View Poll Results: Should the RAF absorb the FAA/AAC?
Yes!
9
15.79%
Yes, that is a top idea.
32
56.14%
No, I'm gay
16
28.07%
Voters: 57. This poll is closed
Should the RAF absorb the FAA/AAC?
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Always_broken_in_wilts:
Guess you are a door slider then. Well PPRuNe stands for Proffesional Pilots Rumour Network. Not National institution of F------- Door Sliders, if you want too subscibe to this forum - go and get the Quals & become a Pilot. Otherwise shut the F--- Up.
A bit strong I admit- I have great respect for all SNCO Pilots/Flight Engs/ Loadmasters/ Aircrewman-Women. Interservice rivallary has over stepped the mark, remember at the end of the day you all work for the same company.
Also a good point to note A.B.i.w, everyone has to leave the service one day. A tattooed SNCO pilot in the AAC with a ATPL(A)/(H) is in a lot better position than you.
Hope I have the pleasure of meeting you when you leave the Military - at an interview perhaps?. Oh . My Company does not employ Ballast!
Guess you are a door slider then. Well PPRuNe stands for Proffesional Pilots Rumour Network. Not National institution of F------- Door Sliders, if you want too subscibe to this forum - go and get the Quals & become a Pilot. Otherwise shut the F--- Up.
A bit strong I admit- I have great respect for all SNCO Pilots/Flight Engs/ Loadmasters/ Aircrewman-Women. Interservice rivallary has over stepped the mark, remember at the end of the day you all work for the same company.
Also a good point to note A.B.i.w, everyone has to leave the service one day. A tattooed SNCO pilot in the AAC with a ATPL(A)/(H) is in a lot better position than you.
Hope I have the pleasure of meeting you when you leave the Military - at an interview perhaps?. Oh . My Company does not employ Ballast!
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I hate to say it Dr, but I agree. ABiW, no stick, no vote. Ballast, I'd rather carry a few more pies. Remember, you are twenty minutes worth of fuel.
ABiW, I take it you've not done much tie at 850 or you resent the fact that 'the master race' plays second fiddle to proper work?
Dr W, a small point on an otherwise correct post, please don't group SNCO pilots with the fodder of rear crew in the Air Farce. thanks. They know they wannabe but can't.
ABiW, I take it you've not done much tie at 850 or you resent the fact that 'the master race' plays second fiddle to proper work?
Dr W, a small point on an otherwise correct post, please don't group SNCO pilots with the fodder of rear crew in the Air Farce. thanks. They know they wannabe but can't.
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Dear Tampon,
Look at Vortexsplurg and go figure.......we think he represents the army quite admirably................
or is that fluid "romany"
You'r correct I am a loadie but I am a happy soul. I earn plenty and all i do is make tea and coffee...ish. I am in till I am 55, another 10 years, and having made some fairly astute financial plans that's when I will retire.
Your exit date is.............?
So rest assured that you and your tatooed sun reading brethrin will never see me,or my ilk
Hey Yoevil fellow,
Best part of 3 years in theatre, reds on a weekly basis, and as I recall it was percy who worked while you sat at 2 grand with the gate guards on board waitng for something to happen......or tell me I'm wrong............as regards extra pies........ with 8 centurians on board how many could you carry........ our survey said!!!!!!
Most days I love my job and this is one of the best
all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced
Look at Vortexsplurg and go figure.......we think he represents the army quite admirably................
or is that fluid "romany"
You'r correct I am a loadie but I am a happy soul. I earn plenty and all i do is make tea and coffee...ish. I am in till I am 55, another 10 years, and having made some fairly astute financial plans that's when I will retire.
Your exit date is.............?
So rest assured that you and your tatooed sun reading brethrin will never see me,or my ilk
Hey Yoevil fellow,
Best part of 3 years in theatre, reds on a weekly basis, and as I recall it was percy who worked while you sat at 2 grand with the gate guards on board waitng for something to happen......or tell me I'm wrong............as regards extra pies........ with 8 centurians on board how many could you carry........ our survey said!!!!!!
Most days I love my job and this is one of the best
all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced
Last edited by Always_broken_in_wilts; 3rd Dec 2002 at 11:19.
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A-B-I-W,
You really are a kn@b aren't you?
Thought that I'd pitch in with my own two penneth worth as a former, quote "SNCO, normally a "tatooed f@@kwit", unquote. I was also one of the Lynx 5 commander that you refer to or should I say, had to defer to?
You and your mates must have been real hero's though I can't say that I remember the legend of your great "rescue".
Glad that you are happy to have a further 10 years in the job, that you should give you plenty to wine about on PPRUNE.
Interesting observation about the tatoos, checked myself all over and couldn't find a single blemish.
"f@@kwit"?, well me old slider matey, did the course (CAA recognised whether you like it or not), got the qualification, passed the licence with no problemo and found myself a flying job in aviation prior to leaving after serving my full time.
Difference between me and you? I had no fear of the world outside of the Services and was looking forward to the challenge.
If they had disbanded the AAC I would have been qualified to transfer my talents to Civvy Street, where exactly would you go with your "Aviation" quals? I/C loading freight at Stanstead?
Would be quite interesting if they did bring the Navy and Army air assets under RAF control, then all of those "SNCO, tatooed f@@kwits" could be commisioned with the rest of the "Qualified Service Pilots", above you and the rest of the talking freight.
K43 a year eh! Wow, swoon. Sorry, on that already with healthy, well above inflation, pay rises year on year and no wars to fight and loads of time off. Oh, I forgot, I get a military pension as well.
You really are a kn@b aren't you?
Thought that I'd pitch in with my own two penneth worth as a former, quote "SNCO, normally a "tatooed f@@kwit", unquote. I was also one of the Lynx 5 commander that you refer to or should I say, had to defer to?
You and your mates must have been real hero's though I can't say that I remember the legend of your great "rescue".
Glad that you are happy to have a further 10 years in the job, that you should give you plenty to wine about on PPRUNE.
Interesting observation about the tatoos, checked myself all over and couldn't find a single blemish.
"f@@kwit"?, well me old slider matey, did the course (CAA recognised whether you like it or not), got the qualification, passed the licence with no problemo and found myself a flying job in aviation prior to leaving after serving my full time.
Difference between me and you? I had no fear of the world outside of the Services and was looking forward to the challenge.
If they had disbanded the AAC I would have been qualified to transfer my talents to Civvy Street, where exactly would you go with your "Aviation" quals? I/C loading freight at Stanstead?
Would be quite interesting if they did bring the Navy and Army air assets under RAF control, then all of those "SNCO, tatooed f@@kwits" could be commisioned with the rest of the "Qualified Service Pilots", above you and the rest of the talking freight.
K43 a year eh! Wow, swoon. Sorry, on that already with healthy, well above inflation, pay rises year on year and no wars to fight and loads of time off. Oh, I forgot, I get a military pension as well.
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Girls, Girls Girls!!! Nuf with the cat-fight!!!
This inter service abuse does no-one credit.
The FAA should get big flat ships and continue to do all that poor man's Top-Gun homo-erotic stuff. The Army should be allowed to fill the skies over the battlefield with their PPL helocopter force and as soon as they have the training/engineering/supervisory infrastructure then they can play with the expensive toys. The RAF should do what it does best which is..er..refuelling the US Navy jets over Iraq.
Seriously, a place for everyone and everyone in their place. Its just that the RAF's place is above everyone else, looking down and bombing them.
This inter service abuse does no-one credit.
The FAA should get big flat ships and continue to do all that poor man's Top-Gun homo-erotic stuff. The Army should be allowed to fill the skies over the battlefield with their PPL helocopter force and as soon as they have the training/engineering/supervisory infrastructure then they can play with the expensive toys. The RAF should do what it does best which is..er..refuelling the US Navy jets over Iraq.
Seriously, a place for everyone and everyone in their place. Its just that the RAF's place is above everyone else, looking down and bombing them.
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A.B.I.W.
What a sad soul you are, bragging about your salary '
I earn 43K index linked and all i do is make tea and coffee' Iam sure that the Tabloids would have a field day with that quote.
Be very carefull before posting your next Tread - your in serious danger of shooting yourself and all your fellow sliders in the foot.
What a sad soul you are, bragging about your salary '
I earn 43K index linked and all i do is make tea and coffee' Iam sure that the Tabloids would have a field day with that quote.
Be very carefull before posting your next Tread - your in serious danger of shooting yourself and all your fellow sliders in the foot.
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Having posted my last and seen the way the thread is going I should add more!!
1. ABiW - I have more than you in trust funds and I do F**k all for that! Therefore you are not the greatest!
2, DrW OUTSTANDING RETORTS - keep them up!
3. What ever the outcome of this thread the world is two thirds water and we will always need Naval aviation just as we always need refuellers in the crabs just as the Army will need battlefield support. SO dare I suggest that we just get on with it! NOT all of us feel the need to be written up for DFC's after evry outing! AND before you say with haven't been or done anything I would think very long and hard!
HAPPY CHRISTMAS!
1. ABiW - I have more than you in trust funds and I do F**k all for that! Therefore you are not the greatest!
2, DrW OUTSTANDING RETORTS - keep them up!
3. What ever the outcome of this thread the world is two thirds water and we will always need Naval aviation just as we always need refuellers in the crabs just as the Army will need battlefield support. SO dare I suggest that we just get on with it! NOT all of us feel the need to be written up for DFC's after evry outing! AND before you say with haven't been or done anything I would think very long and hard!
HAPPY CHRISTMAS!
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Nah, I see it more as a reversion to the way things should have always been before somebody allowed the formation of the RAF. Get the crabs back to where they should always have been ... supporting the troops/fishheads instead of allowing them to build the huge empire they have now. What with ante'd up ranks to ensure they always have the upper hand when it comes to organisations of similar size and importance ... witness Squadron Leaders who only (just) lead Flights. Drop all the crab ranks by one and reap the financial benefits for the nation, that way the Firemen could get a 50% pay rise!!!!!!!!
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The beauty of Military Aircrew forum is the banter between the three services which, if normally inaccurate and irrelevant is normally quite amusing.
Rarely is anyone's profesionalism seriously questioned and rarely is any of the banter personal.
Wiltshire Boy. You cross the gentleman's line on both counts. Tatooed Fu**wits, Limpwristed Fu**ers. Oh dear!
Also suggesting that anyone who uses this forum would, as a matter of course reqularly breaks the rules just because they are told to sends out the wrong signals to everyone.
Red card in my opinion.
As was mentioned earlier in the thread. Banter or Bile, know the difference
Rarely is anyone's profesionalism seriously questioned and rarely is any of the banter personal.
Wiltshire Boy. You cross the gentleman's line on both counts. Tatooed Fu**wits, Limpwristed Fu**ers. Oh dear!
Also suggesting that anyone who uses this forum would, as a matter of course reqularly breaks the rules just because they are told to sends out the wrong signals to everyone.
Red card in my opinion.
As was mentioned earlier in the thread. Banter or Bile, know the difference
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ABIW Almost funny about 43K for being a tea boy. Trouble is some people will believe you especially the press. That attitude will certainly not do us any favours especially with people like the Job Evaluation Teams. I think you should take a bit more pride in your present fixed wing job as you and I know that there is a lot more to do that make tea and coffee, oh yes and use your microwave.
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TR,
Quelle surprise! You post a forum about doing away with the FAA/AAC! No one would ever guess who you work for. Sadly, the embittered higher elements of the light blue have almost had their way - or have they? Yep, fixed wing aviation within the FAA ends 2006. Four GR7/GR9 squadrons stand up, two light blue, two dark blue. Now which ones do you think will be going to sea regularly? Thats fine, we understand - you never joined the RAF to go to sea - fairs, fair. Just don't start bitching in 2010 when Eurofighter is still having snags, can't find host nation support etc. We'll just leave the "fisheads" to do what they always do (hopefully in their shiny new F-35), fly off the carrier, miles away from the nearest Marriot/Hilton/whatever and do the job that they are paid for - serve our country - not our self-interest. Perhaps the trend will reverse? Instead of these apparent legions of transferees to the April 01 squad - we might see professional, focussed (sic?) pilots wishing to transfer to the FAA. You never know - Tony could stil be there playing with his new toy carriers.
It's not worse, it's just different.
Quelle surprise! You post a forum about doing away with the FAA/AAC! No one would ever guess who you work for. Sadly, the embittered higher elements of the light blue have almost had their way - or have they? Yep, fixed wing aviation within the FAA ends 2006. Four GR7/GR9 squadrons stand up, two light blue, two dark blue. Now which ones do you think will be going to sea regularly? Thats fine, we understand - you never joined the RAF to go to sea - fairs, fair. Just don't start bitching in 2010 when Eurofighter is still having snags, can't find host nation support etc. We'll just leave the "fisheads" to do what they always do (hopefully in their shiny new F-35), fly off the carrier, miles away from the nearest Marriot/Hilton/whatever and do the job that they are paid for - serve our country - not our self-interest. Perhaps the trend will reverse? Instead of these apparent legions of transferees to the April 01 squad - we might see professional, focussed (sic?) pilots wishing to transfer to the FAA. You never know - Tony could stil be there playing with his new toy carriers.
It's not worse, it's just different.
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Naval Officers = Gentlemen trying to be officers
Army Officers = Officers trying to be gentlemen
RAF Officers = Half Officers wearing shell suits that are neither trying to be both
Army Officers = Officers trying to be gentlemen
RAF Officers = Half Officers wearing shell suits that are neither trying to be both
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Hey drumstick,
Just got back from a trip to Crete, fetched some very happy sailors back to blighty for a spot of r+r I really do love my job. Quiet night in Souda followed by a nice flight home.....pity a bit of CAT gave at least one pax a hard time as she "barked for britain"......poor lass
I have to ask tho', did you find my tongue in cheek banter offensive as I found your oppo's refering to me and the like as dna ballast etc. My motto is live by the sword and die by it old fella so if you slag me I slag you......very childish I know but fair.
I have very fond memories of a few of the characters who drove lynx 5/9 etc none more so than a very very large chap called "chas" Top geezer
But for those of you who took umbridge at my comments go pester the guy who issued the initial "glove to the ALM chops". We are just honest geezers doing a job we enjoy and don't need putting down in that rather rude manner.
Nuff said.
all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced
PS Its not 43....that was a typo......but it was almost right.
Just got back from a trip to Crete, fetched some very happy sailors back to blighty for a spot of r+r
I really do love my job. Quiet night in Souda followed by a nice flight home.....pity a bit of CAT gave at least one pax a hard time as she "barked for britain"......poor lassI have to ask tho', did you find my tongue in cheek banter offensive as I found your oppo's refering to me and the like as dna ballast etc. My motto is live by the sword and die by it old fella so if you slag me I slag you......very childish I know but fair.
I have very fond memories of a few of the characters who drove lynx 5/9 etc none more so than a very very large chap called "chas" Top geezer
But for those of you who took umbridge at my comments go pester the guy who issued the initial "glove to the ALM chops". We are just honest geezers doing a job we enjoy and don't need putting down in that rather rude manner.
Nuff said.
all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced
PS Its not 43....that was a typo......but it was almost right.
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ABIW,
You are not honest, you certainly are not a geezer, and if you put others down in a rude manner then expect the same to happen to you.
The RAF cannot manage what we have let alone taking on the responsibility of more aircrew and equipment,
And don't try and make out you are fishing!!
Go and enjoy your money.
MADS
You are not honest, you certainly are not a geezer, and if you put others down in a rude manner then expect the same to happen to you.
The RAF cannot manage what we have let alone taking on the responsibility of more aircrew and equipment,
And don't try and make out you are fishing!!
Go and enjoy your money.
MADS
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Hi Mad bloke......thanks for the input but you have left me just a tad confused
You are not honest..........have we met?
you certainly are not a geezer.......see above
and if you put others down in a rude manner then expect the same to happen to you........read from the start young man, I know it's a very childish sentiment but I did not start this vitriol..........
The RAF cannot manage what we have let alone taking on the responsibility of more aircrew and equipment.............when did I say I aggree with this thread as I don't.
And don't try and make out you are fishing!!.........I'm not
Go and enjoy your money........I am
Thanks for dropping in
all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced
PS 6N........apologies as you are correct. I have removed the offending verbage with little change to the overall sentiment. I imagine this will still probably annoy a few of the petulant ones but "people who throw stones etc"
You are not honest..........have we met?
you certainly are not a geezer.......see above
and if you put others down in a rude manner then expect the same to happen to you........read from the start young man, I know it's a very childish sentiment
but I did not start this vitriol.......... The RAF cannot manage what we have let alone taking on the responsibility of more aircrew and equipment.............when did I say I aggree with this thread as I don't.
And don't try and make out you are fishing!!.........I'm not
Go and enjoy your money........I am
Thanks for dropping in
all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced
PS 6N........apologies as you are correct. I have removed the offending verbage with little change to the overall sentiment. I imagine this will still probably annoy a few of the petulant ones but "people who throw stones etc"
Last edited by Always_broken_in_wilts; 3rd Dec 2002 at 11:26.
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Training Risky
I am not really an expert on this, i am only a cadet so i am very open to all input. You were talking about the army using the RAF support helicopters, but what i am talking about is the need for transport on section/fireteam level, as well as attack helicopters. Were all 3 air services (i do not know what to call them) merged, the navy and the army would want a selection of aircraft avaliable for thier use, when and where the army/navy commanders want it, and not having to go through the RAF, therefore you may as well have three seperate organisations. Seconds can matter in a firefight on the ground, and having to go through the RAF systems to get support is wasting valuble seconds and therefore lives, whereas just having to get on the radio to the assigned AAC unit would give them those extra seconds.
If you have contrary beliefs please express them as i am still trying to gain as much knowledge from experienced people such as yourself as possible.
I am not really an expert on this, i am only a cadet so i am very open to all input. You were talking about the army using the RAF support helicopters, but what i am talking about is the need for transport on section/fireteam level, as well as attack helicopters. Were all 3 air services (i do not know what to call them) merged, the navy and the army would want a selection of aircraft avaliable for thier use, when and where the army/navy commanders want it, and not having to go through the RAF, therefore you may as well have three seperate organisations. Seconds can matter in a firefight on the ground, and having to go through the RAF systems to get support is wasting valuble seconds and therefore lives, whereas just having to get on the radio to the assigned AAC unit would give them those extra seconds.
If you have contrary beliefs please express them as i am still trying to gain as much knowledge from experienced people such as yourself as possible.
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Well Waggy,
It may be a bit naive to think that the merger would cut back on the expensive admin, pen pushers that all three services have, allowing more money to be actually spend on the stuff that matters hardware?
The services will then have a smaller but more efficient support chain where less squabling over where the best hotels really are will allow for a more rapid response in keeping with the current war on terrorism.
It may be a bit naive to think that the merger would cut back on the expensive admin, pen pushers that all three services have, allowing more money to be actually spend on the stuff that matters hardware?
The services will then have a smaller but more efficient support chain where less squabling over where the best hotels really are will allow for a more rapid response in keeping with the current war on terrorism.
Last edited by Accelerometer; 6th Dec 2002 at 22:06.
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I believe there has alrady been one abortive attempt to subsume Naval and Army Aviation into a light blue, badly tailored guise....It failed.
Concur wholeheatedly with the notion that any airmobile unit requires direct helo control from operators who have experience of yomping/tabbing/waiting for the whites of their eyes.
True darkblue helos remain a ships' weapons system driven by a stickmonkey but faught by the observer - would you let him be captain?.
As to weather, crew duty, et al - paddy/ saddam/ osama doesn't respect those I'm afraid and when the boys need picking up you pick them up. If you haven't tested your limits how are you going to know when the chips are down. It's not about what uniform you wear, it's about getting the job done for the boys.
Oh keep your hotels, 10 hours a day off (plus whatever you get at night). Flying in support of anyone from a tent on Dartmoor in December is ample reward for not having to wear a 1917 uniform rejected by the Polish Army on taste grounds.
Concur wholeheatedly with the notion that any airmobile unit requires direct helo control from operators who have experience of yomping/tabbing/waiting for the whites of their eyes.
True darkblue helos remain a ships' weapons system driven by a stickmonkey but faught by the observer - would you let him be captain?.
As to weather, crew duty, et al - paddy/ saddam/ osama doesn't respect those I'm afraid and when the boys need picking up you pick them up. If you haven't tested your limits how are you going to know when the chips are down. It's not about what uniform you wear, it's about getting the job done for the boys.
Oh keep your hotels, 10 hours a day off (plus whatever you get at night). Flying in support of anyone from a tent on Dartmoor in December is ample reward for not having to wear a 1917 uniform rejected by the Polish Army on taste grounds.