Supply Stupidities
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Anyone remember the Puma farce with the cracked gearboxes and the lack of spares coming in, a team went to France to see what the delay on our spares was and visiting goods out they were amazed to see a huge amount of RAF spares sitting awaiting despatch where there was none waiting for the French airforce, it turned out the storeman hated the British, so anything for us tended to gather dust while he expedited everything to the French airforce.
The Lynx MRGB requires some ridiculous quantity of oil. Thirty eight pints, from memory. The oil alone is/was dangerous air cargo, but the gearbox, with oil in, was not. Ships allowance of oil was something limited, maybe 10 or 15 l, because the gearbox doesnt use much oil and inflam store space is scarce.
Every time HMS Something or other flight had a MRGB need replacing somewhere in farflung a gearbox was usually available, but the gearbox oil, which needed changing after a few hours could not be sent by air.
The supply solution was to send the box to Portland. There as much oil as the gearbox would hold was poured into it and the gearbox rebagged and put back in its transit container. It could then be shipped by air. On arrival at farflung, enough oil for an oil change was decanted from the gearbox into temporary containers and the gearbox fitted, test flown and in due course the oil was changed.
N
Every time HMS Something or other flight had a MRGB need replacing somewhere in farflung a gearbox was usually available, but the gearbox oil, which needed changing after a few hours could not be sent by air.
The supply solution was to send the box to Portland. There as much oil as the gearbox would hold was poured into it and the gearbox rebagged and put back in its transit container. It could then be shipped by air. On arrival at farflung, enough oil for an oil change was decanted from the gearbox into temporary containers and the gearbox fitted, test flown and in due course the oil was changed.
N
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Also screwed up with Blue paper roll, ordered something like 25 rolls, we got 25 cases at 24 rolls per.
Gentleman Aviator
Unrealistic amounts/demands never seem to be questioned. Many moon ago, I was a pipe smoker, and was surprisingly often offered yards of locking wire to serve as pipe cleaners - good it was too.
The engineers seem to have had lots - and the reason was explained:
At the time wire was ordered by weight, and whoever ordered the wire decided on 2 lb. However - the hastily scrawled "2lb" was read as 216.......
..... oh - and the suppliers had just changed to kilograms. Have you any idea what 216 Kg of wire looks like.......
The engineers seem to have had lots - and the reason was explained:
At the time wire was ordered by weight, and whoever ordered the wire decided on 2 lb. However - the hastily scrawled "2lb" was read as 216.......
..... oh - and the suppliers had just changed to kilograms. Have you any idea what 216 Kg of wire looks like.......
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A lifetime ago I was at Brawdy on the BCU, every few weeks the stores wagon would drive over to the Burning Area on the north side of the airfield to dump their scrap. They usually did it over a couple of days before having a big bonfire. We used to go through it all and pick out the non-slashed uniform, take it back to Clothing Stores and exchange for new kit. We had the best dressed officers in the Tower and BCU had an endless supply of biscuits. Stores never asked why we were wearing through uniform so quickly......
Story told to me by an old supply warrant officer who was stationed in Aden and had a visit from the SWO who wanted to order some items to try and smarten up the station in advance of the impending AOC’s inspection. One of the items he required was a length of chain to go around the square on which stood the flagpole in the centre of the station. Together they perused the AP which listed material and selected a 2 inch link chain as suitable for the job and submitted a demand for the requisite amount. A few weeks went by and the chain had not appeared so the SWO asked that the priority be increased to try and chase it along. A few more weeks passed and AOC’s was not far away so it was decided to increase the demand’s priority to the highest level. The result was that a Beverley was specially tasked to deliver the demand and on arrival it was discovered that 2 inch chain did not relate to the link size but the thickness of the metal. What they had ordered was anchor chain which was so heavy that it needed an aircraft all by itself to get it to Aden.
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A chap I used to work with was out the Aden way and he was telling me they started building a pair of water towers, as they watched them being constructed one stopped and started to be deconstructed as the other carried on, he was told there had been a cock up and one was supposed to have built at a different base, so was dismantled shipped and rebuilt.
When looking after one of the Il-62 crews during Gorbachev's visit to Brize, I was enjoying a cup of their excellent coffee served by a very pleasant cabin crew, when the rations were delivered for the next leg...
These came from an outside caterer. The cabin crew boss (who could look either like Rosa Klebb or a jovial prep school matron, as the mood took her) looked rather surprised at the two huge polythene bags of green which were being brought up the steps. "Perhaps they really do eat cabbage sandwiches", I thought to myself...
The mystery was resolved - it was parsley for garnishing the meals and someone had added an extra zero to the order! 'Rosa' erupted into peals of laughter "What I going to do with all this??".....
These came from an outside caterer. The cabin crew boss (who could look either like Rosa Klebb or a jovial prep school matron, as the mood took her) looked rather surprised at the two huge polythene bags of green which were being brought up the steps. "Perhaps they really do eat cabbage sandwiches", I thought to myself...
The mystery was resolved - it was parsley for garnishing the meals and someone had added an extra zero to the order! 'Rosa' erupted into peals of laughter "What I going to do with all this??".....
Thread Starter
One summer in the mid 1980’s, I had a temporary position as a Nav instructor at the Fleet Navigation school. One day I wandered into the Admin section and bumped into an obviously distraught unit Admin Officer.
“Jim, what’s the problem”, I said
“Dave!, we have run out of forms to order more forms ! “
“Jim, what’s the problem”, I said
“Dave!, we have run out of forms to order more forms ! “
Last edited by Big Pistons Forever; 17th Jan 2024 at 17:51.
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As far as stuff “walking” from stores goes, the first Courts Martial I attended was for the prosecution of a store man who was stealing stuff to order. He’d had his own keys cut and had access 24/7. He got to do daily PT at Colchester, after which he got to wear his civvies........
Being newly arrived just after he was caught, I was briefed by OC Supply that as I was the only sqn member not caught up in the investigation, I had better make sure my No 1 uniform was in good condition as I would be wearing it at a whole lot of forthcoming Orderly Rooms, Summaries of Evidence and CMs.
Not only had the the scrote raided clothing stores on a regular basis but he had pillaged all the stores on the station by volunteering for Duty Storeman at weekends and grants. This gave him and his two mates unfettered access to all the main and sub-stores. According to his "little black book" he was flogging the nicked kit in downtown Aldershot, Basingstoke and Blackbushe Market as well as to some on-base personalities who also found themselves doing the CO's Carpet Two-Step.
The impact of his actions were far-reaching - other people's careers were ruined, he caused a shortage of some flying clothing items and across the Air Force all external doors to clothing stores had to be changed so they could only opened from within the building. A lot of people were prosecuted for not recovering u/s kit e.g. socks, footwear, shirts etc when issuing serviceable items. That meant at Odiham, any request of "Do me a favour mate, I need an extra pair of socks/gloves/whatever" was firmly rebuffed. Folks were very twitchy in case it was plod testing them.
Boyo was given three and a half years for burglary. Initially he went to Colly and was later transferred to Parkhurst Prison to see out the rest of his sentence.
teeteringhead allegedly, that locking wire makes very good fishing line when worm drowning in deep, fast flowing tidal waters.... so I'm told.
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In the early 1980s I was the nominated cash imprest holder for a week long, SH detachment from Gutersloh to a certain special forces training base on the north Danish coast.
On the morning of the flight I went to accounts to pick up the cash and the paperwork. It took a very long time to count the cash but as I had no input to the nominated amount for the detachment and having no idea of the Danish exchange rate, I just got on with it because we were about to depart en route.
The cash almost completely filled my nav bag. To cut a long story short, instead of the expected HOTAC on arrival, we were given very, very basic barrack room accommodation and fed on the camp. I therefore had no reason to dish out any allowances and so I asked to put the cash in the camp safe, only to be told there wasn’t one on site. I had to carry the cash with me all week! As there were no locks on the doors of the barrack rooms, I slept using my nav bag as my pillow.
On returning to base I returned the imprest, only to be questioned on the reason for having taken more cash than the average small house cost at that time! Again, it turned out to be a clerk adding an extra nought on the correct amount.
On the morning of the flight I went to accounts to pick up the cash and the paperwork. It took a very long time to count the cash but as I had no input to the nominated amount for the detachment and having no idea of the Danish exchange rate, I just got on with it because we were about to depart en route.
The cash almost completely filled my nav bag. To cut a long story short, instead of the expected HOTAC on arrival, we were given very, very basic barrack room accommodation and fed on the camp. I therefore had no reason to dish out any allowances and so I asked to put the cash in the camp safe, only to be told there wasn’t one on site. I had to carry the cash with me all week! As there were no locks on the doors of the barrack rooms, I slept using my nav bag as my pillow.
On returning to base I returned the imprest, only to be questioned on the reason for having taken more cash than the average small house cost at that time! Again, it turned out to be a clerk adding an extra nought on the correct amount.
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That scrote's name is burnt into my memory.
Being newly arrived just after he was caught, I was briefed by OC Supply that as I was the only sqn member not caught up in the investigation, I had better make sure my No 1 uniform was in good condition as I would be wearing it at a whole lot of forthcoming Orderly Rooms, Summaries of Evidence and CMs.
Not only had the the scrote raided clothing stores on a regular basis but he had pillaged all the stores on the station by volunteering for Duty Storeman at weekends and grants. This gave him and his two mates unfettered access to all the main and sub-stores. According to his "little black book" he was flogging the nicked kit in downtown Aldershot, Basingstoke and Blackbushe Market as well as to some on-base personalities who also found themselves doing the CO's Carpet Two-Step.
The impact of his actions were far-reaching - other people's careers were ruined, he caused a shortage of some flying clothing items and across the Air Force all external doors to clothing stores had to be changed so they could only opened from within the building. A lot of people were prosecuted for not recovering u/s kit e.g. socks, footwear, shirts etc when issuing serviceable items. That meant at Odiham, any request of "Do me a favour mate, I need an extra pair of socks/gloves/whatever" was firmly rebuffed. Folks were very twitchy in case it was plod testing them.
Boyo was given three and a half years for burglary. Initially he went to Colly and was later transferred to Parkhurst Prison to see out the rest of his sentence.
Being newly arrived just after he was caught, I was briefed by OC Supply that as I was the only sqn member not caught up in the investigation, I had better make sure my No 1 uniform was in good condition as I would be wearing it at a whole lot of forthcoming Orderly Rooms, Summaries of Evidence and CMs.
Not only had the the scrote raided clothing stores on a regular basis but he had pillaged all the stores on the station by volunteering for Duty Storeman at weekends and grants. This gave him and his two mates unfettered access to all the main and sub-stores. According to his "little black book" he was flogging the nicked kit in downtown Aldershot, Basingstoke and Blackbushe Market as well as to some on-base personalities who also found themselves doing the CO's Carpet Two-Step.
The impact of his actions were far-reaching - other people's careers were ruined, he caused a shortage of some flying clothing items and across the Air Force all external doors to clothing stores had to be changed so they could only opened from within the building. A lot of people were prosecuted for not recovering u/s kit e.g. socks, footwear, shirts etc when issuing serviceable items. That meant at Odiham, any request of "Do me a favour mate, I need an extra pair of socks/gloves/whatever" was firmly rebuffed. Folks were very twitchy in case it was plod testing them.
Boyo was given three and a half years for burglary. Initially he went to Colly and was later transferred to Parkhurst Prison to see out the rest of his sentence.
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Would that have been the same Rock Ape who disposed of the Puma bits to a scrappy?
I seem to remember the clothing stores problem was they had installed the hasp and clasp on the inner door incorrectly meaning you could unscrew one half without disturbing the padlock. He then simply added items to people’s issue cards and signed it so everything appeared to balance.
And it all became about when some items were seen on a stall that was the latest kit that people on the Station didn’t have yet.
I seem to remember the clothing stores problem was they had installed the hasp and clasp on the inner door incorrectly meaning you could unscrew one half without disturbing the padlock. He then simply added items to people’s issue cards and signed it so everything appeared to balance.
And it all became about when some items were seen on a stall that was the latest kit that people on the Station didn’t have yet.
Nassau stopover
C130 u/s in Nassau on a Belize schedule with a turbine overheat flasher unit not working. Contact with Upavon made, told arrangement exists with Southern Air Trsnsport in Miami for supply of spares. Contact made with Miami told yes, arrangement does exist but until RAF pay for the Tacho genny they already had no more spares. Upavon told, said they would action, everybody back to the hotel! All sorted, spare to be on first plane in from Miami in the morning, as it was a ten minute fix all teed up to depart shortly after flights arrival. BA man trundles across, spare not on plane, Miami checked, we sent it they said, not sending another, flights checked on arrival no spare, back to hotel.
Told spare found, on first flight in the morning, all to Albert, spare turns up, ten minute fix, off to Belize.
All because somebody didn't pay for the spares used and Southern did ask for our flasher unit to be paid for before they supplied it!
Told spare found, on first flight in the morning, all to Albert, spare turns up, ten minute fix, off to Belize.
All because somebody didn't pay for the spares used and Southern did ask for our flasher unit to be paid for before they supplied it!
RAF C130K from 48 Sqn lands at one of the more remote Pacific islands. 'Fill her up and double Greenshield stamps please' or words to that effect. No says the handling agent . They had not been paid for the last visit almost a year ago. FEAF informed and agent paid two days later. It would appear to have not been an isolated incident of tardy payment for such services.
Getting back to supply problems we had a very interesting one at Fairford with our new Hercules. One of our a/c had a runaway rudder trim when away from base. The captain could just about hold it on the rudder and a system was devised using a cargo strop to help take the leg load..It turned out that the wrong relay had been fitted in the rudder trim system. A simple case of groundcrew error you may think , But no.The relay was issued by the supply system using the part number but it was not a cock up by the suppliers either. At the time we were getting spares via Lockheed part numbers, Federal stock numbers and RAF section and ref numbers. To add to this soup the new RAF supply computer was having issues of its own converting all this and others to computer.
What could possibly go wrong ! The offending relay had been supplied in all good faith by the supply system and fitted as such by the groundcrew. But although it looked the same and fitted the same and it worked for a short while it was not up to the job hence the problem later on. The investigation found that only a certain relay type was correct. So to prevent any further confusion a sign was painted on the inside of the fuselage on all the a/c near to the elevator system . It said 'Use only Cuttler Hammer relay part number XXXX.
We had other cases of course but that was potentially the most serious
Getting back to supply problems we had a very interesting one at Fairford with our new Hercules. One of our a/c had a runaway rudder trim when away from base. The captain could just about hold it on the rudder and a system was devised using a cargo strop to help take the leg load..It turned out that the wrong relay had been fitted in the rudder trim system. A simple case of groundcrew error you may think , But no.The relay was issued by the supply system using the part number but it was not a cock up by the suppliers either. At the time we were getting spares via Lockheed part numbers, Federal stock numbers and RAF section and ref numbers. To add to this soup the new RAF supply computer was having issues of its own converting all this and others to computer.
What could possibly go wrong ! The offending relay had been supplied in all good faith by the supply system and fitted as such by the groundcrew. But although it looked the same and fitted the same and it worked for a short while it was not up to the job hence the problem later on. The investigation found that only a certain relay type was correct. So to prevent any further confusion a sign was painted on the inside of the fuselage on all the a/c near to the elevator system . It said 'Use only Cuttler Hammer relay part number XXXX.
We had other cases of course but that was potentially the most serious
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#1 - requested 10m of wire, package duly arrived, supply chap has dutifully measured out using a 1m ruler, cut, next metre etc. 10m of wire provided in 1m lengths....
#2 - requested a box of scalpel blades, a single blade turned up. So, next order 100 were ordered, you guessed it, 100 boxes, couldn't be returned as once delivered sterility couldn't be guaranteed, some 32 years later I still have a couple of boxes at home (yay for being a model builder).
#3 - Flight Sergeant gets irate phone call from Flight Commander, what the hell are you guys doing ordering a $12,000 paint strainer, you know anything more than $5000 needs to go through a tender process. Confusion all round. Worked out we had been billed $60 for each of 200 paper paint strainers (like coffee machine filters) instead of $60 for the whole box.
#2 - requested a box of scalpel blades, a single blade turned up. So, next order 100 were ordered, you guessed it, 100 boxes, couldn't be returned as once delivered sterility couldn't be guaranteed, some 32 years later I still have a couple of boxes at home (yay for being a model builder).
#3 - Flight Sergeant gets irate phone call from Flight Commander, what the hell are you guys doing ordering a $12,000 paint strainer, you know anything more than $5000 needs to go through a tender process. Confusion all round. Worked out we had been billed $60 for each of 200 paper paint strainers (like coffee machine filters) instead of $60 for the whole box.
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Civi wise we had an expensive artificial horizon fail, looking in the back the filter was clogged with little black particles, a warranty exchange was arranged and installed with no problems, the company then refused the claim as the filter was contaminated so must have been done at fitment, fine says me, but you fitted it 4 months ago when you built the aircraft. Ahhh ermm warranty accepted and Service Bulletin arrived a few weeks later for everyone to check theirs for contamination.
Would that have been the same Rock Ape who disposed of the Puma bits to a scrappy?
I seem to remember the clothing stores problem was they had installed the hasp and clasp on the inner door incorrectly meaning you could unscrew one half without disturbing the padlock. He then simply added items to people’s issue cards and signed it so everything appeared to balance.
And it all became about when some items were seen on a stall that was the latest kit that people on the Station didn’t have yet.
I seem to remember the clothing stores problem was they had installed the hasp and clasp on the inner door incorrectly meaning you could unscrew one half without disturbing the padlock. He then simply added items to people’s issue cards and signed it so everything appeared to balance.
And it all became about when some items were seen on a stall that was the latest kit that people on the Station didn’t have yet.
Clothing Stores keys were held in the Guardroom during silent hours, so he interfered with the internal hasp and clasp to get into clothing stores when he was in the building as Duty Storeman. The external door to clothing stores had a Yale lock for which Boyo had obtained a key and he used that method of entry when he wasn't on duty - hence the burglary charge. They were caught coming out of the external door by the Duty Storeman who was carrying out a late night external security check of the building.
He would input false transactions onto the stores computer system to cover his tracks, consequently the deficiencies weren't readily apparent. IIRC, at the time, there was no time stamp on the transaction records to show the time of day the transaction was made, only the date although an approximation of which part of the day the transaction took place could be made by the position of the transaction in the record for that day. Supply operated 24/7 (no laughing in the cheap seats!!) so transactions could be carried out at any time of the day and night. I don't recall Personal Loan Cards being falsely updated because that would have involved additional effort on his part.
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I seem to remember the aircrew being asked if and what they had issued recently on their loan cards, but that might have just been tying the card system to the computer system to aid identifying what was missing.
When you fit a hasp and clasp correctly the arm goes over all the screws preventing them being undone, but if you fit it incorrectly the arm does not cover the screws meaning one side can be unscrewed.
Installed like this is incorrect. as the screws are not all covered, one side can be removed, that is what I was told at the time, it had been installed like below
Installed like this is correct as all the screws are blanked off.
When you fit a hasp and clasp correctly the arm goes over all the screws preventing them being undone, but if you fit it incorrectly the arm does not cover the screws meaning one side can be unscrewed.
Installed like this is incorrect. as the screws are not all covered, one side can be removed, that is what I was told at the time, it had been installed like below
Installed like this is correct as all the screws are blanked off.
Last edited by NutLoose; 18th Jan 2024 at 15:47.
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