Hello all

I am currently in year 11 and uncertain on where to go, DEO or ADFA. Have been in Australian Air Force Cadets for well over two years, been ranked Corporal and completed first solo in a glider so I have been exposed to the ADF. But still not sure what is the best route to take to become a pilot(preferably a fighter pilot). Any opions would be greatly appreciated.

For the topic of OSB a friend of mine has recently done his and passed, now needs grades, he said that the questions where not academicly challenging as much as you had to just think about what you would do in situations such as...

1. Read this thread!!!
2. ADFA; about 3 years. Pilots course; about 18 months. Time to complete F-18 OCU; about 18 months (varies). Therefore you're looking at 6 years, all things going well.
3. DEO. As above - ADFA, i.e. 3 years. All going well.

I would not reject the ADFA option however the sooner you start, the sooner you finish. Fast jets is a young man's game. Do a degree - ANY degree. It really doesn't matter what you do. It's free, and may stand you in good stead latter on in life.

4. Read this thread!!!

thank you both

sorry but this has lead to new questions:sad:, am i able to apply for both and then if rejected by one focus on the other?

Also what is the main difference between DEO and ADFA on the basis of applying and passing the tests, is DEO a harder test and academically or in the prospective of the officers and pshyicoligist view of you?

I appoligise if these questions have been answered previously and are greatful for any responces:ok:

I really didn't want to do this, but in the interests of getting the good gen out to the younguns I offer the following:
Name with luck (aka Daniel): 16 years, cadets for 4 years, over 50 hours gliding time and about to go first solo powered.
My humble self: 49 years, started RAAF pilots course 26 years ago, over 9,000 hours total including over 8,500 hours military, current QFI at ...... Tamworth.
The PSA will assess your maturity. I have seen some quite young candidates display impressive maturity. Of course "life experience" is desirable, but certainly not essential. I have seen some fairly unimpressive types with plenty of "life experience", and who demonstrate difficulty adapting to the ADF way of doing things.
If my last post was read as intended I am not advocating either the DEO or ADFA route, just trying to illustrate some differences.

Avalanche07, over to you. Unfortuntely I can't answer your last questions. I suggest you contact your nearest DFR recruiting office.

Avalanche07, at the end of the day mate, whether you want to pursue ADFA or not is your decision, and whether one bloke thinks you should and another thinks you shouldn't won't really help you all that much.

For me, I viewed ADFA as an opportunity to build on the areas that, at the time, I felt I was lacking. For example a bit of life experience, maturity, confidence etc. So while I was at school that was my option, however things for me changed, and I went DEO.

You need to ask yourself questions such as, are you ready to tackle DEO straight after school? Be honest with yourself. That will help you more in making your decision than getting the opinions of anyone who cares to share.

Besides there has been plenty of discussion on the topic, and all related questions you're asking. Read the thread! It might take you numerous sittings over a couple of days but there's plenty to be drawn from this thread in both hard facts and opinions.

Cheers,





Nick

PS, It's my opinion that whether you go ADFA or DEO shouldn't really relate to your chances, or rather, perceived chances of getting in!

Hello all,

A quick question..

When you completed assessment day and your file was sent to PSA, did you receive a confirmation letter from PSA that your file had been received?

Mine was sent a couple of weeks ago but I have heard the processing of applications can take a bit of time. How long did yours take?

On another note is there any way of finding out how competitive your application is, or is it simply just a waiting game?

Cheers, Gezzill

hey again

thankyou to all this advise is, well rather encouraging. I was expecting alot less so thanks again. And am sencerly sorry if anything has put anyone in a place of discomfort:uhoh:.

to those that are going on a course soon good luck :ok::)

Cody

Gezzill, tis a bit of a waiting game! :ugh:

You will get a letter confirming PSA have received your file! The length of time it takes from assessment day to getting that letter varies, I had to wait almost 4 weeks. Others I know, it only took 2 weeks, depends how busy they are!

Once you do get that letter, they probably still have to process your file, which can take a week or two. But there is a phone number on the letter you can call, and once they have processed your file, they may let you know the competitiveness of it!

TR

Thanks for the selection process material Daniel, there was a lot of good information. I suggest anyone else looking for information to contact Name with Luck also.

One piece of advice from someone that has a military background, it probably would have been better to not to tell Captain Sand Dune your name and FSP date... being a Grey Man has its advantages!! haha

For the young guys, my suggestion would be to apply for ADFA. I had the opportunity to help train some of the students in Military Self Defence a few years ago and it looks like a great place to learn. A large number of them, however, had a long way to go before they were ready for military life.

Good luck to all,

Juzz

Before you guys make the decision on the next 15 working years in your life, i'd just remind you that only the best make it to fast jets. Only 150-200 roughly make it to FSP per year. 50-60 will graduate from 2FTS and out of those about 10 will make it to fast jet conversion, then only half of them will pass and be selected to fly a Hornet. If your not one of them, then you better enjoy flying a cargo plane because there's not much other choice in the RAAF.

My flight instructor at my current flying school actually quit the defence force recently, he passed everything and was half way through his 2FTS when he decided to leave. He didn't want to spend the next decade flying twice a week only. Also he said the air force is full at the moment, flying commercial would be a better option. Also you better get used to preparing 10 hours for every 1 hour flight in the Hornet, providing you get there. If you don't, you better be okay with seeing Hornets all during your ROSO and wanting to fly them knowing you can't. I'm not trying to discourage you, i'm just trying to open your eyes so you have a better understanding of what your getting into.

Anyway I hope your applications go well! I also wish you many triumphs with your flying careers! :ok:

Oh yeah? "Decided to leave", eh?:hmm:

@BlackPrince77

I'm just going to take this opportunity to expand on some things you have said just to keep it fair and shed a different light on it.

SRG operate the Wedgetail and the Orions, with plenty of travelling opportunities to go with it. South East Asia, Middle East, Hawaii etc etc. Same can be said with ALG. Those C-17 boys get to travel all over the globe, and have heard of trips to some interesting places including Europe, USA, Canada, Alaska, China etc etc, on top of conducting Operations in the Middle East... Better than flying commercial and doing the same old sectors over and over again, being a slave to the airlines route/market choices.

I'm sure you weren't mocking those aircraft types but a recently graduated pilot can find himself going from a single engined turboprop to a multi jet engined aircraft within a few months (maybe a year if they don't clear the backlog) and quickly discover he's sitting in a bar downtown Honolulu. And if he's a good copilot, or wingman, he'll be buying the crew the first round. Thats progression you won't see in the civvy world.

I join good old Captain Sand Dune's skepticism about your flight instructor, but I don't know the guy so I won't pass judgement. However what I was going to say is that flying twice a week maybe the case sometimes, but not all the time. There are periods where you are flying up to 100 hours in the month, particularly for some ALG pilots. Jet pilots also can log large amounts of hours, all of them command too. Flying in the RAAF always comes in crests and troughs as we are at the mercy of operational tempo. Sometimes it can be high, like with all the natural disasters happening domestically and internationally. Other times low, but it all works out to be a fairly consistent rate of flying.

The RAAF is not full... just a little round around the edges due to a less than normal departure rate because of a lack of commercial airline hiring. That being said, you do not have any less of a chance of getting through the recruitment process than you did a few years ago. The RAAF will always take pilots because there is only one way you'll get fresh blood... recruit, recruit, recruit. And if you ask any pilot in the ADF, fresh blood is a VERY good thing. If you want to go commercial, be prepared to fork out alot of money to get there and spend alot of time with charter, regional etc etc before you get to the airlines... Why not let the RAAF fast track you to command on multi engine aircraft for 10 years then move on if thats what you want. Also as mentioned, airlines aren't hiring much at the moment so I expect the civilian world is suffering from a backlog of qualified pilots at the moment and jobs would be a little on the light side, if not then atleast highly competitive. I'm not in that industry so I can't say that with much certainty but one can logically make that conclusion.

Yes its hard work to get there and even harder whilst you are there, but I wouldn't expect flying 500+ knots at 150' AGL all while trying to defeat enemy platforms and employing weapon systems to be easy. Jet pilots do alot of study but only those deserving of it get it... Its pretty simple really, do the hard yards, or die in combat.

I have met many pilots who have attempted jets, scrubbed, flown other aircraft types and then get a second shot at it only to be successful. I've also met alot of pilots who've scrubbed and enjoyed the other world so much they don't care about jets anymore. Each to their own I guess but generally speaking it doesn't matter which aircraft type you fly in the RAAF... You'll get an incredible kick out of being part of a squadron flying unique aircraft to places not many get to see with people you'll be friends with for the rest of your lives.

Just my two cents on the RAAF and a different perspective. All competely and utterly unbiased ofcourse :}

I finally got to attend my citizenship ceremony this morning and have mailed DFR a copy of my certificate. Boy! Was it the most anxious and a little frustrating wait since Assessment day [did it June last year], having to wait for the immigration paperwork to be cleared. Hopefully, fingers and toes crossed, my file will now be approved to be sent off to the PSA.

Btw spacemantan, a very encouraging and positive message. :ok:

Completely agree with you spacemantan,

I joined the RAAF the same day my schoolmate started a comparable civil aviation degree. He's getting a bit sick of flying for peanuts on shark patrol/skydiving/camera flights to get his hours up, 6 years later.

I'm having the time of my life as co-pilot with job stability, a set progression and the excitement of the unknown that comes with flying my platform.

As for ADFA vs DEO, I think recruiting were right to push me towards ADFA straight out of high school. It provided foundations in general military knowledge and attempted to instil in me the maturity required to be a good officer (which is what you are first, and a pilot second). Not that the average pilot's course maturity level is too high...

Good luck to Avalanche, Name With Luck etc, I wish I'd read this thread before I fumbled through recruiting a few years ago!

@Bp77

There's more to being a Raaf pilot than just flying.

Hey Guys,

I have a tricky question regarding the required order of events for becoming a pilot in the Army. If anyone can shed light on this it would be much appreciated...

I have recently been through the initial stages of my application for appointment as an Army GSO Pilot - Duntroon. I have done initial testing, and also passed pilot specific testing in Melbourne. I hurt my knee (nothing serious) playing footy about a week prior to my Assessment Day, and had to postpone it a couple of months to ensure I was fully fit for the medical.

However, I was very keen to go into Duntroon in the July 2011 intake (civilian employment is just too painful), and this is where my question arises:


I understand that I still need to have my Assessment Day, have my file sent and accepted for FSP, go to FSP and pass before going into the pool where I wait for an offer. I also acknowledge that this can be a lengthy process, and there is absolutely no chance of having all of this done before the July intake at Duntroon this year.

Can I go through the selection process and enter Duntroon as a standard GSO (defence recruiter has confirmed I should be able to get it all done for upcoming July intake) and apply for GSO pilot from there? I'm 90% sure I have read somewhere on this board that I can apply for Flight Screening whilst at Duntroon, and if accepted, attend the FSP during my tenure at Duntroon. All going well, I would progress into ADF Basic Flying Training upon graduation from Duntroon...



Is this correct?

I have asked DFR about this but they are unsure. I also understand that there is a risk of not being accepted as a Pilot once in Duntroon, and will be required to complete my Return of Service obligation as a GSO in another Corps.

I look forward to any help on this!

Thanks and regards,

Mitcho

Mitcho,

Yeah you can do that.

Might be worth a call to RMC or PSA to find out specifics. It's more their deal than DFR's.

Greetings all,

I've recently joined this forum as I'm in the process of trying for SSO entry to the Army Aviation corp and there seems to be a wealth of knowledge and experience here.

I've just been offered a place on the FSP in early June - perhaps proving that's it's never too late to enlist! (I'm almost 39 years old).

Hey Mitcho, I got the impression from a question I asked at DFR that you could indeed apply for the FSP whilst at Duntroon but from what I gather on this and other forums, don't take anything DFR say as gospel! I would imagine you definitely run the risk of having to work out your ROSO in another Corp if you enlist as a GSO.

Sandrews and Basalt,

Thanks for the replies; it's much appreciated. Im comfortable with the risk of having to work out my ROSO in another Corp... purely because I know that there are other things that I can do as an officer in the Army that still beat the vast majority of civilian jobs.

Ive had what I used to consider my 'dream job' in financial markets... earning big bucks for a young guy. When I would look around at the old dogs that had been doing it for years though, it really makes you wonder if its worth wasting your life stressed out in front of a bunch of screens for a few extra dollars (usually spent drowning your sorrows on the piss anyway). I want to be a chopper pilot... but whatever happens I know ill be challenged, enjoy an active lifestyle, and wind up with plenty of mates and a few good stories.

Anyways, awesome thread.

Mitcho

Hello all,

First up, this site has been a huge help over the last few months, so a big thank you to all of you for sharing your experiences.

You've probably guessed it already, yes, I am (yet another) prospective ADF Pilot hoping to work his way through the application process.:}

So far so good.

I've done my aptitude and psych testing (the 'video games' with joysticks) and so far came up fairly well with everything.

They took a gander at my school cert and it says SA- for Math B

Not acceptable.:{

I'm looking around for a few bridging courses but DFR won't give a straight answer on whether a given course is acceptable as a replacement for Math B.:mad::ugh:

Can anyone point me in the right direction?

Also would help if there's any Navy Helo Pilots here - that's what I'm aiming for. (Blasphemy, I know; but I'll take landing on a moving ship, at night, in a storm, over fast jets-without a second thought:})

==================================

A bit of background info - I'm 22, in Brisbane, and during high school I couldn't decide between being a Navy Heli-Pilot immediately, or doing a bit of gallavanting while I still had some freedom (without a ROSO to tie me down)

I did the gallavanting.

Now I want in. :E


p.s - the name comes from my 'other' job - chemistry student.
p.p.s -sorry about the length :O