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Sgt Nightingale
He's been freed. :D:D:D:D
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Should never have been in in the first place...
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Absolutely!
Would anyone want to enrol in the UK Forces now? I certainly would not - I persuaded my son not to do so. It seems the only people who appreciate our soldiers are the general public. Cameron and every other politician have absolutely no idea. DO YOU HEAR ME GOVERNMENT W:mad:ers??? edit: Three judges - Lord Chief Justice Lord Judge, Mr Justice Fulford and Mr Justice Bean - heard legal argument at a hearing in the Court Martial Appeal Court in London. |
:D:D:D:D
Good to hear :ok: It should never have got to this stage in the first place, any issue handled "in house" and dealt with then it would have been accepted by all. |
Brilliant news!:D:D:D
I remember rule No 1 of command was discipline your subordinate quickly as no one could be punished twice for the same offence. |
Lets hope others learn from this and if they have any weapons or ammunition at home they may have collected, they get rid of it or take appropriate steps to hold them legally.
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I disagree profoundly with all the above posters.
He knew the rules, wilfully broke them, and has used the reputation of the Reg to manipulate the media in order to get early release from what was already a very lenient sentence. He should have kept his mouth shut, accepted he had f*Ckd up, and done his time. I saw also he went on TV and made a speech (without even black masking tape over his eyes). It looked to me that this was to fish for a book contract. Good luck to him, but he'll be PNGd for life. |
but he'll be PNGd for life. Good outcome to an embarrassing situation. |
Good to see the right decision finally made. :ok:
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I'm still not sure how someone getting off free for committing a crime is the right outcome. Please explain.
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Because the law is an asinine law... :hmm:
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The guy had a weapon in contravention of the Firearms Act.
The guy had AP rounds in contravention of the Firearms Act. The guy had made declarations about having no live rounds in his possession. Five years minimum, eight would have been reasonable. Precendence has now been set, which will come back and bite when we least expect it. |
I'm with you Courters - now how do we stand with Precedent? Both with this case and the female labour MP who was not charged because of ill health? As the thread developed I found myself jumping off the outrage bus and thinking that the CM system had done its best for this bloke - no reduction to the ranks, no discharge etc.
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Because the law is an asinine law The next gang member caught with an illegal firearm could make the same appeal, I guess. That would be good! :ugh: |
Anyone who has served in the UK armed forces should have this statement branded into their brain...
"I have no live ammunition or empty cases in my possession" 'nuff said := |
I'm still not sure how someone getting off free for committing a crime is the right outcome. The whole saga is convoluted, with confusing sidelines of mental disturbance and personally I feel this is an acceptable solution. |
Anyone who has served in the UK armed forces should have this statement branded into their brain...
"I have no live ammunition or empty cases in my possession" 'nuff said := I'm confused now. I served in the UK armed forces, but never said that statement, and it is not branded into my brain. I did however say: "I have no live rounds, misfires or empty cases in my possession" I also said: "I have no rockets in my pockets, wombats in my combats or shermulies round my goulies" Maybe brain branding isn't what it used to be :E |
If you can't do the time, don't do the crime. SF are supposed to be selected for brains as well as brawn.
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With trim stab on this one, this was one of the rules everyone in the mil was clear about. Strange how the media never talk about when, where and how he got hold of the ammunition.
A very lucky guy who will most probably make a mint out of this! |
I have no particular views on the Nightingale case as I haven't read up on all the known "facts", but thank goodness he wasn't some mad nutter who chose to use an unlawfully held weapon and ammunition on some rampage.
The next time a Hungerford/Dunblane occurs, if it's done by an ex-HM Forces chap, presumably some would think that it's just high spirits. |
BOAC - you are correct that this is a convoluted case with many strands - the CM did a very good job in taking all of those into account and delivering a very fair verdict.
What is totally reprehensible is that Nightingale has used the reputation of the Regiment to his own ends in order to manipulate the media and even the PM in order to have his already lenient sentence reduced. He is trading for his own selfish ends a regimental reputation which has been built by many top blokes who have sacrificed far more than he has. If he has any sense at all, he will now go away quietly. But I suspect that he won't and that this is not the end of this story. I sympathised with the rather excellent Secretary for Defence having to defend on TV the appalling populist ploy of "call me Dave" and at the same time assuage some senior brass who must be absolutely livid at this trial by media. |
I also think this sets a dangerous precedent. I now expect the next scroat who gets nicked with a Glock and AP in his possesion to be given a suspended sentence when his top-notch lawyer quotes Nightingale vs The Crown, 2012.
At least he did some 'time' and he probably won't do it again... LJ:cool: |
Trim etc have you seen this;
20 Nov 2012 : Column 554 During the search, the police uncovered the weapon belonging to Danny Nightingale, which was still in its container in a cupboard and a quantity of ammunition under his bed. I understand that the unit held an immediate weapons amnesty and that an embarrassingly large number of weapons turned up in the skip that was conveniently provided overnight. Most parts of the Army have been engaged in dangerous and often bloody operations. Where special forces are different from the rest of the Army is that they do not leave that regime on coming back to the UK. Typically, as was the case with Sergeant Nightingale, they remain on very short notice to move for long periods, which entails keeping live ammunition in their kit. They are, of course, subject to the same law and the same internal rules as other parts of the Army, but the pressure and temptation on tired, overstretched men to take weapons and kit containing live rounds back to their accommodation is of a different order of magnitude. It is clear from the article by Sergeant Nightingale’s gallant former commanding officer, Colonel Richard Williams MBE MC, that the amnesty revealed that a number of people in the regiment had got into bad habits under the extreme pressure of operational tours abroad and the high-readiness cycle at home. Source House of Commons Hansard Debates for 20 Nov 2012 (pt 0004) |
The admin would have been interesting to bring all those "weapons"
onto charge for the unit. |
Good result.
I remember in NI getting lumbered with a damn block inspection just after I arrived, opening the top locker that was so high no one used it I found some live SLR rounds... Eek :eek: thinking what the hell do I do with these, if I chuck em out the window and they're found the sh*t will hit the proverbial, bin was out of the question, so sheepishly took them to the armoury, banged on the hatch, tells him I found these, cool we are always short of them, thanks and relieves me off them.... Glad to see the back of them :) |
revealed that a number of people in the regiment had got into bad habits |
This is the Appeals system at work, I think.
Given the facts, the CM gave as lenient a sentence as they could. The message to the Armed Forces from a suspended sentence would have been wrong. They left the door open in the President's summing up, "Parliament has decreed". And Parliament,in its wisdom, has now, via LCJ, re-decreed. Message to average squaddie is still imprisonment from a CM for keeping arms/ammo. Message from general public is "If you are in an elite unit and on constant call and brain-damaged and this is the first time you've f#cked up..and..and...and, then you get forgiven...once. We have a jury system in civil courts. I recall the case of a father up for grevious wounding, etc, who had taken a shotgun to the one-eyed truck driver who, driving illegally, had run down and killed his daughter. 55 zillion witnesses; verdict: Not Guilty. There are always exceptions. . |
Some of the anti gun rubbish on this thread is unreal. This silly island has some of the most restrictive, primitive and unfair anti gun legislation anywhere. We are simply talking about a handgun!!!! I bet our American cousins think this place is insane. Thanks RR, that's possibly the funniest thing I've ever read on pprune. I bet you don't like Mondays either...tell me why |
Go Danny Go!!!! Drinks are on me in CW2 Sally:D https://news.google.co.uk/news/story...ed=0CDIQqgIwAA
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Originally Posted by Ronald Reagan
(Post 7547258)
I bet our American cousins think this place is insane.
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If it was legal here I'd have them on display as well !
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OK, a very good man is home for Christmas. Is that good or not?
Answers on a postcard. |
I tried my hardest not to post, but anyway:
The police searched the accommodation of two SF blokes (one targeted the other simply at this point a co-habitee) and both were found to have some form of illegal weaponry. Quite a lot actually. There is now anecdotal evidence to suggest that a number of their colleagues had similar items that were given in under an amnesty. I think it is hard in this situation to explain all this away as a function of the stress, strain and scheduling of their work. A small part of me suspects that a significant number of this unit were simply 'taking the piss'. |
The next gang member caught with an illegal firearm could make the same appeal, I guess. That would be good! |
Oh dear. Have we got to the stage of deliberately misinterpreting posts in order to jump on the outrage bus now?
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So, will he continue to serve? Busted in rank? Or is he out on his ear?
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technically in the wrong S4G |
A chum of mine bought a house three years ago.
During the couurse of 'doing it up' he found a Luger pistol secreted under the water tank in the loft. Preseved very nicely. He rang me about it (as I'm ex Army). What do you think he did, and what do you think happened? |
If he plead guilty during the trial how can he suddenly become innocent?
<devils advocate on> Guilty as sin, with perhaps a very good medical alibi, but if his memory functions have been that severely affected then why is he still "on the job"? Something doesn't actually ADD up here. <devils advocate off> Still, I'm glad he's out, one half of me deplores some of the comments on here, none of us are ABOVE the law. The other half is smiling quietly to itself.:ok: |
If he plead guilty during the trial how can he suddenly become innocent? |
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