Those would be the folk didn't know their arse from their elbow then. ;)

@AR - I don't think it was the loss of the 'element of surprise' as much as 'air supremacy' that moved things higher for the GR1, or at best a combination of them both. Low level was there because it was the best defence against a layered air defence system. Once that was pretty much dismantled, the ML option became available, although it still took a little time to get the LGB option into theatre

Just Another Jockey.. You are totally correct,

The IAF didn't fight because when they tried to, they were hacked out of the sky long before they even had a chance to engage any collilation aircraft.:ok:

Yes.....by 2 cannisters of JP233! :}

AR 1, if you're looking for something to read, try this...

Well it certainly wasn't by "The Desert Eagles" Sky Flashes or AIM-9Ls was it!!:E

Whatever - the guys put themslves in harm's way

A little ditty floating around in early '91:

I don't want to fly in combat
I don't want to go to war
I'd rather hang around
Riyadh and Dhahran
Filling in my logbook with a sharp green pencil
I don't want a Sam 3 up my ar@ehole
I don't want a Roland in my face......in my faaaaace
I'd rather be in Riyadh, sunny sunny Riyadh
And call myself a punchy F3 ace, cor blimey......on Monday I shoved the f :E

The Royal Air Force Historical Society is holding a seminar at the RAF Museum on 13 March entitled "Operation Granby - The RAF in Gulf War 1 - 1990-91".

Speakers will include Marshals' Hine, Johns, Alcock, Macfadyen and Wratten.

We all were in harms way, ask the 28 yanks who died on the ground a couple of miles down the road, could have been anybody... A bit of banter, that all.:)

Not much mileage in a book about interminable volleyball, and wandering WTF was going on.............rather dull for the slow movers.........except for scoring the occasional porcelain gronker! Not even the endless, endless poetry of WW1

AR

Fine --

FACTS
 

It amazes me some of the utter rubbish that is written on PPRUNE
First point the F3 had the Aim 9M not the Aim 9L
The GR1 Force did EXACTLY what they were supposed to do that is stop the Iraqi Air Force getting airborne and therefore gaining domination of the Air - FACT after day three or so there was no need to carry on with JP233 missions they had achieved what they needed to do. No GR1s were lost due to JP233 missions FACT - one aircraft crashed post target for reasons never proved. The biggest problem the RAF had was once Medium level tactics were adopted they lacked any form of self designating pod - hence the Buccaneers being sent out and later TIALD being used (2) pods at TABUK . The RAF lacked a Precision Guided Weapon as an example pilot X dropped 58,000lbs of weapons in Gulf War one but then dropped 6,000 lbs of PGWs in Operation Telic GW2
If people actually knew what the facts were perhaps they might stop writing such UTTER RUBBISH !!!

Try "Warthog - Flying the A10 in the Gulf War"

Warthog: Flying The A-10 In The Gulf War - William L. Smallwood - Google Books

At the risk of fanning the flames, which wasn't my intention.. the GR1's deployed the only system we (the west) had that could deny large areas. Durandel didnt even come close. They did it in the manner with which they were trained and delivered the ordnance successfully. And at a cost, even if that cost generally came in the delivery of dumb bombs used (as I understand it) defence suppression. When we didn't need to - we didn't. The timing of that particular decision is the the current bone of contention.
we did what we were supposed to do, and that's what I want to hear about.

The story I read, written, I think, by one of the crew involved,, said the bomb did not drop, hung up in other words, and the aircraft became unflyable, with a fire, for reasons that were not fully understood but the crew bailed out and were captured.

Was that the Peters/Nicholl downing? If it was, then I believe the main computer did not generate a release cue for the bombs in the loft attack and unfortunately they recovered quite high and into a Roland MEZ which took the fleeting opportunity and claimed them. It's all in their book (well, nearly all ;)).

As an aside; I spoke with a F-111 driver many years who said the Turkey-based F-111s were flying low-level missions for nearly 2 weeks.

And I agree. We lost a lot of good friends, saw others captured and tortured and yet still the myths regarding the viability of low level attacks and the general poo-pooing of the GR1 (and subsequently GR4) and its capabilities and achievements does gripe me. It is one of the best and most successful attack aircraft we have ever had. It may not be as sexy as, say, the Bucc, or as superficially impressive as the Harrier, but when you examine what the crews, engineers and geeks have done with the aircraft, on operations near-continuously for nearly 23 years, I think my statement there stands the test.

Whilst my part in GW1 was relatively small, I do believe there are stories to be told and we all have them.....8kft and tapped by a AAA site being one of mine! :uhoh:

Here's a book which was officially sanctioned just after GW1...

Thunder and Lightning: R.A.F. in the Gulf - Personal Experiences of War. (Charles Allen)
ISBN-10: 011701625X
ISBN-13: 978-0117016255

It must be significant that, of all the Types involved, the GR1s had a Loss Ratio almost an order of magnitude higher than the next worst!
KB

KiloB, no one ever thought that a JP233 delivery would be easy. In some respects the GR1s were in the teeth of the battle which, I believe, was at least as fierce as the CR would have been.