Don't be too sure - Lyneham doesn't hold the monopoly on daft triv.

Some years ago, a Brize Stn Cdr (the infamous 'Thrombo') ordained that brightly coloured cycling helmets were not to be worn with military clothing whilst cycling. Bugger the safety they offered, if they weren't 'military' enough, they weren't permitted.......:mad:

But what was wrong with cycling in your Kevlar helmet? Much more military. And don't ignore the protection offered by an SD hat. :rolleyes:

Will that be reintroduced when the Brize cycle path is in use for those living less than 3 miles (or what ever the distance is) off camp?

Well, I have to say that many people in the RAF may knock JG but I think he's a top bloke and he's very well respected amongst the other services. The main reason some people find his leadership style abrasive is because they have been too used to getting their own way all the time in the lax RAF command chain. Some crews just took the pi$$ wrt to supporting the troops on ex abroad etc.( You know the types - claiming crew duty hours and bluffing people with regulations to suit own alcoholic agendas!)

Luckily the current Op environment has managed to quash a lot of the 'old boys flying club' mentality that existed prior to 2001! I'm all for it. The clue is in the title - Royal Air FORCE! Not fecking Virgin or BA - get a grip (literally) and don the PLCE bergans!!

The fact is, if JG thought something as trivial as banning Samonsites would get him further up the tree, he would do it!

Are these 'jolly smart' issue black Gladstone Bags actually waterproof, let alone mover-proof?

Now this is what I call a Gladstone, rather than a Gladston, Bag:
Mens Leather Gladstone Bag - Handmade Holdall from Italy

so why don't "Backside" et al, who also presumably want to get further up the tree, club together and buy him one?:E A snip at a mere £342.99 - and somehow, with Darkside involved, "Dark Chocolate" sounds appropriate .....:eek:

Jack

Come on then, lets hear the evidence for the prosecution. No? I thought not.:hmm:

Not sure that's Lyneham as I remember it before 2001. True, we weren't particularly good at the operational stuff but that's because we didn't do it that much, and all the squadrons are a great deal more 'combat ready' these days. I don't think things were as bad as you make out, unless you're talking from purely personal experience.....

Crew duty & other regulations are not options to be deployed when it suits, they are the rules as applied to our operations.

As for bergens, I shoulder mine everytime I deploy into theatre. If I happen to be fortunate enough to get a route to somewhere half decent in between detachments then my clothes come out less creased from a (Samsonite) suitcase than they will from an op bag or rucsac - not a particular consideration on Ops but who wants to look like a bag of s**t in a nice restaurant when I'm enjoying my JPA actuals meal?

Grim

I hear what you're saying. One person might assess a boss as an arrogant to$$er but another might assess him as a top bloke and leader. It all depends on one's viewpoint and what the majority of others think that defines the outcome.

As far JG is concerned, I would suggest that the jury is still out. However, I do have some sympathy with his plight, as I once tried to get people to be more 'op-centric' and to do away with the Samonites and take only camo-bags on deployment. That is until my tent got wet and I realised the value of the said civ-luggage! That said, I maintained that only op-bags were taken 'sausage-side' and that they and the kit with which we flew, were 'sanitised' - I think that most appreciated the reasons for this and complied.

OTOH, I was saddened by his lack of openness to the 'lighter end' of the corridor. He claimed OPSEC - My @rse! His 3 predecessors had managed to allow the cross-flow of ideas across the sqn during on-going spec ops. So, if he had been a little less introspective and overconfident, then he may have learnt a few lessons from the rest of 'us plebs', for whom he appeared to have so little time.

His attitude to anyone other than 'special' was highly apparent in the Coroner's Inquest into 179 and it did him or the Sqn absolutely no favours. It underlines why a career in one specialist field is not ideal for someone with aspirations of high-rank. I sincerely hope he has learnt to open his eyes to the bigger picture and appreciate there is always more than one point of view which may have merit; that way is the only way to improve as an officer. For better or worse, the choice is his alone.

I had the pleasure of working for JG. Legend. That is all.

For those of you who haven't figured out who i am from my prrune name please disregard. For the likes of 'Ken Scott', HPT and 500 days blah etc, i think it is you lot that have a firm grasp of the none essentials. I was the other side of the door for a long time and never vented what i considered to be a lack of professionalism from some of the main sqn crews. I took the cowboy banter and for years i deployed on dets (not just california or routes and before 2001 when it became en vogue for the rest of you) while the majority of lyneham went on long look cross ske and all the other pre 2001 pointless jollies. I remember a lot of belly aching and moaning and i especially remember a crew that were 12 hours late delivering stuff to 'our' det because they couldn't leave Amman without catering for a 4 hour flight. Frankly the captain could of surivived about 5 years on his own body fat alone but that is another palm tree story...
In short, the previous 3 stn cdrs did nothing but at best keep a steady ship and keep their heads down. Nobody did any force developement and any that was attempted was vehmently boycotted at the grass roots. The current staish took over an shambles and frankly anybody who thinks the K will survive SDSR is either dillusional, piss@d or an old nav. Without the current staish, lye would have just ticked along. To drag up the dirt about previous mishaps is below the belt. If i were to go through all the mishaps that happened on the main sqns while i was at lye, it would take up most of prrunes bandwidth. In terms of leadership, i think he is probably the only person above Wg Cdr who actually know how to spooll it. So, man up and stop using the samsonite issue as a means to slag someone off.
I have only ever previously used this site to monitor the operational risk to my crews when people were chuntering about stuff they didn't know or understand while i had crews stranded at a forward location who were vulnerable to enemy OA as a direct result from the sh@te that was being spouted on here. Frankly, it is the people on here who have too much time on their hands. Please do the usual and post higlighting spelling mistakes etc as i will not be reading this forum again. Later losers................

http://blog.whatfettle.com/archives/Footy/handbags.jpg

Oooooooooooohhh somebodies tired....................

Talon.......I was never on 47 SF or a C130 main sqn crew (perhaps my pprune name might be a clue) but have a very intimate knowledge of what went on behing the 'special' door. Trust me, you know the meaning of ''its good to be gash'' and it wasn't good!

Hiding behind ''need to know'' has been used by 47 SF and others to hide a disgraceful disrespect for following rules and SOPs which has caused aircraft to be damaged and lives to have been lost.

Perhaps you are the deluded one.........

HPT

Talon...
 

Obviously touched a raw open sore...if my PM box is anything to go by...:{

HPT hits it full square with his comments.:D:D:D

5d2d

:eek:You were never crew or on the flt and you think that you have the knowledge to post here about the flight, its procedures and what we did or why.At best you are a GE, at worse an op cpl. I am glad that it was need to know or you would be spouting the real sensitive stuff that you were clearly not capable of understanding. As for damaging ac or people, what on earth are you blabbing about, yet another theorist, even flipster or nigeg would not lay that at this door....and they at least know what they are talking about. Taxi for Mr Walter Mitty..................:suspect:

An outsiders perspective......

When I went through IOT we studied supposedly great RAF wartime leaders, like Bader and Gibson. However, in both these particular cases there were two distinct camps - the love em and hate em. Baders groundcrew were supposedly overjoyed when he was shot down, while Gibsons groundcrew may well have killed his dog. Leadership, especially during wartime, is not a popularity contest, but there is a difference between leadership and dictatorship. There are also considerations in a (largely) peacetime RAF, such as career development, that didn't apply in WW2 which may call for a less forceful approach.

I don't know this particular individual (JG?) but opinions seem to be polarized into two camps in his case - once again you seem to either like/respect/admire him or not, with little or no middle ground. So, at least on that basis, he is similar to both Bader and Gibson.



Talon - I thought you weren't going to read this site again?

I am sure he won't be the least concerned by this thread, he has been given a job to see through the closure of Lyneham and then he will move on. I am still in contact with one of the family's affected by the crash of XV179. They talk of a jaw dropping moment when he was giving his evidence at the inquest. It has been described as a combinationof arrogance and total lack of humility. For me this was his most disappointing moment.

Oh dear, they really have hit a raw nerve. I guess you are still reading then.

yes i am still reading-hoping for something a bit better really. Kreugers was funny though! 500 days to go, great that you have some pm's i am really pleased for you. Shame that you have nothing to add to the debate. Nigegb, i came on here after my ex- unit was effectively called gash etc by somebody who is not even qualified on type let alone aircrew. Having flown with you on many occasions it is a shame that people can say what they like without ever admitting who they are or what they do-unlike you. Cheers:ugh:
Biggus-very fair analysis, but what can i say, maybe i am now :eek:hooked on prune.dear christ....

Are you saying they were not gash :confused:

There is a saying that you should never meet your heroes as you will only be disappointed. I met Bader once, when he visited Manston along with Adolph Galland. Galland was a perfect gentleman who chatted to everyone regardless of rank, whereas Bader managed to upset everyone, from the CO downwards.