Irish citizen joining the RAF?
 

Hey guys, Since the airline world is going down the drain at an ever increasing rate :ugh: I was curious as to what are my chances of being accepted into the RAF as a pilot with me being an irish citizen? Obviously I would have to move to the UK.

You may wish to check this out first if you have not already done so.

Thanks, so it says I must be a UK citizen or holder of dual UK/other nationality, this is the part that's confusing me

As we seem to be talking betting averages, the answer must be vanishingly small before we even get to all the other considerations.

Not exactly, there doesn't seem to be anything that says I can or cannot join as a pilot, but with a job as important and in as high demand I get the idea it would be reserved for UK citizens if you follow me

You have to live in the UK for a minimum of 5 years even if you fit the citizenship requirements before you can even apply.

Going for a job that involves arduous physical training, a lot of "silly officer stuff" around the flying and the possibility of being shot at in not-very-nice places just because the airlines aren't hiring? Yeah, makes perfect sense.

Easyjet have just announced they're shortly going to be after another 300+ pilots. Far more than any military need.

Well thanks, I couldn't find a straight answer for that anywhere, well it looks like the Irish air core is my only option..flying a C172 over vast bogland in the freezing rain :{

I know what you're saying but the military pay better than most LCCs do and I'm sure its an interesting experience

If you live in the UK for the required period of time, will you still be within the age limits?

That is however just a paperwork exercise to transfer ownership from CTC to easyjet at lower terms and conditions. There are no new pilots required. :{

@Milo Minderbinder I would but that would mean moving when I'm 18, but 5 years is a long time to wait, I'd say I would have a better chance of finding an Airline job in the meantime.

Good job we werent applying that 5 year rule in 1940 when the Irish were coming over in their droves to join all three of our services, most of them serving gallantly, and not a few dying.

If those are the facts now I'm not disputing them but it seems a damn silly rule to me.

In the event that the airlines and the RAF don't work out for you, it would be worthwhile to note that it's spelt Irish Air Corps ( and pick a happier smily for the application).

A little later it states:

"For security reasons, there are stricter nationality requirements for some jobs. For a few, you must have been a UK citizen and UK resident since birth. Please check the individual job files on this website for more information. "

And, clicking on the jobs - pilot tab:

"Nationality: UK citizen or holder of dual UK/other nationality"

(unlike WSO: "Nationality: Citizen of the UK or the Republic of Ireland, or a Commonwealth citizen since birth.")

WW, thank you, that explains why we had an AEO for whom English was a second language :}

Of course, there are a significant number of us who serve/have served holding dual Irish/UK citizenship. I am (un)fortunate enough to hold two passports having been born and bred in that top right bit of the island of Ireland. :ouch:

And interestingly: WSO (linguist) "Nationality: UK citizen since birth."

There are also more restrictions on an avionics technician (UK/dual UK+other) than on his or her potential boss (UK, RoI, Commonwealth).


Good to see that 'critical thinking' isn't accepted as an A-level qualification. Can't have people questioning dumb-ass rules, regs & orders.

Well, now you see that it wasn't such a good idea in 1922.

I know. Hat, coat...

Sorry.

... yet strangely the Irish Free State didn't leave the Commonwealth until 1949. Perhaps that was a wartime recruiting thing - although some Irish veterans were very shoddily treated by De Valera's lot.

And they've still only got one (bl%%dy good) rugby team in the "Island of Ireland". :ok: Which is much better than having two p!$$ poor soccer teams ....;)

Indeed. Weren't they good on Saturday?

As already explained there is almost no chance for a solely Irish citizen becoming an RAF pilot through the normal methods. In fact the big issue is security clearances. Certain roles are out of bounds because it isn't possible to obtain a full security clearance. Even the army which is happy to take Irish citizens has some jobs which are not available.

If Ireland had joined NATO, I doubt there'd be a problem.

However there is no bar to enlisting in the RAF as an airman. I'ts possible after a couple of years a certain flexibility will be shown. Bit of a gamble though.

Ironically if you were born in Northern Ireland, there is no problem even though that's were all the troublemakers come from!

bluecode, thanks. I know where you live. :)

I knew a Phantom driver who was born in County Mayo Eire in 1950; he later flew Jags and Tornados eventually rising to Air Rank. He never became ‘Sir P….’ as he was an Irishman (unlike that old fool on the radio). He may well have been of dual nationality of course, I don’t know but he was a top Irishman.

Just saying, Cowgettingbigger, ;). Just saying!

HAS59, yes that was very common. A friend of mine, similar age to me went on to fly Harriers, was from County Limerick. But he had the advantage of going to college in NI and a Father who served in the RAF. I had no such advantages. :{


Back in the late seventies, early eighties the five year residency rule was in place for Irish citizens. But that was flexible. I was quoted a year by someone in the MOD. I suspect even that was potentially bendable.

As for the OP, he mentions the Irish Air Corps. (Or 'Core') My suggestion is that he buys a lottery ticket instead. He'd have a better chance because more people win the lottery every month than get into the IAC. Two or three a year with fierce competition for every place from people who can spell Corps. In any case the Air Corps is in sad decline. The jibe about Cessnas patrolling the bogs is sadly too true. Where else can you finish training on a turboprop PC9 and find your first operational aircraft is an ancient Cessna?

I can already fly a C172 (sort of) and my grandparents were Irish. Do you think I'd get in? I could be the one they call "uncle" ;)

:ugh::ugh:

Well now then. I had DV and clearances above DV. So I had 'full security clearance' (which doesn't actually exist - you have BPSS, SC, DV and certain other ones which I shall not mention).

Maybe I am a thick Oirishman and didn't actually work in those roles for years then :p

Well mightyimp, what's your background? Where are you from originally? When and what did you join etc. Obviously you were met whatever criteria was required.

The fact of the matter is that right now, a young person coming directly from the Republic of Ireland is restricted in what roles he or she can apply for in the UK military and the reason is security clearances. You simply cannot joing the RAF as a pilot candidate anymore because of that.

Obviously in the real world, allowances can and have been made.

Most people with security clearances don't brag about it. :rolleyes:

@bluecode - I won't post that information on a public forum but let's just say the same as the OP

@CGB - I said had so therefore using the term with in your reply allows you to make an erroneous comment. I'd agree that telling people you have a clearance should be on a need to know basis. iirc you are told that when it is given. ;)

When I joined HM Forces as a pilot in the 90s, the nationality requirement was UK, RoI or Commonwealth. The 5 year UK residency rule also existed but was waived in my case on the basis of 'needs of the Service'.
Everything changed after 9/11 when the US put pressure on UK to restrict the number of nationalities it recruited, in particular to branches with clearance to Secret UK/US or beyond. Hence the British or British/Dual nationality requirement for aircrew. As has been said, other branches have different nationality requirements (e.g. to play rugby for Army you must be from Fiji...);)

A Sad State of Affairs.
 

Tankertrashnav et al,

One of my instructors at basic was from Tipp. down south. Me Belfast. He was a hard but fare man in the air and became a good friend on the ground.
His sense of humour was wicked to say the least.He got me one day at Toppcliffe.This particular day in mid-summer we flew three dual instrument sorties. He hammered me all day. I then was instructed to fly low level rollers until we hit fuel minimum. So I called a full stop landing and put the three dangling Dunlops on the earth.
As we progressed down the runway I felt an impact on my bone dome and this over the comm. "Happy 12th of July you protestant bastard".
I looked over and his mask was off and there it was. A wicked smile, both eyes and mouth. I,of course, didn,t know which day it was. My responnse was to burst out laughing and almost miss the exit taxi way.
At the de-brief there was only one word. GOOD.
If these are the rules these days I am saddened.

Davey

No surrender to anyone.

Per Ardua Ad Loungebar

A possible Option
 

Try the RAAF. 41 percent Irish descendants here {north or south it doesn't matter).
I have been here since 1980 and have never copped any sh1t from anyone.
Head down, bum up and go for it. The c17s look like good fun.

Davey

Per Adrua Ad Loungebar

For what it's worth, and the rules may be different now, but as an Irish citizen I joined the RN as a pilot in 1988. It took a couple of years after joining before they made me get naturalised as a UK citizen. I then held dual nationality (Ireland/UK), have not long left the RN, and now have reverted back to just using the Irish passport. I had no snags begin accepted into the RN, except for a very long time to get security cleared before entry, but that's probably due to my Grandad being in the IRA in the early years…..

Irish pilots in the RAF
 

I'm an Irish citizen and a British SUBJECT and joined the RAF without any problems -- in 1948. My father was also Irish by birth and served in the Royal Flying Corps and the RAF. Three of my brothers also served in the RAF. In fact a great number of famous RAF pilots were born in Ireland and reached the highest ranks in the RAF. Air Chief Marshal "Paddy" Bandon, The Earl of Bandon, was one of them.

I suggest you contact the RAF and ask them if you qualify for consideration for training as a pilot. As far as I know there is no restriction on nationality, but you may have to become a British SUBJECT and you will have to swear loyalty to the Queen.

Slainte.

Irish/British nationality and the RAF
 

Very interesting to learn, without much surprise, that the USA pressured the UK into changing the rules about recruiting Irish citizens. Despite being born in Dublin I served as a pilot in the RAF for some 20 years, reached "senior" office rank and had great fun. One job involved Positive Vetting for Top Secret clearance. The Security people nearly had a fit when I listed one of my uncles as "Captain. Irish Republican Army (Retired)" and another as "General. Indian Army (Retired)." I did get my clearance!
I worked with the USAF during my RAF service. Two of my sons are USAF retired and highly decorated. I had an open visa on my UK passport and travelled frequently to the USA -- until 9/11. Then I was told that because my UK passport showed Irish birth and British SUBJECT status I would have to go personally to the US Embassy in London for interview before visa issue for each trip to the USA. One of my Intel. friends said, "Don't bother with that. Just get an Irish passport and you don't need a visa to go to the US." He was right -- and the Irish passport was FREE! :rolleyes:

.

Bit of thread drift here, but I notice you capitalize the word 'SUBJECT'. Most of us ceased to be British subjects in the 1990s, I believe, and are now British citizens. However I think the term still exists for those who like yourself were not British subjects at birth, but who subsequently acquired UK citizenship. Is that the case as far as you are concerned - ie are you actually a British subject?

TTN, theres a small group of people who are still British subjects - they fall between, IIRC, two nationality acts/requirements that turned everyone else into citizens.

fairly small group, and getting smaller - i think its people born in Ireland after a date, from recall, in the 1920's and who have not taken up (as in got a passport) Irish Citizenship.

details fuzzy, and very open to correction - but your chances of meeting anyone who is a British Subject are slim indeed.

British Subject
 

I'm afraid this won't be of much help to our Irish friend who would like to join the RAF but I felt it may clarify some of what's been said.

I'm from the Irish Republic and joined the RAF as a brat in 1957. Never a problem, in fact I felt that the English thought us Southern Irish a bit "roguish" in the nicest possible way. Never had any problems with crossing Irish/British borders except in recent years when one is expected to show a passport.:*

In 1963 I was put on PWR for Singapore, shortly after which I received a form letter from the Home Office stating that I should sign the attached declaration "I wished to remain a British Subject". I promptly signed and sent it off. I wonder what would have happened if I refused to sign?

It seems that any person born in Ireland before 1949 was automatically a British Subject. Of course both my parents would have been born British as they were born before the split.

My wife of 50 years, a beautiful English Rose, has a british passport which states she is a "Citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies" whilst mine simply states that I'm a "British Subject". I wonder if I'm being discriminated against?:confused:

I wish our Irish friend all the luck and express regret that he'll miss out on the great life which I was lucky to lead in the RAF for 15 years.

I think you will be very welcome. The RAF was good to me and I wish you all the best.