Possible RAF Harrier MidAir Collision Meham, Norway 1982
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Possible RAF Harrier MidAir Collision Meham, Norway 1982
Hi!
Thought maybe someone on this forum could cast some light on this new "old" thread. All taken from www.nrk.no
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New focus on 20-year old aircrash
A new tv documentary reveals new information not previously known to the public on the "Gamvik-accident" twenty years ago.
Publisert 19.11.2002 14:05
In March 1982 a Norwegian civil airplane with 15 people crashed outside of the coast of Finnmark in Northern Norway, not far from the Soviet border.
The crew and the passangers were all killed.
Three official inquiries have all stated that there were no other air traffic in the area at the time of the accident.
In a tv documentary tonight on Norwegian National Broadcasting a number of witnesses show that this conclusion is wrong.
In the programme, both locals and people from the Norwegian defense tell the same story. Two defense intelligence reports tell the same. They have all observed British fighters in the area at the time of the accident. Two British Harrier fighters were observed. One of the fighters was followed by several witnesses from where the sivil airplane disappeared and all the way to it's base in Tromsø. A Norwegian pilot observed a Harrier landing in Tromsø with signs of damage.
These observations mean that the Harriers crossed a forbidden zone. During the cold war military aircrafts where not allowed to fly East of 24 degrees longitude, not to provoke the Soviet Union.
In March 1982 the Nato exercise Alloy Express took place in Northern Norway. The RAF exercised tactical flyoperations.
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Best regards
Thought maybe someone on this forum could cast some light on this new "old" thread. All taken from www.nrk.no
------
New focus on 20-year old aircrash
A new tv documentary reveals new information not previously known to the public on the "Gamvik-accident" twenty years ago.
Publisert 19.11.2002 14:05
In March 1982 a Norwegian civil airplane with 15 people crashed outside of the coast of Finnmark in Northern Norway, not far from the Soviet border.
The crew and the passangers were all killed.
Three official inquiries have all stated that there were no other air traffic in the area at the time of the accident.
In a tv documentary tonight on Norwegian National Broadcasting a number of witnesses show that this conclusion is wrong.
In the programme, both locals and people from the Norwegian defense tell the same story. Two defense intelligence reports tell the same. They have all observed British fighters in the area at the time of the accident. Two British Harrier fighters were observed. One of the fighters was followed by several witnesses from where the sivil airplane disappeared and all the way to it's base in Tromsø. A Norwegian pilot observed a Harrier landing in Tromsø with signs of damage.
These observations mean that the Harriers crossed a forbidden zone. During the cold war military aircrafts where not allowed to fly East of 24 degrees longitude, not to provoke the Soviet Union.
In March 1982 the Nato exercise Alloy Express took place in Northern Norway. The RAF exercised tactical flyoperations.
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Best regards
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record from "crashdatabase.com"
Date: 03/11/1982
Location: Mehamn, Norway
Airline: Wideroe's Flyveselksap
Aircraft: de Havilland Canada DHC-6 Twin Otter 300
Registration: LN-BNK
Fatalities/No. Aboard: 15:15
Details: The aircraft crashed while on a flight from Berlevåg to Mehamn after the failure of the tail fin and rudder in moderate turbulence. Overload due to a combination of clear air turbulence, mountain wave and the pilots spontaneous improper actions. There is some controversy surrounding this crash including the possiblity the aircraft was shot down by a NATO jet fighter.
Location: Mehamn, Norway
Airline: Wideroe's Flyveselksap
Aircraft: de Havilland Canada DHC-6 Twin Otter 300
Registration: LN-BNK
Fatalities/No. Aboard: 15:15
Details: The aircraft crashed while on a flight from Berlevåg to Mehamn after the failure of the tail fin and rudder in moderate turbulence. Overload due to a combination of clear air turbulence, mountain wave and the pilots spontaneous improper actions. There is some controversy surrounding this crash including the possiblity the aircraft was shot down by a NATO jet fighter.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
BBC - Wednesday, 20 November
Norway probes 1982 mystery crash
The Norwegian Government has ordered an investigation into the possible involvement of British fighter jets in the mysterious crash of a Norwegian commuter plane 20 years ago. The Twin Otter plane crashed into the sea in Norway's Arctic north in March 1982, killing all 15 people on board.
Earlier investigations concluded the plane's tail fin had been damaged by turbulence, and discounted reports by witnesses who said they had seen British fighter planes close to the crash site. But a documentary aired by Norwegian television on Tuesday featured several witnesses - including a retired Norwegian air force officer - saying two Royal Air Force plane approached the site just before the accident.
Transport Minister Torild Skogsholm said she would establish a special investigating commission within a few days.
The accident occurred in Norway's northernmost province of Finnmark. Although Norway - like Britain - is a member of Nato, it declared Finnmark off limits to the alliance during the Cold War. Norway was worried military activity in the province, might provoke the neighbouring Soviet Union.
In the television documentary retired Norwegian Lieutenant-Colonel Per Garvin said he watched by radar as two British Harriers entered Finnmark. He said one of the pilots requested an immediate landing because of technical problems after the commuter plane crashed.
"Even though I asked, he didn't say what sort of technical problems," Mr Garvin told the programme.
The documentary says at least 30 other witnesses reported seeing foreign aircraft over Finnmark on that day.
The Norwegian military said it would release all documents related to the crash.
Norway probes 1982 mystery crash
The Norwegian Government has ordered an investigation into the possible involvement of British fighter jets in the mysterious crash of a Norwegian commuter plane 20 years ago. The Twin Otter plane crashed into the sea in Norway's Arctic north in March 1982, killing all 15 people on board.
Earlier investigations concluded the plane's tail fin had been damaged by turbulence, and discounted reports by witnesses who said they had seen British fighter planes close to the crash site. But a documentary aired by Norwegian television on Tuesday featured several witnesses - including a retired Norwegian air force officer - saying two Royal Air Force plane approached the site just before the accident.
Transport Minister Torild Skogsholm said she would establish a special investigating commission within a few days.
The accident occurred in Norway's northernmost province of Finnmark. Although Norway - like Britain - is a member of Nato, it declared Finnmark off limits to the alliance during the Cold War. Norway was worried military activity in the province, might provoke the neighbouring Soviet Union.
In the television documentary retired Norwegian Lieutenant-Colonel Per Garvin said he watched by radar as two British Harriers entered Finnmark. He said one of the pilots requested an immediate landing because of technical problems after the commuter plane crashed.
"Even though I asked, he didn't say what sort of technical problems," Mr Garvin told the programme.
The documentary says at least 30 other witnesses reported seeing foreign aircraft over Finnmark on that day.
The Norwegian military said it would release all documents related to the crash.
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Raises more questions than answers, for example:
How did Mr Garvin know that the two aircraft he watched on radar were Harriers?
If one aircraft landed then there must be a record of that.
Where would the harriers have come from. 3 & 4 Sqdns were busy in Germany and had no out of area Ops in those days. Only leaves 1 Sqdn so mebbe someone on here knows what they were doing in 82.
Sounds like b*llocks to me.
How did Mr Garvin know that the two aircraft he watched on radar were Harriers?
If one aircraft landed then there must be a record of that.
Where would the harriers have come from. 3 & 4 Sqdns were busy in Germany and had no out of area Ops in those days. Only leaves 1 Sqdn so mebbe someone on here knows what they were doing in 82.
Sounds like b*llocks to me.
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similar case?
On a similar note, in Dubai in the 80s, a rumour was circulating that the Gulf Air 737 crash at Jebel Ali, in September 1983, was not caused by a bomb, but by a missile fired during local exercises.
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"If one aircraft landed then there must be a record of that. "
The landnings at Tromsoe and Bardufoss is fully recorded. Both belonged to No 1 sqd.
One possible reason for the sightings is the 2 RoNAF CF-104 operating in the area just after the crash was discovered.
The landnings at Tromsoe and Bardufoss is fully recorded. Both belonged to No 1 sqd.
One possible reason for the sightings is the 2 RoNAF CF-104 operating in the area just after the crash was discovered.
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re-opened
The case is being re-investigated anyhow. All norwegian military personell holding info. have been cleared to speak.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/2497043.stm
Things were pretty tense in 1982. Doesn't seem too unbelievable if you ask me.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/2497043.stm
Things were pretty tense in 1982. Doesn't seem too unbelievable if you ask me.
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No, but I was hoping for comments. I hope I'm not offending you, but this is an anonymous forum (the reason for PPRUNE in the first place?) and the right one for questions like this. From papers the last few days stories from an ex-RAF pilot explains how the harriers were in the area at the right time. What I find terrefying about the whole case is the apparent coverup.
The case will be solved this time, to many details have been published. I'm not after someone to blame, but I want to see the truth.
No, but I was hoping for comments. I hope I'm not offending you, but this is an anonymous forum (the reason for PPRUNE in the first place?) and the right one for questions like this. From papers the last few days stories from an ex-RAF pilot explains how the harriers were in the area at the right time. What I find terrefying about the whole case is the apparent coverup.
The case will be solved this time, to many details have been published. I'm not after someone to blame, but I want to see the truth.
Last edited by SlowAndSilly; 22nd Nov 2002 at 21:40.
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The program on norwegian tv is completely one-sided, they have not bothered to check any of their info.
The traffic log clearly states that the Harriers that landed at Bardufoss and Tromsoe could not have made it to the accident site and back. (Gr.3 with 2+ hours flight time?
)
Me and most colleauges (we have som paranoid chaps here as well
) here at Bardufoss thinks it all BS.
I hope the guys from No.41 sqn dos not get bothered by the media while they are here.
The traffic log clearly states that the Harriers that landed at Bardufoss and Tromsoe could not have made it to the accident site and back. (Gr.3 with 2+ hours flight time?
)Me and most colleauges (we have som paranoid chaps here as well
) here at Bardufoss thinks it all BS.I hope the guys from No.41 sqn dos not get bothered by the media while they are here.
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Tromso is an awfully long way from the site of the Twin Otter crash. About 200 miles if the D Tel map is accurate. Why the focus on RAF Harriers? Other aircraft must have been taking part in the exercise. Understand there were Jags as well, and maybe (?) US/NATO aircraft? Any thought on Sea Harriers? Were they in the area/on the exercise?? A Sea Harrier to the untrained eye would look like a GR3.
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Lets hear it from the people close to the incident. Is the 1 Sqn pilot who landed with technical problems shortly after the accident still with us? Any other 1 Sqn personnel from the detachment? Does the CAS read this forum?
Dick W
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Mid-air in Norway
IO at Airforce Radarstation, Lt. Alex Kverneland on record with positive ID of two Harriers from 1 Sq - c/s Red 1 and Red 2 - to have strayed east of 24 East 11. marsch 1982.
Ground-technician on record to day stating he observered som major scratches an dents in the belly-area of Harrier Red 2 that requested emergency landing at Bardufoss 11/3-82.
Wonder what really happened that day?
Ground-technician on record to day stating he observered som major scratches an dents in the belly-area of Harrier Red 2 that requested emergency landing at Bardufoss 11/3-82.
Wonder what really happened that day?
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Any thought on Sea Harriers? Were they in the area/on the exercise??
From what personel here remember, the Harrier that landed at Bardufoss sustained the damage when one wing landing gear collapsed during towing. (no gear pins)
Another thing, is that the Harrier landed with ordonance on board. This means that it made a ground stop at Bardufoss for arming after departing Tromsoe, not departing to the NE like some radar operator states 20 years later.
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Mid-air
Ground stop? Was the fighter on the ground at Bardufoss after Tromsoe-departure and before PAN and emergency landing again at Bardufoss? And why aint anybody coming forward with the reasonable answer if the know that it's all a hussle about gear pins and landing gear?
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CASualty
It shouldn't be embarrassing at all, if there's no skeletons in the locker. What's the fuss? On the other hand... If someone somewhere is trying to jam sensitive information. Well, flak and incoming are to be expected. Hopefully the new board of inquery will be outfitted with kevlar.