RAF Fitness Test
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RAF Fitness Test
Should the RAF fitness test be bought into line with the Army BPFA? After all, you never know when you may be called upon to evade the enemy if shot down, particularly in today's climate. Just a thought.
Absolutely. And while I'm at it, just to prove that I need to be fitter than the army to sit on my @rse and eat pies, I think I'll do it whilst wearing my charcoal suit. And a rucksack full of heavy things. And I'll jolly well run backwards too so there.
Or perhaps I'll just carry on swimming the channel every weekend so I can keep up with the navy.
Or perhaps I'll just carry on swimming the channel every weekend so I can keep up with the navy.
Funny how the RAF managed to survive its first 70 or so years without the need for such nonsense.....
Personally, I'd bin the $odding thing. Then I'd bin the whole blasted jockstrapping branch as well.....
Personally, I'd bin the $odding thing. Then I'd bin the whole blasted jockstrapping branch as well.....
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...and why do we need a SWIMMING test? I personally felt that if I was ever unfortunate to stumble overboard I would concentrate on FLOATING and wait for the Fisheads to come get me rather than striking out on me own for the nearest bit of Blighty.
(Incidentally...my "advice" to the Crashboat Crew was always a) rescue the aircrew 1st - that's Pilot THEN Observer, b) re-arrange all those switches in the way previously shown and finally c) stick a boathook into the flot bags and get rid of the evidence!!")
(Incidentally...my "advice" to the Crashboat Crew was always a) rescue the aircrew 1st - that's Pilot THEN Observer, b) re-arrange all those switches in the way previously shown and finally c) stick a boathook into the flot bags and get rid of the evidence!!")
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I'm well impressed by your well reasoned arguments. Propulike, i'm sorry to say you are a stereotypical view of our light blue brethren as seen by the pongos. You, along with BEagle are obviously loners in the aviation world to whom teamwork and crew management mean little. When you've got pongos on board, whether that be paras, SF or Air Despatchers (probably NCOs) do you not feel it your duty to carry out some of that leadership thing and at least perform as they would? After all, you are officers and can lead men, apparantly.
Listen, Duxy, don't presume to lecture me about crew resource management! If I ever have the misfortune to be invovlved in an accident with non-crew members on board, one of the first things I would do is to 'seek specialist advice' from others - a cornerstone of leadership, in case you didn't know. Just because I might happen to 'command' whoever is in the back doesn't mean that the knowledge of all aspects of survival would be exclusively mine. I'm sure that any Hoooligan would be far better placed to advise on E&E than I would, for example.
Sorry you didn't get the answer you wanted; it seems that it's you who's the loner in aviation from the replies posted to your question so far......
Sorry you didn't get the answer you wanted; it seems that it's you who's the loner in aviation from the replies posted to your question so far......
Last edited by BEagle; 7th Oct 2002 at 05:40.
Inter Arma Enim Silentius Lex Legis
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Ahh yes the fitness test, how vitally important. A whole empire has been built around it. And the swimming test too, which forms such an essential part of our learning in the Dingy Drills.
I don't think!!
You want to be a thick under paid pongo fine, join the Army and be stupid. We have enough muppets proposing changes on a daily basis as it is.
Early morning rant over!!
I don't think!!
You want to be a thick under paid pongo fine, join the Army and be stupid. We have enough muppets proposing changes on a daily basis as it is.
Early morning rant over!!
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I believe a distinction should be drawn between the terms "medically fit" and "physically fit". There is no doubt that aircrew are all medically fit to perform their duties as they have to face a battery of stringent checks on an annual basis (pretty certain it's annually anyway). It does not necessarily follow that people are physically fit as well. I agree with BEagle that in order to fly, comprehensive medical checks are carried out and passed therefore chap/lady can whizz about the skies to his/her hearts content. However, being professional military aircrew involves a few more things nowadays. You may not agree/like it but subjects such as fitness, shooting and the not very civil chatting sesssion in Cornwall all add up to what I call the Complete Professional Military Aviator.
Fitness is important for two major reasons; it keeps you healthy and also gives you a better chance of coming home should it all go pear shaped. Saying that I believe that the RAF Fitness Test is a joke. It should not be Army type running about with heavy stuff, but should reflect the duties carried out by RAF personnel.
BEags I also agree that far too much time is wasted for some people on being pushed to go to the jock shop. Sport can be a laugh. At lunchtimes try taking on the sqn techies at something you are all collectively crap at such as hockey. This gets rid of the Sport Billy serious heads and involves running about AND enjoying yourself.
I have been teaching aircrew for many years and can truthfully say that generally the "flying club" attitude that prevailed years ago is dissipating and the Complete Professional Military Aviator is becoming the norm.
I await the inevitable backlash!!
Fitness is important for two major reasons; it keeps you healthy and also gives you a better chance of coming home should it all go pear shaped. Saying that I believe that the RAF Fitness Test is a joke. It should not be Army type running about with heavy stuff, but should reflect the duties carried out by RAF personnel.
BEags I also agree that far too much time is wasted for some people on being pushed to go to the jock shop. Sport can be a laugh. At lunchtimes try taking on the sqn techies at something you are all collectively crap at such as hockey. This gets rid of the Sport Billy serious heads and involves running about AND enjoying yourself.
I have been teaching aircrew for many years and can truthfully say that generally the "flying club" attitude that prevailed years ago is dissipating and the Complete Professional Military Aviator is becoming the norm.
I await the inevitable backlash!!
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I'm not sure a test is required for physical fitness but certainly the encouragement to be fit is. A pilot I knew from the USAF spent a few weeks in Bagdad after doing some E&E which lasted about 2 minutes. He was captured by the troops he had just finished strafing. His fitness helped him cope with the daily S%&T kicking he received. Also if you are rescued by some SF guys then the last thing they want is some tubby git who is going to be a huge liability because he cannot keep up.
Run a couple of miles THEN get the pints in
Run a couple of miles THEN get the pints in
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ADUX,
I agree with you. I think that everyone in the military should be great at everything, because well you never know. We should all be raving fit ('cos the army are), be able to drive bo-atz ('cos the navy can) and all be qualified pilots/navigators/Air eng's/Police etc ('Cos the RAF are). Brilliant idea. Just great.
Saudi,
Not sure I agree......Scenario.....POW downtown Baghdad, you're either a) Really fit with six-pack and all or b) Follically challenged with enormous beer-gut and matching love-handles. What'll hurt more when Rag-heed puts the boot in? and more importantly, what's more attractive?!!
I agree with you. I think that everyone in the military should be great at everything, because well you never know. We should all be raving fit ('cos the army are), be able to drive bo-atz ('cos the navy can) and all be qualified pilots/navigators/Air eng's/Police etc ('Cos the RAF are). Brilliant idea. Just great.
Saudi,
Not sure I agree......Scenario.....POW downtown Baghdad, you're either a) Really fit with six-pack and all or b) Follically challenged with enormous beer-gut and matching love-handles. What'll hurt more when Rag-heed puts the boot in? and more importantly, what's more attractive?!!
Some years ago I was at RAF Headley Court, the excellent medical rehab unit for the RAF and Army. While doing my impression of a jellyfish in the 'early spines' group the energetic young army PTI announced that their aim was to get personnel back to the fitness level required by their job.
In my case, being aircrew, I was expected to be able to climb on to the bar stool in the 'Boozeotherapy' department wheras the unfortunate army captain next to me was going to be beasted to death! Obviously I pointed out to the rather depressed looking Pongo that he should have tried harder at school.
The doctors surgeries are full of jockstappers who punish their bodies to the point of failure. Everybody knows that you're only born with so many hearbeats in the bank so why waste them in the company of sweaty blokes with dubious taste in shorts when you could use them up walking to the pub!
In my case, being aircrew, I was expected to be able to climb on to the bar stool in the 'Boozeotherapy' department wheras the unfortunate army captain next to me was going to be beasted to death! Obviously I pointed out to the rather depressed looking Pongo that he should have tried harder at school.
The doctors surgeries are full of jockstappers who punish their bodies to the point of failure. Everybody knows that you're only born with so many hearbeats in the bank so why waste them in the company of sweaty blokes with dubious taste in shorts when you could use them up walking to the pub!
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Firstly, I think that sixofthebest's argument is an excellent one.
The only possible justification for fitness is in the exceedingly unlikely E&E scenario. So maybe only those prone to capture should have to do a fitness test (FJ & SF etc). On the other hand if you want to fly Eurofighter, aerobic fitness is bad (low blood pressure = low g tolerance) so maybe fitness should be banned! Gets my vote. Another pint, please and don't spare the pork scratchings!
The only possible justification for fitness is in the exceedingly unlikely E&E scenario. So maybe only those prone to capture should have to do a fitness test (FJ & SF etc). On the other hand if you want to fly Eurofighter, aerobic fitness is bad (low blood pressure = low g tolerance) so maybe fitness should be banned! Gets my vote. Another pint, please and don't spare the pork scratchings!
Champagne anyone...?
I think training should be bought into line with the army, especially the Catering Corps bit.
I'd love to be able to rustle up a pie and chips in the middle of nowhere
I'd love to be able to rustle up a pie and chips in the middle of nowhere
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An increased level of physical fitness will benefit both the individual and the service. With increasingly busy work schedules, fitness inevitably gets pushed to the back of the agenda. Why is it if you fail your fitness test you are given time off work to do remedial fitness but if you pass your fitness test you get no time off - it is at the discretion of your boss.
Oh and by the way I'm no sport billy, I just recognise the benefits of a sensible exercise regime.
GB
Oh and by the way I'm no sport billy, I just recognise the benefits of a sensible exercise regime.
GB
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Guys,
Banter aside, fitness is a personal issue and I've operated with plenty of overweight guys who are perfectly capable.
However, ask me who I'd prefer to operate in the desert with, especially with the AR5 scenario around the corner, and I ain't going to tell you the 17 stone dumpling!
The RAF fitness test is garbage as we all know, but as somebody quite rightly pointed out, we all have a responsibility to be able to carry out our operational task.
If you can justify being massively overweight then that's great, but when the chips are down is when it counts.
Has anyone heard of a fat senior officer being forced to take the test?
PS Fat people being good at pulling G is absolute rubbish. Ask a competent aviation doctor. The theory sounds great!
PPS Fat people smell!
Banter aside, fitness is a personal issue and I've operated with plenty of overweight guys who are perfectly capable.
However, ask me who I'd prefer to operate in the desert with, especially with the AR5 scenario around the corner, and I ain't going to tell you the 17 stone dumpling!
The RAF fitness test is garbage as we all know, but as somebody quite rightly pointed out, we all have a responsibility to be able to carry out our operational task.
If you can justify being massively overweight then that's great, but when the chips are down is when it counts.
Has anyone heard of a fat senior officer being forced to take the test?
PS Fat people being good at pulling G is absolute rubbish. Ask a competent aviation doctor. The theory sounds great!
PPS Fat people smell!
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Thought my comments may provoke some reaction! I still think physical fitness is very important, but i take on board the various comments above. BEagle, don't take it to heart, i jest questioning your professionalism, obviously I don't know you or how you operate. I have, however, had the benefit of numerous drunken conversations in the bar with ME aircrew who hold a vastly different opinion to myself, hence my perhaps rather cutting comments. In all honesty, I hold the professionalism of the RAF in high regard for many reasons, nuff said.
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2 hours a week in the weights room for last year and a bit - a very slight increase in strength. A couple of minutes a week craning neck round under 'g' - none of my shirt collars fit any more. It's not fair!!