View Poll Results: Do we support USA in Iraq or Sort out Mugabe in Zimbabwe
Yes support USA
15
11.72%
No Sort out Mugabe
113
88.28%
Voters: 128. This poll is closed
IRAQ or ZIMBABWE
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: N51:37:39 W1:19:16 Feel free to use as a waypoint.
Posts: 844
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You need to add another choice. I want to vote for BOTH. I really cannot choose between the two.
I guess if we are going alone then it has to be Zimbabwe.
Quite frankly the leaders of both nations are inherantly evil and should be removed using whatever force is necessary (if any is needed at all) as soon as possible.
I guess if we are going alone then it has to be Zimbabwe.
Quite frankly the leaders of both nations are inherantly evil and should be removed using whatever force is necessary (if any is needed at all) as soon as possible.
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Too close to Pompey
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Difficult one this - both need doing. However, Mugabe might sort himself out in the near future - but it would take some effort to send in a military force therefore sanctions seem a better route. We can do without people like Hoogstraten offering help in return for land (supposedly). Neither Bush nor Blair have made a good enough case to go after Iraq - not allowing weapons inspectors in is almost there but should have been acted upon when it first happended, not years later. Show us some new evidence of WMD tests/deployments and then the argument is much stronger.
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: N51:37:39 W1:19:16 Feel free to use as a waypoint.
Posts: 844
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Lightbob
You may want to have a quiet word with the Marsh Arabs, I think they may have a word or two to say about WMD. If theres any of them left that is.
You may want to have a quiet word with the Marsh Arabs, I think they may have a word or two to say about WMD. If theres any of them left that is.
lightbob;
Mugabe needs sorting out now, if we continue to pacify Mugabe it will eventually become a bigger problem. It will take the land many years before it will recover from the current damage. If Blair continues being weak-kneed, the problem will bubble over into South Africa and many more people will move to the UK. The UK can sort the problem now or pay for it later. I know which I would choose.
Mugabe needs sorting out now, if we continue to pacify Mugabe it will eventually become a bigger problem. It will take the land many years before it will recover from the current damage. If Blair continues being weak-kneed, the problem will bubble over into South Africa and many more people will move to the UK. The UK can sort the problem now or pay for it later. I know which I would choose.
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Too close to Pompey
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
MOF - I don't think anyone can forget what Saddam has done to his countrymen especially the use of nerve agents on whole towns - I was trying to say, however inarticulately, that time between the cause and effect has widen considerably. I for one believe that Bush senior made a mistake after the Basra Rd and didn't finish the job. We could have gone in at the point that the weapons inspectors were thrown out... Hence my comment about the new evidence - there are rumours that the Int community have this sort of assessment. At the moment we are in the hands of 'Trust me Tone.
Claw - Mugabe does need sorting out - he is a slippery customer who re-writes his country's laws at will. How do you reconcile accusations that could be levelled against UK of 'trying to re-colonise Africa' - many of the former colonies might welcome that. I think that Mugabe is getting close to self-destruct.
Claw - Mugabe does need sorting out - he is a slippery customer who re-writes his country's laws at will. How do you reconcile accusations that could be levelled against UK of 'trying to re-colonise Africa' - many of the former colonies might welcome that. I think that Mugabe is getting close to self-destruct.
Guest
Posts: n/a
23 to 1?
LightBob, none of us are interested in "rumours" of WMD. We want to see the detector paper on that one.
WMD in itself is a misnomer, like "Tactical" Nukes.
Everyone seems to think that a WMD, has to be mounted on a scud. A WMD, could be a pint bottle filled with the nasties, and dropped in a reservoir. Even a kid with a Chemistry set and the right culture, could produce that.
The real question is, is Saddam prepared to use them, in an OFFENSIVE role. My belief, is no. Because the whirlwind he would reap, would have his country glowing in the dark for a generation. That is cold hard fact, and in writing, from the US Government to the Iraqi one. It was delivered by GWB snrs Government, and reinforced by the Clinton administration.
To date, we still have not seen any evidence, that Saddam is producing Nukes or ChemWeps in quantity, and you can guarantee, the NSA's birds, and the U-2's are looking very hard.
It's all about oil, let's just admit it. We don't think we can have the deal with Saddam, therefore, Wall Street thinks we should invade him. Bush's campaign contributors want their investment returned, so Iraq will get a hammering.
Lets recoup, how many Iraqis were on board the airliners on 9/11? Now , how many Saudi Arabians were there?
We backed Iraq in the Iran-Iraq war. We supplied them with arms, we trained their pilots and Infantry Commanders. The only reason, we are not trying to talk to Iraq, in anything like a serious fashion, is the Jewish Lobby in the US, would just not contemplate such a move. Well, whilst we maintain an "Iraq no chance" stance, the real enemy IMHO, the Kingdom of Saud, will continue funding islamic terrorism, ad infinitum,
British and US interests have been attacked far more often, by Saudi Nationals, then Iraqi ones. Actually, I'm trying to think when the last time, that Iraq instigated a hostile act against the West was....
Bluppet, very properly, and quite correctly on 9/12 pledged support for the Spams, in the War against terrorism. Maybe he thought Bogside would get an Arclight, or that the US would move decisively against PIRA funders in the US. Well quelle surprise, neither happened. Bluppet got sold the classic dummy, and all of a sudden, BritFor is committed to supporting Bush's adventurism in Iraq. It stinks.
There are some that argue, that the White Farmers, are getting what they deserve in Zimbabwe. Maybe so. I've done an awful lot of reading in the last few days, from HMS Tiger to Operation "Quartz", and I can see where Black Bobs driving.
His mission, very simply, is to destroy any group, that might become a focus for resistance. Hence the 5.7 million people faced with starvation, or rather, the Non-Mugabe supporters.
The White Farmers, gave up their right to be British citizens after UDI, maybe not all of them, but a goodly proportion. It can be argued, that they made their beds, now they must lie in it.
Interesting. So why exactly did we go into Sierra Leone, or Bosnia? Or Kosovo?
Because a catastrophe of enourmous proportions, that could set the entire region on fire was looming.
I made the point yestersday, and I see Jockanicko says the same thing. It is not Rhodesia, it is Zimbabwe, a sovereign nation in it's own right.
However, it is rapidly becoming the Balkans of Africa. A leadership intent on clinging to power, violent discrimination against ethnic minorities, and democratically elected opponents, corruption on a grand scale etc.
We can wring our hands and do nothing, or, we can intervene now.
Sanctions, will only hurt those, we are trying to help. Iraq has proven that. We need, with other Commonwealth nations, to intervene now, to force a regime change in Zimbabwe.
Once that has been achived, we can then, with a level playing field, address the issue of land reform, and there DOES need to be comprehensive land reform, or the resentment , will fester forever.
I am not in favour of committing British Forces to a regime change, so the resident White population can get it all. I am, in favour however, of regime change, fair distribution of land, dictated on Economic and logistical neccessity , and the training of the indigenous population, to become more self-reliant,better farmers and businessmen and major contributors to their nations well-being.
If the White farmers, want that, and believe it is one, not 2 Zimbabwes, then show us that, and stop wringing your fcuking hands, and reaching for the British passport, when it all goes tits.
Do the British care? Well I don't see the Nat.Union of Farmers , marching to London, or the Countryside alliance marching to Downing Street, then again, if Mugabe was to ban fox hunting...
I don't see ex-Zims organising petitions, or trying to bring their plight, forcibly to the medias attention.
So, all you Zim ex-pats, BLACK and WHITE, if there is a problem, really a problem, and you're not just concerned, about your financial well being, start showing the British population, and garnering popular support
That's it.... Rant Switch to off...
P3
LightBob, none of us are interested in "rumours" of WMD. We want to see the detector paper on that one.
WMD in itself is a misnomer, like "Tactical" Nukes.
Everyone seems to think that a WMD, has to be mounted on a scud. A WMD, could be a pint bottle filled with the nasties, and dropped in a reservoir. Even a kid with a Chemistry set and the right culture, could produce that.
The real question is, is Saddam prepared to use them, in an OFFENSIVE role. My belief, is no. Because the whirlwind he would reap, would have his country glowing in the dark for a generation. That is cold hard fact, and in writing, from the US Government to the Iraqi one. It was delivered by GWB snrs Government, and reinforced by the Clinton administration.
To date, we still have not seen any evidence, that Saddam is producing Nukes or ChemWeps in quantity, and you can guarantee, the NSA's birds, and the U-2's are looking very hard.
It's all about oil, let's just admit it. We don't think we can have the deal with Saddam, therefore, Wall Street thinks we should invade him. Bush's campaign contributors want their investment returned, so Iraq will get a hammering.
Lets recoup, how many Iraqis were on board the airliners on 9/11? Now , how many Saudi Arabians were there?
We backed Iraq in the Iran-Iraq war. We supplied them with arms, we trained their pilots and Infantry Commanders. The only reason, we are not trying to talk to Iraq, in anything like a serious fashion, is the Jewish Lobby in the US, would just not contemplate such a move. Well, whilst we maintain an "Iraq no chance" stance, the real enemy IMHO, the Kingdom of Saud, will continue funding islamic terrorism, ad infinitum,
British and US interests have been attacked far more often, by Saudi Nationals, then Iraqi ones. Actually, I'm trying to think when the last time, that Iraq instigated a hostile act against the West was....
Bluppet, very properly, and quite correctly on 9/12 pledged support for the Spams, in the War against terrorism. Maybe he thought Bogside would get an Arclight, or that the US would move decisively against PIRA funders in the US. Well quelle surprise, neither happened. Bluppet got sold the classic dummy, and all of a sudden, BritFor is committed to supporting Bush's adventurism in Iraq. It stinks.
There are some that argue, that the White Farmers, are getting what they deserve in Zimbabwe. Maybe so. I've done an awful lot of reading in the last few days, from HMS Tiger to Operation "Quartz", and I can see where Black Bobs driving.
His mission, very simply, is to destroy any group, that might become a focus for resistance. Hence the 5.7 million people faced with starvation, or rather, the Non-Mugabe supporters.
The White Farmers, gave up their right to be British citizens after UDI, maybe not all of them, but a goodly proportion. It can be argued, that they made their beds, now they must lie in it.
Interesting. So why exactly did we go into Sierra Leone, or Bosnia? Or Kosovo?
Because a catastrophe of enourmous proportions, that could set the entire region on fire was looming.
I made the point yestersday, and I see Jockanicko says the same thing. It is not Rhodesia, it is Zimbabwe, a sovereign nation in it's own right.
However, it is rapidly becoming the Balkans of Africa. A leadership intent on clinging to power, violent discrimination against ethnic minorities, and democratically elected opponents, corruption on a grand scale etc.
We can wring our hands and do nothing, or, we can intervene now.
Sanctions, will only hurt those, we are trying to help. Iraq has proven that. We need, with other Commonwealth nations, to intervene now, to force a regime change in Zimbabwe.
Once that has been achived, we can then, with a level playing field, address the issue of land reform, and there DOES need to be comprehensive land reform, or the resentment , will fester forever.
I am not in favour of committing British Forces to a regime change, so the resident White population can get it all. I am, in favour however, of regime change, fair distribution of land, dictated on Economic and logistical neccessity , and the training of the indigenous population, to become more self-reliant,better farmers and businessmen and major contributors to their nations well-being.
If the White farmers, want that, and believe it is one, not 2 Zimbabwes, then show us that, and stop wringing your fcuking hands, and reaching for the British passport, when it all goes tits.
Do the British care? Well I don't see the Nat.Union of Farmers , marching to London, or the Countryside alliance marching to Downing Street, then again, if Mugabe was to ban fox hunting...
I don't see ex-Zims organising petitions, or trying to bring their plight, forcibly to the medias attention.
So, all you Zim ex-pats, BLACK and WHITE, if there is a problem, really a problem, and you're not just concerned, about your financial well being, start showing the British population, and garnering popular support
That's it.... Rant Switch to off...
P3
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: City of Culture
Posts: 218
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Solotk echo's everything that's on my mind. The Saudia Arabia option being IMO the most important one. Sadam although he has done all that he did. Did not train, finance and equip terrorists to attack the world trade centre towers. And more importantly does not STILL continue to do so. Wereas their are fractions inside Saudia Arabia that do.
Seeing as the War On Terror is behind all this Iraqi attack stuff. Perhaps we should focus on the centre of the anti-america hatred.
Seeing as the War On Terror is behind all this Iraqi attack stuff. Perhaps we should focus on the centre of the anti-america hatred.
Last edited by A Civilian; 20th Aug 2002 at 15:49.
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New Jersey Shore
Age: 92
Posts: 601
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Neither.
Zimbabwe is a lost cause. They are starving because they kicked out the productive white farmers, killing, and raping a few in the process. It could'nt happen to a more deserving bunch of stupid savages.
Iraq never did a thing to the USa. So Bush don't like Sadaam. Too bad, it's none of our business. Israel, our client nation is the tail that wags the dog again. It is said that iraq "is thought to have weapons of mass destruction." Duh! Israel has in excess of 400 nukes at Dimona, and the means of delivering them, thanks to our gift of LONG RANGE F-15's. Why would a nation the size of Israel need LONG RANGE F-15's? So they can blackmail Europe. From London to Moscow, all targets are in range.
Our first war with Iraq, Desert Storm, was a set-up:
Saddam- Glaspie meeting
Saddam-Glaspie meeting
Transcript of Meeting Between Iraqi President, Saddam Hussein and
U.S. Ambassador to Iraq, April Glaspie. - July 25, 1990 (Eight days before
the
August 2, 1990 Iraqi Invasion of Kuwait).
July 25, 1990 - Presidential Palace - Baghdad
U.S. Ambassador Glaspie -
I have direct instructions from President Bush to improve our
relations with Iraq. We have considerable sympathy for your quest for
higher oil prices, the immediate cause of your confrontation with Kuwait. (pause)
As you know, I lived here for years and admire your extraordinary efforts to
rebuild your country. We know you need funds. We understand that, and
our opinion is that you should have the opportunity to rebuild your country.
(pause) We can see that you have deployed massive numbers of troops in
the south. Normally that would be none of our business, but when this
happens in the context of your threats against Kuwait, then it would be reasonable
for us to be concerned. For this reason, I have received an instruction to ask
you, in the spirit of friendship - not confrontation - regarding your
intentions: Why are your troops massed so very close to Kuwait's
borders?
Saddam Hussein -
As you know, for years now I have made every effort to reach a
settlement on our dispute with Kuwait. There is to be a meeting in two
days; I am prepared to give negotiations only this one more brief chance.
(pause)
When we (the Iraqis) meet (with the Kuwaitis) and we see there is hope,
then nothing will happen. But if we are unable to find a solution, then it
will be natural that Iraq will not accept death.
U.S. Ambassador Glaspie -
What solutions would be acceptable?
Saddam Hussein -
If we could keep the whole of the Shatt al Arab - our strategic goal in
our war with Iran - we will make concessions (to the Kuwaitis). But, if we
are forced to choose between keeping half of the Shatt and the whole of Iraq
(i.e., in SaddamÕs view, including Kuwait) then we will give up all of the
Shatt to defend our claims on Kuwait to keep the whole of Iraq in the shape we
wish it to be. (pause) What is the United States' opinion on this?
U.S. Ambassador Glaspie -
We have no opinion on your Arab - Arab conflicts, such as your dispute
with Kuwait. Secretary (of State James) Baker has directed me to
emphasize the instruction, first given to Iraq in the 1960's, that the Kuwait issue is
not associated with America. (Saddam smiles)
On August 2, 1990 four days later, Saddam's massed troops invade and
occupy Kuwait.
*******************************************************
Baghdad, September 2, 1990, U.S. Embassy
One month later, British journalist obtain the the above tape and
transcript of the Saddam - Glaspie meeting of July 29, 1990. Astounded,
they confront Ms. Glaspie as she leaves the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad.
Journalist 1 -
Are the transcripts (holding them up) correct, Madam Ambassador?
(Ambassador Glaspie does not respond)
Journalist 2 -
You knew Saddam was going to invade (Kuwait) but you didn't warn
him not to. You didn't tell him America would defend Kuwait. You told him
the opposite - that America was not associated with Kuwait.
Journalist 1 -
You encouraged this aggression - his invasion. What were you
thinking?
U.S. Ambassador Glaspie -
Obviously, I didn't think, and nobody else did, that the Iraqis were
going to take all of Kuwait.
Journalist 1 -
You thought he was just going to take some of it? But, how could you?
Saddam told you that, if negotiations failed, he would give up his Iran
(Shatt al Arab waterway) goal for the Whole of Iraq, in the shape we wish it to
be.
You know that includes Kuwait, which the Iraqis have always viewed as
an historic part of their country!
Journalist 1 -
American green-lighted the invasion. At a minimum, you admit
signaling Saddam that some aggression was okay - that the U.S. would
not oppose a grab of the al-Rumeilah oil field, the disputed border strip and
the Gulf Islands (including Bubiyan) - the territories claimed by Iraq?
(Ambassador Glaspie says nothing as a limousine door closed behind her
and the car drives off.)
Zimbabwe is a lost cause. They are starving because they kicked out the productive white farmers, killing, and raping a few in the process. It could'nt happen to a more deserving bunch of stupid savages.
Iraq never did a thing to the USa. So Bush don't like Sadaam. Too bad, it's none of our business. Israel, our client nation is the tail that wags the dog again. It is said that iraq "is thought to have weapons of mass destruction." Duh! Israel has in excess of 400 nukes at Dimona, and the means of delivering them, thanks to our gift of LONG RANGE F-15's. Why would a nation the size of Israel need LONG RANGE F-15's? So they can blackmail Europe. From London to Moscow, all targets are in range.
Our first war with Iraq, Desert Storm, was a set-up:
Saddam- Glaspie meeting
Saddam-Glaspie meeting
Transcript of Meeting Between Iraqi President, Saddam Hussein and
U.S. Ambassador to Iraq, April Glaspie. - July 25, 1990 (Eight days before
the
August 2, 1990 Iraqi Invasion of Kuwait).
July 25, 1990 - Presidential Palace - Baghdad
U.S. Ambassador Glaspie -
I have direct instructions from President Bush to improve our
relations with Iraq. We have considerable sympathy for your quest for
higher oil prices, the immediate cause of your confrontation with Kuwait. (pause)
As you know, I lived here for years and admire your extraordinary efforts to
rebuild your country. We know you need funds. We understand that, and
our opinion is that you should have the opportunity to rebuild your country.
(pause) We can see that you have deployed massive numbers of troops in
the south. Normally that would be none of our business, but when this
happens in the context of your threats against Kuwait, then it would be reasonable
for us to be concerned. For this reason, I have received an instruction to ask
you, in the spirit of friendship - not confrontation - regarding your
intentions: Why are your troops massed so very close to Kuwait's
borders?
Saddam Hussein -
As you know, for years now I have made every effort to reach a
settlement on our dispute with Kuwait. There is to be a meeting in two
days; I am prepared to give negotiations only this one more brief chance.
(pause)
When we (the Iraqis) meet (with the Kuwaitis) and we see there is hope,
then nothing will happen. But if we are unable to find a solution, then it
will be natural that Iraq will not accept death.
U.S. Ambassador Glaspie -
What solutions would be acceptable?
Saddam Hussein -
If we could keep the whole of the Shatt al Arab - our strategic goal in
our war with Iran - we will make concessions (to the Kuwaitis). But, if we
are forced to choose between keeping half of the Shatt and the whole of Iraq
(i.e., in SaddamÕs view, including Kuwait) then we will give up all of the
Shatt to defend our claims on Kuwait to keep the whole of Iraq in the shape we
wish it to be. (pause) What is the United States' opinion on this?
U.S. Ambassador Glaspie -
We have no opinion on your Arab - Arab conflicts, such as your dispute
with Kuwait. Secretary (of State James) Baker has directed me to
emphasize the instruction, first given to Iraq in the 1960's, that the Kuwait issue is
not associated with America. (Saddam smiles)
On August 2, 1990 four days later, Saddam's massed troops invade and
occupy Kuwait.
*******************************************************
Baghdad, September 2, 1990, U.S. Embassy
One month later, British journalist obtain the the above tape and
transcript of the Saddam - Glaspie meeting of July 29, 1990. Astounded,
they confront Ms. Glaspie as she leaves the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad.
Journalist 1 -
Are the transcripts (holding them up) correct, Madam Ambassador?
(Ambassador Glaspie does not respond)
Journalist 2 -
You knew Saddam was going to invade (Kuwait) but you didn't warn
him not to. You didn't tell him America would defend Kuwait. You told him
the opposite - that America was not associated with Kuwait.
Journalist 1 -
You encouraged this aggression - his invasion. What were you
thinking?
U.S. Ambassador Glaspie -
Obviously, I didn't think, and nobody else did, that the Iraqis were
going to take all of Kuwait.
Journalist 1 -
You thought he was just going to take some of it? But, how could you?
Saddam told you that, if negotiations failed, he would give up his Iran
(Shatt al Arab waterway) goal for the Whole of Iraq, in the shape we wish it to
be.
You know that includes Kuwait, which the Iraqis have always viewed as
an historic part of their country!
Journalist 1 -
American green-lighted the invasion. At a minimum, you admit
signaling Saddam that some aggression was okay - that the U.S. would
not oppose a grab of the al-Rumeilah oil field, the disputed border strip and
the Gulf Islands (including Bubiyan) - the territories claimed by Iraq?
(Ambassador Glaspie says nothing as a limousine door closed behind her
and the car drives off.)
lightbob;
It's not about the need to reconcile accusations, but rather doing what is right. The UK should stand by it's people rather than always towing the American line. Those countries that are most likely to use those accusations are relying heavily on British finance. If the UK can't do this, then I think that they should withdraw totally from other areas of conflict.
It's not about the need to reconcile accusations, but rather doing what is right. The UK should stand by it's people rather than always towing the American line. Those countries that are most likely to use those accusations are relying heavily on British finance. If the UK can't do this, then I think that they should withdraw totally from other areas of conflict.
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: .Lincs.
Posts: 64
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think blackadder had it right when he said that the one pre-condition of any british military campain is that your enemy should be armed with no more than a sharpen watermelon. In which case Zim gets my vote.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
It's not the going in........It's the getting out.
Going into Zimbabwe will end up in bush warfare for an unlimited period. Look at the history of Rhodesia, Mosambique, Angola.
I wouldn't touch the place with a barge pole without an exit strategy. We'd be better off giving all the farmers compensation out of our own pockets. Far cheaper in the long run.
And I know it's not ethical, just pragmatic.
Going into Zimbabwe will end up in bush warfare for an unlimited period. Look at the history of Rhodesia, Mosambique, Angola.
I wouldn't touch the place with a barge pole without an exit strategy. We'd be better off giving all the farmers compensation out of our own pockets. Far cheaper in the long run.
And I know it's not ethical, just pragmatic.
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New Jersey Shore
Age: 92
Posts: 601
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Zimbabwe "incidents":
The Daily Telegraph
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...0/ixworld.html
They then threw me to the ground and stepped on my head. They wanted to rape me and started to tear my clothes from my body," she said.
Woman tells of fight for her life
http://www.news24.com/News24/South_A...243868,00.html
===================
With his clothes and body on fire and screaming with pain, a young cheese-maker tried to get help over the phone before jumping into a freezing fishpond.
Shortly before, attackers had overpowered him in a farmhouse, poured petrol over him and set him alight.
Man roasted by robbers
http://www.news24.com/News24/South_A...244163,00.html
The Daily Telegraph
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...0/ixworld.html
They then threw me to the ground and stepped on my head. They wanted to rape me and started to tear my clothes from my body," she said.
Woman tells of fight for her life
http://www.news24.com/News24/South_A...243868,00.html
===================
With his clothes and body on fire and screaming with pain, a young cheese-maker tried to get help over the phone before jumping into a freezing fishpond.
Shortly before, attackers had overpowered him in a farmhouse, poured petrol over him and set him alight.
Man roasted by robbers
http://www.news24.com/News24/South_A...244163,00.html
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 591
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I.M.Esperto
Zimbabweans a "bunch of stupid savages".
Israel possessing nuclear weapons to "blackmail Europe".
Would you be good enough to share with us the source of the transcript for the Saddam/US Ambassador meeting and the subsequent press Q&As?
Is your NRA subscription up-to-date and is your shelter well stocked for your last stand against the US Government?
Zimbabweans a "bunch of stupid savages".
Israel possessing nuclear weapons to "blackmail Europe".
Would you be good enough to share with us the source of the transcript for the Saddam/US Ambassador meeting and the subsequent press Q&As?
Is your NRA subscription up-to-date and is your shelter well stocked for your last stand against the US Government?
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New Jersey Shore
Age: 92
Posts: 601
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Scud - Trolling?
http://www.chss.montclair.edu/english/furr/glaspie.html
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/ARTICLE5/april.html
http://www.csmonitor.com/durable/1999/05/27/p23s3.htm
Also see:
Zimbabwe Farmworkers
Slaughtered As Cops Look On
From Jan Lamprecht
AfricanCrisis.org
8-18-2
(SAPA) - The African Christian Democratic Party on Sunday claimed that five black farmworkers were murdered by Zimbabwe's ruling Zanu-PF government militants in full view of police who showed reluctance to stop the attacks on Saturday.
Quoting a relative of one of the "murdered" workers, ACDP spokesperson Jo-Ann Downs said the five were killed in an apparent campaign to intimidate them in the ongoing forced removals of white farmers from their properties.
According to Downs, the owner of the farm watched from his hiding place in horror as the men were murdered while Zimbabwean police did little to stop the murders.
"It is clear that the action of the Zimbabwe police in swooping on its citizens before they can get the word out is being quite successful.
"The Zimbabwean police have been applying an uncharacteristic diligence towards covering their tracks when arresting and brutalising people who have little to do with farm ownership," she said.
Sapa could, however, not verify the claims as the people Downs had cited as her sources were not available when contacted for comment.
In a separate incident, the ACDP claimed a farmer's wife was detained by Zimbabwean police after they could not find her husband on Sunday.
The party said the woman, Louis Cochrane, was bundled into a police vehicle and was not allowed to attend to her two children aged eight and three.
"Despite protestations she was not allowed to take them with her. The children are now alone on the farm and have been contacting relatives outside the country by telephone," Downs said.
http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?click...2B254&set_id=1
NRA dues? Why should I pay dues to the NRA? I'm not a member.
BTW, if I were a member, so what?
http://www.chss.montclair.edu/english/furr/glaspie.html
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/ARTICLE5/april.html
http://www.csmonitor.com/durable/1999/05/27/p23s3.htm
Also see:
Zimbabwe Farmworkers
Slaughtered As Cops Look On
From Jan Lamprecht
AfricanCrisis.org
8-18-2
(SAPA) - The African Christian Democratic Party on Sunday claimed that five black farmworkers were murdered by Zimbabwe's ruling Zanu-PF government militants in full view of police who showed reluctance to stop the attacks on Saturday.
Quoting a relative of one of the "murdered" workers, ACDP spokesperson Jo-Ann Downs said the five were killed in an apparent campaign to intimidate them in the ongoing forced removals of white farmers from their properties.
According to Downs, the owner of the farm watched from his hiding place in horror as the men were murdered while Zimbabwean police did little to stop the murders.
"It is clear that the action of the Zimbabwe police in swooping on its citizens before they can get the word out is being quite successful.
"The Zimbabwean police have been applying an uncharacteristic diligence towards covering their tracks when arresting and brutalising people who have little to do with farm ownership," she said.
Sapa could, however, not verify the claims as the people Downs had cited as her sources were not available when contacted for comment.
In a separate incident, the ACDP claimed a farmer's wife was detained by Zimbabwean police after they could not find her husband on Sunday.
The party said the woman, Louis Cochrane, was bundled into a police vehicle and was not allowed to attend to her two children aged eight and three.
"Despite protestations she was not allowed to take them with her. The children are now alone on the farm and have been contacting relatives outside the country by telephone," Downs said.
http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?click...2B254&set_id=1
NRA dues? Why should I pay dues to the NRA? I'm not a member.
BTW, if I were a member, so what?
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 591
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Quote:
"Here are excerpts from a document described by Iraqi Government officials as a transcript of the meeting".
I think that says it all.
I could dig out press stories about attrocities by white farmers against blacks (eg check out the "Rhodesia" thread), but I'll spare you.
My point was, you sound a bit like one of those white supremacist, anti-Government head cases.
"Here are excerpts from a document described by Iraqi Government officials as a transcript of the meeting".
I think that says it all.
I could dig out press stories about attrocities by white farmers against blacks (eg check out the "Rhodesia" thread), but I'll spare you.
My point was, you sound a bit like one of those white supremacist, anti-Government head cases.
Last edited by Scud-U-Like; 21st Aug 2002 at 15:25.
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New Jersey Shore
Age: 92
Posts: 601
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Scud - What if I was anti-government? That's my priveledge, is it not?
Nut case? Over half the voters in the last election voted against Bush. Are they all nut cases?
Nut case? Over half the voters in the last election voted against Bush. Are they all nut cases?
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 398
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Dare I say that the typical UK citizen should fear little from a terrorist attack, he probably has better odds of winning the national lottery than of dying at the hands of an Iraqi terrorist.
Despite these odds we still manage to kill over three hundred UK citizens a month on our roads! Surely, instead of spending billions on bombing Iraq we should widen the A12 south of Chelmsford????
To get back to the point - Mugabe is black and can therefore do no wrong in this Left wing age of white 'mea culpa' Tony Bliar would rather sell out the (white) Gibraltarians in the name of some European utopia than bother himself with the unseemly ethnic cleansing in Zimbabwe.
PS: Is nobody interested in the fact that our independent Nuclear Deterrent is in the hands of a retired ships steward? Frankly I am more worried about 'Our John' than Saddam Hussein.
.
Despite these odds we still manage to kill over three hundred UK citizens a month on our roads! Surely, instead of spending billions on bombing Iraq we should widen the A12 south of Chelmsford????
To get back to the point - Mugabe is black and can therefore do no wrong in this Left wing age of white 'mea culpa' Tony Bliar would rather sell out the (white) Gibraltarians in the name of some European utopia than bother himself with the unseemly ethnic cleansing in Zimbabwe.
PS: Is nobody interested in the fact that our independent Nuclear Deterrent is in the hands of a retired ships steward? Frankly I am more worried about 'Our John' than Saddam Hussein.
.
Did anyone else see the dismal performance of George Dubya on TV last night. Such rambling incoherence from someone with such power - couldn't they really find anyone better to run the place?
His powers of oratory even makes Dan Quayle seem well-spoken
His powers of oratory even makes Dan Quayle seem well-spoken