USAF miss range in Japan by 5km
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
If the release had been a tiny fraction of a second later the bomb would have been just 8 feet higher.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
A few years ago we visited a French radar station on the south coast. The mess wall was covered by a tarp. A drop tank had been dropped through it.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
We also had a Jaguar that dropped a few practice bombs too. Only problem we it was still on the CBLS. His 'mates' were along next day for the trophy.
When I did a couple of days as RSO at RAF Pembrey Sands in 1976, I asked why there was a large dent in the clock in the RSO's tower. I was told that it was courtesy of a Harrier flying an FRA rather off the correct attack track and a 30mm case had scored a DH on the RSO's tower...
One day a couple of QFIs in a JP flew through the range - between the Hunter flying a 10deg strafe dive and the target - fortunately dry.
Not long before I did my stint, some aged Wg Cdr aviator on a 79 Sqn refresher course had managed to select both inboard pylons live (despite the 'lift the flap' and red bands around the switches) - and instead of a little 25lb practice bomb, off duly came 2 x 230 gall drop tanks containing rather a lot of Avtur, unplottable at 6. When he asked to continue, he was politely to bugger off...Sir!
I only did a couple of days filling in for the RSO, but it was quite an education!
The most impressive long bomb event I heard of was from a USAF exchange officer at Scampton. On one B-52D mission from Guam, they'd dropped a Buff load of bombs 15 minutes short of the target over some part of SE Asia due to a formation call-sign cock-up. But no-one ever complained.... Hardly surprising really, I guess.
One day a couple of QFIs in a JP flew through the range - between the Hunter flying a 10deg strafe dive and the target - fortunately dry.
Not long before I did my stint, some aged Wg Cdr aviator on a 79 Sqn refresher course had managed to select both inboard pylons live (despite the 'lift the flap' and red bands around the switches) - and instead of a little 25lb practice bomb, off duly came 2 x 230 gall drop tanks containing rather a lot of Avtur, unplottable at 6. When he asked to continue, he was politely to bugger off...Sir!
I only did a couple of days filling in for the RSO, but it was quite an education!
The most impressive long bomb event I heard of was from a USAF exchange officer at Scampton. On one B-52D mission from Guam, they'd dropped a Buff load of bombs 15 minutes short of the target over some part of SE Asia due to a formation call-sign cock-up. But no-one ever complained.... Hardly surprising really, I guess.
Last edited by BEagle; 16th Apr 2020 at 20:27.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Thread Starter
There was the RAF SHar pilot who bombed his own carrier rather than the towed target. Thankfully only a 28lb practice bomb, though I understood it did go through 2 decks and ended up in a PO mess.
I have a question about the original incident which I hope someone can answer. The mishap pilot selected what was said to be a spuriously generated SPI. What could have caused it to be spuriously generated?
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Agree with Gums. Pure written report that does not explain the procedures and terms at all.
With the introduction of Link-16 and a certain OFP upgrade, the F-16 got the capability to share Sensor Point of Interest (SPI) between formation members. This means that one can see ones elements mate SPI on ones Horizontal Situation Display (HSD) and also on the TGP if it is zoomed out far enough. The transmitted SPI itself is not exactly precise, but will show a symbol with the generating formation member’s number on top. As it is transmitted through the Link, it is not weapons quality grid and there is a delay in SPI position update due to the way the system works (in a case where the target is not stationary). The SPI position however, is close enough to get a laser seeker within acquisition range during the later portion of the bombs flight/fall.
I have never seen the SPI used for buddy lasing ops against a stationary target, but then again, we do not use same procedures as the USAF. The way we use the SPI, is for the formations members to gain SA on the other formations member’s sensor position. For attack usage we use it for mover attacks, where we employ laser or dual mode weapons. The clever part about the SPI during a buddy lased mover attack, is that the SPI information from the designator aircraft, also contains the vector of the target. This way, the shooter aircraft will calculate a lead computed impact point that will ensure the weapon is in the right point in space when the seeker is within acquisition range. Seen it used in combat against very fast movers, and it worked like a charm.
The problem with the SPI on the other hand, is that every time the aircraft that is generating the SPI looses TGP track, the SPI will still be visible in the element mates cockpit for a certain amount of time. And sometime there can even be multiple stale SPI’s displayed. For this reason, there is a procedure in place to ensure that the receiver aircraft is looking on the proper SPI. Each transmitted SPI has an index number attached. This number has to be verified in both cockpits to avoid embarrassment. And this brings me to this incident, where I get the feeling that this was not done, and that the MP dropped his weapon on a stale SPI.
Furthermore, I don’t know how procedures are at the range used in this incident, but we have very strict procedures that we have to follow during attacks where the target is obscured by clouds. One of the most restrictive rules is that the shooter has to get below the weather and visually verify that the SPI is on/in vicinity of the intended target, and from this time on the weapon has to be delivered within a very short amount of time…
With the introduction of Link-16 and a certain OFP upgrade, the F-16 got the capability to share Sensor Point of Interest (SPI) between formation members. This means that one can see ones elements mate SPI on ones Horizontal Situation Display (HSD) and also on the TGP if it is zoomed out far enough. The transmitted SPI itself is not exactly precise, but will show a symbol with the generating formation member’s number on top. As it is transmitted through the Link, it is not weapons quality grid and there is a delay in SPI position update due to the way the system works (in a case where the target is not stationary). The SPI position however, is close enough to get a laser seeker within acquisition range during the later portion of the bombs flight/fall.
I have never seen the SPI used for buddy lasing ops against a stationary target, but then again, we do not use same procedures as the USAF. The way we use the SPI, is for the formations members to gain SA on the other formations member’s sensor position. For attack usage we use it for mover attacks, where we employ laser or dual mode weapons. The clever part about the SPI during a buddy lased mover attack, is that the SPI information from the designator aircraft, also contains the vector of the target. This way, the shooter aircraft will calculate a lead computed impact point that will ensure the weapon is in the right point in space when the seeker is within acquisition range. Seen it used in combat against very fast movers, and it worked like a charm.
The problem with the SPI on the other hand, is that every time the aircraft that is generating the SPI looses TGP track, the SPI will still be visible in the element mates cockpit for a certain amount of time. And sometime there can even be multiple stale SPI’s displayed. For this reason, there is a procedure in place to ensure that the receiver aircraft is looking on the proper SPI. Each transmitted SPI has an index number attached. This number has to be verified in both cockpits to avoid embarrassment. And this brings me to this incident, where I get the feeling that this was not done, and that the MP dropped his weapon on a stale SPI.
Furthermore, I don’t know how procedures are at the range used in this incident, but we have very strict procedures that we have to follow during attacks where the target is obscured by clouds. One of the most restrictive rules is that the shooter has to get below the weather and visually verify that the SPI is on/in vicinity of the intended target, and from this time on the weapon has to be delivered within a very short amount of time…
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"Each transmitted SPI has an index number attached. This number has to be verified in both cockpits to avoid embarrassment. And this brings me to this incident, where I get the feeling that this was not done, and that the MP dropped his weapon on a stale SPI."
Yep, from reading the report and some replies on here that is the missing link.
However the deployment of the GBU-12 was instigated at the "MASS" brief.
Were there no balances and checks applied at this point, nothing that I read in the report gives any indication as to the priority given to releasing that weapon [or not] pertaining to mission success.
?
Yep, from reading the report and some replies on here that is the missing link.
However the deployment of the GBU-12 was instigated at the "MASS" brief.
Were there no balances and checks applied at this point, nothing that I read in the report gives any indication as to the priority given to releasing that weapon [or not] pertaining to mission success.
?
Salute!
TNX, F16Guy. And Weemonkey has another great point.
First to wee, I fail to see the over riding requirement to drop an inert bomb with a multi-thousand dollar seeker system. This was not a special mission for the development and testing of some new system. Your view agrees with mine.
@ F16Guy...... The explanation of the handoff of the tgt/POI was illuminating to this old fart, and I feel your procedure is super. We have come a long way from when the FAC asked "What color is the smoke?"
For many here to know, most from the Motherland, the Colonists have had many off-range releases in peacetime, and more than one "off-target" incidents in combat situations besides the Buff incident referenced. A famous one was when a Double Ugly bombed the TACAN at DaNang, maybe in 1972 when we started using LORAN versus the old "Skyspot" system that used SAC radar scoring gear in reverse. The crew failed to note that the offset from the nav station was zero! So one calm night a ripple of MK-82's went across the TACAN! Gotta love it.
The most famous USAF incident documentation has escaped my search, but apparently was in late 70's and at Nellis. Someone here who is older than 60 might recall. It was called the "Corn Creek Massacre". Although the name could be slightly off. A flight to the range did not have their act together, and the range officer was complicent, equally guilty. NIGHT MISSION. They had live MK-82's. The RO cleared them to drop without a positive ID. A nearby Forest Ranger abode had outdoor lights that resembled those at the tgt. Booomb! After action report has good comments from the forest ranger. And then, to make it worse, the RO said he didn't see impacts and cleared the flight for a second pass. The ranger described the hits and thanked God when the guilty parties went home.
Gums sends....
TNX, F16Guy. And Weemonkey has another great point.
First to wee, I fail to see the over riding requirement to drop an inert bomb with a multi-thousand dollar seeker system. This was not a special mission for the development and testing of some new system. Your view agrees with mine.
@ F16Guy...... The explanation of the handoff of the tgt/POI was illuminating to this old fart, and I feel your procedure is super. We have come a long way from when the FAC asked "What color is the smoke?"
For many here to know, most from the Motherland, the Colonists have had many off-range releases in peacetime, and more than one "off-target" incidents in combat situations besides the Buff incident referenced. A famous one was when a Double Ugly bombed the TACAN at DaNang, maybe in 1972 when we started using LORAN versus the old "Skyspot" system that used SAC radar scoring gear in reverse. The crew failed to note that the offset from the nav station was zero! So one calm night a ripple of MK-82's went across the TACAN! Gotta love it.
The most famous USAF incident documentation has escaped my search, but apparently was in late 70's and at Nellis. Someone here who is older than 60 might recall. It was called the "Corn Creek Massacre". Although the name could be slightly off. A flight to the range did not have their act together, and the range officer was complicent, equally guilty. NIGHT MISSION. They had live MK-82's. The RO cleared them to drop without a positive ID. A nearby Forest Ranger abode had outdoor lights that resembled those at the tgt. Booomb! After action report has good comments from the forest ranger. And then, to make it worse, the RO said he didn't see impacts and cleared the flight for a second pass. The ranger described the hits and thanked God when the guilty parties went home.
Gums sends....
Last edited by gums; 18th Apr 2020 at 14:59.
He and his instructor were engaged on a bombing exercise on one of the ranges on the Wash, procedure was to drop the bombs and count the splashes to make sure they tallied. On this occasion they dropped one more bomb than they got splashes, so did the hung up bomb procedure, waggle wings, pull ups etc checking for the missing splash. Having failed to get the missing splash, the instructor made the assumption that the bomb was a dud and had in fact left the rack.
So they then did their usual low level, wave top height dash across the Wash with the Boston Stump the aiming point, it was apparently in a direct line between the range and Cranwell. When they arrived at the Stump an entusiastic pull up over the tower was performed, with unbeknownst to them at the time, the inevitable release of the bomb through a window and into the pews, which were fortunately empty at the time.
On arrival back at Cranwell, they were surprised to find the Station Commander waiting to greet them. He and the instructor were separated and my dad never saw him again.
Despite this, he completed the course and was awarded the Sword of Honor. Recommended for Mosquitos, he was posted to a transport conversion unit flying Wellingtons, before a posting to the Middle East on Dakotas with 78 Squadron.
The pilot thought that he had made a switch pigs but we managed to prove (much to their Lordships' displeasure) that it was a software glitch and the pilot was completely blameless. 'T would have been a different outcome if it had been an inert 1000lb instead of a smoke/flash 28lb.
Showed how accurate the SHAR LOFT attack could be though, as it was dead centre of the ship and entered the deck between the tramlines!
Mog
When our Nav Plotter went off to do the anti-honking course, an ancient old chap joined the crew. He'd been on RAF Lincolns and told us the story of how they'd once seriously mis-ID'd the target - instead of bombing the range they'd dropped several thousand pounders on a German (or Dutch?) wildlife sanctuary...
Looks like it doesn't even have to be in the air for a "woopsie" to take place, sadly this one had fatal results.
https://theaviationist.com/2020/04/1...tB13KjaUGY-OAs
https://theaviationist.com/2020/04/1...tB13KjaUGY-OAs
Last edited by Easy Street; 19th Apr 2020 at 09:47.
I had a look for the incident mentioned by gums and failed to find it however -
https://www.gao.gov/assets/210/203234.pdf
Stray bombs
The Navy does not have complete records on the number of bombs dropped outside the range area. By examining Navy rccords and newspaper articles, and by talking with area residents, we determined that some bombs have missed the target area. We obtained information on three incidents involving damage caused by stray bombs. The first occurred in January 1968 when an inert practice bomb dropped within 2 feet of a grocery store about 8 miles from Pinecastle. Although the building was not significantly damaged, a newspaper article describing the incident stated that someone was standin, on the other side of the wall when the bomb hit . The second ;I! cident occurred in June 1969 when five small inert rockets hit Camp Ocala, a youth camp about 4 miles from the range. About 100 people were at the camp at the time. One of the rockets damaged a propane gas tank, but no one was injured. The incident occurred at night and the pilot apparently mistook the camp for the target. The third incident occurr.ed in May 1973 when an inert 500-pound bomb was dropped abo:!i: mile from a recreational area which was occupied at the i:ji,.. This bomb started a smal.1 fire that burned about an acr'. 02 trees.
We observed several craters just outside the Pinecastli-: perimeter road which appear to have been caused by stray Live bombs. The officer-in-charge of the range told us that to his knowledge no live ordnance had been dropped since 1967 outside -the Pinecastle range boundary.
Tremors
Navy records showed only one instance where tremors damaged property. On February 16, 1973, 128 live SOO-poun
N.J. bombing range under fire over blaze - US news - Military | NBC News
But if your neighbor repeatedly set the neighborhood on fire, crashed a plane into it, and shot up the local elementary school, how neighborly would you feel?
The latest hazard caused by the range — a massive forest fire that burned 14,000 acres, damaged or destroyed a handful of homes and forced 6,000 people to flee — underscores the tensions between the base, which trains pilots bound for Iraq and Afghanistan, and the ring of senior citizen developments encroaching ever nearer.
https://www.gao.gov/assets/210/203234.pdf
Stray bombs
The Navy does not have complete records on the number of bombs dropped outside the range area. By examining Navy rccords and newspaper articles, and by talking with area residents, we determined that some bombs have missed the target area. We obtained information on three incidents involving damage caused by stray bombs. The first occurred in January 1968 when an inert practice bomb dropped within 2 feet of a grocery store about 8 miles from Pinecastle. Although the building was not significantly damaged, a newspaper article describing the incident stated that someone was standin, on the other side of the wall when the bomb hit . The second ;I! cident occurred in June 1969 when five small inert rockets hit Camp Ocala, a youth camp about 4 miles from the range. About 100 people were at the camp at the time. One of the rockets damaged a propane gas tank, but no one was injured. The incident occurred at night and the pilot apparently mistook the camp for the target. The third incident occurr.ed in May 1973 when an inert 500-pound bomb was dropped abo:!i: mile from a recreational area which was occupied at the i:ji,.. This bomb started a smal.1 fire that burned about an acr'. 02 trees.
We observed several craters just outside the Pinecastli-: perimeter road which appear to have been caused by stray Live bombs. The officer-in-charge of the range told us that to his knowledge no live ordnance had been dropped since 1967 outside -the Pinecastle range boundary.
Tremors
Navy records showed only one instance where tremors damaged property. On February 16, 1973, 128 live SOO-poun
N.J. bombing range under fire over blaze - US news - Military | NBC News
But if your neighbor repeatedly set the neighborhood on fire, crashed a plane into it, and shot up the local elementary school, how neighborly would you feel?
The latest hazard caused by the range — a massive forest fire that burned 14,000 acres, damaged or destroyed a handful of homes and forced 6,000 people to flee — underscores the tensions between the base, which trains pilots bound for Iraq and Afghanistan, and the ring of senior citizen developments encroaching ever nearer.
