presumably the Hawk and Texan don't have a similar Flight Safety issue.
- Ignore the above if your religious beliefs require the wearing of a beard. Clearly, the safety issue no longer exists if 'your god has given you the nod', and the risk now becomes tolerable to the ODH/DDH.
- Presumably naval clearance divers, SF parachutists & NBC personnel may continue to wear beards with their oxygen masks, because that's a different case altogether?
- I'm guessing multi engine crews may continue to wear beards, but must now pass a yearly Combat Shaving Test, to prove they can complete a full shave and Don their emergency oxygen masks in a timely manner, in the event of an explosive decompression?

If the VSOs really are going to start biting off on these very minor issues, citing phrases such as 'ALARP and tolerable' as their justification, it really should apply across the entirety of UK MOD? It really does make you wonder how the brains of some of these VSO individuals work. They've over-reacted to this extreme edge case scenario, yet seem content to ignore all of the really 'meaty' Flight Safety and manpower issues which are not ALARP, and are plain for all to see.

Talk about not being able to see the wood for the trees.

PS

I do hope the entirety of 1 Gp pilots change their denomination on paper, to make this issue magically disappear.