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Red Arrows - toxic culture

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Red Arrows - toxic culture

Old 14th Nov 2023, 16:31
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Originally Posted by papa_sierra
The Red Arrows display team is in "special measures" after a report found predatory behaviour towards women was "widespread and normalised".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...shire-67417428
I distinctly remember that being suggested on pprune about a dozen years ago after a previous incident. Does RAF policy now rely on a trawl of old posts? If so, a distinct change for the better.
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Old 17th Nov 2023, 15:55
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So was the Royal yacht...
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Old 21st Dec 2023, 15:28
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Another seemingly quite serious charge this time

Senior RAF officer who toured with Red Arrows is arrested by military police 'after "extremely concerning" material of a sexual nature was discovered on his phone' | Daily Mail Online

Just came across this, some may feel their blood boil, apparently its the Royal Military Police involved, not the RAF Police.

FB

Last edited by Finningley Boy; 21st Dec 2023 at 16:07.
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Old 21st Dec 2023, 15:56
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Originally Posted by Finningley Boy
Just came across this, some may feel their blood boil, apparently its the Royal Military Police involved, not the RF Police.
That could be just down to where he was stationed
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Old 21st Dec 2023, 16:08
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Originally Posted by Davef68
That could be just down to where he was stationed
Indeed, that hadn't crossed my mind.

FB
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Old 21st Dec 2023, 17:03
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Or a journalist mistake and assumption.
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Old 21st Dec 2023, 17:30
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Originally Posted by downsizer
Or a journalist mistake and assumption.
Hmmm, I really hate when they print stuff like this, it is always assumed to be men in the press etc, , there are sex offenders from both, or should one now say, multiple sexes.

The probe being conducted by the Royal Military Police will also focus on whether the material was shared with other men.
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Old 22nd Dec 2023, 09:22
  #168 (permalink)  

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I wonder sometimes whether these people want to be found out. "Someone" "accidently" "saw the images". My phone is unlocked by fingerprint, so no-one is going to "accidently" see what is on it. Furthermore, if I had those sort of images, I'm sure they would be in a password-protected folder. Could it be that they feel a need to "atone" for their wrongdoing? Any psychiatrists here?
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Old 22nd Dec 2023, 10:16
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This sort of thing should be investigated by civilian, not Service, police
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Old 22nd Dec 2023, 13:47
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Traditionally, ignorant journalists have called Sergeant and above "Senior RAF Officers", with no reference to the important "non-commissioned" bit.
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Old 22nd Dec 2023, 14:47
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Originally Posted by flyingorthopod
This sort of thing should be investigated by civilian, not Service, police
Would that not depend on the nature of alleged offence and possible charges being bought under which Act(s)?
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Old 22nd Dec 2023, 15:29
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Originally Posted by flyingorthopod
This sort of thing should be investigated by civilian, not Service, police
In 2018/19 various complaints were made to Lincolnshire Police relating to the Red Arrows. They refused to investigate, saying the complainants were 'not entitled' to make a complaint as they were not 'directly affected'. This was upheld by the Independent Office for Police Conduct. Neither was willing or able to point to the change in the law that says this.

In 2022 North Wales Police took the same line. But when a family member resubmitted the complaint about 13 months ago, it immediately commenced an investigation headed by a Detective Chief Inspector. That is still ongoing.

The nature of those complaints is infinitely more serious than (alleged) images on a phone.

It may well be that a complaint was made to the civilian police, but the complainant didn't meet the above criteria.

Last edited by tucumseh; 22nd Dec 2023 at 15:41.
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Old 23rd Dec 2023, 11:17
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This sort of thing should be investigated by civilian, not Service, police
So, following that logic, alleged crimes committed by civilian police should be investigated by Service police???
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Old 23rd Dec 2023, 12:02
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The stupid thing in that argument is if service police investigate something and either dish out a sentence or find the person not guilty, that does not prevent the civilian police also investigating the offence and the person getting a double sentence, the Ex NI troops being pursued through the courts being a classic example.
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Old 23rd Dec 2023, 14:55
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The Service Police can only investigate and charge, the finding of innocent or guilty and sentencing is not their job, thank heaven.
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Old 23rd Dec 2023, 15:27
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Originally Posted by teeteringhead
So, following that logic, alleged crimes committed by civilian police should be investigated by Service police???
There's a degree of merit to that argument I suppose.

The Atherton report reccomended removing sexual offences from the court martial system. Partly because of the conflict of interest of marking own homework and partly because of a very low success rate for prosecutions as a result of court and service police processes.
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Old 23rd Dec 2023, 21:50
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Originally Posted by Ninthace
The Service Police can only investigate and charge, the finding of innocent or guilty and sentencing is not their job, thank heaven.
Aah yes, the old, come on sunshine, we know everything, you'll save yerself and us a lot a trouble if you just sign the statement!

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Old 23rd Dec 2023, 22:13
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Or the answer I got when they asked me who was the German Lady I was with last night and myself telling them that it is none of their business, I got the immortal words

”we will find her you know”

”Good luck with that, you only have 40 odd million to filter out” says I as I walked out of the door.
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Old 24th Dec 2023, 06:02
  #179 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by NutLoose
Or the answer I got when they asked me who was the German Lady I was with last night and myself telling them that it is none of their business, I got the immortal words

”we will find her you know”

”Good luck with that, you only have 40 odd million to filter out” says I as I walked out of the door.
appreciate the sentiment, not the math. That was some time ago, and the demographics of Germany have been upside down since the 70's. excluding those under 16, well, let's make it 21 for charity, and excluding those in zimmer frames, say above 60... there would be about 24 million young frauleins. Of those, around 80% would be married, and 99% of those married probably would prefer a Zimmer frame to a date with Nutty, on his good days. The remainder, at least 0.05% would be blind and mute which would be within the Venn diagram of interest. The IQ of the remaining 21% of 24 million, about 4 million +/-, would have 1/2 of 20% in the range of concern that would spend time with our trusty Nutty one. which is 400,000 frauleins to be reviewed. At 1 an hour to assess, that's not so long for the MPs to do their plodding.

Merry Xmas Nutty.

P stop S stop semi colon don't.... stop


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Old 24th Dec 2023, 07:06
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Surely it would be the one with the white stick?
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