Tornado GR4 last flight
Typerated
I know we all like to reminisce and have fond memories of our previous aircraft but can you honestly say you would have wanted to see Buccaneers (of any state of modification) in RAF service in 2019?!
I agree that Strike Eagles would have been awesome but buying off the shelf is never attractive to governments.
Lets face it, despite the banter, the Tornado did a sterling job for four decades but even a solid workhorse such as that has to pass into history eventually.
It was Gulf War videos of the GR1 in action that cemented my future career choice so it’ll always have a special place in my heart, even if I never got to fly it.
Now I look back at those same videos and cherish the Jaguar segments instead of course.
BV
I agree that Strike Eagles would have been awesome but buying off the shelf is never attractive to governments.
Lets face it, despite the banter, the Tornado did a sterling job for four decades but even a solid workhorse such as that has to pass into history eventually.
It was Gulf War videos of the GR1 in action that cemented my future career choice so it’ll always have a special place in my heart, even if I never got to fly it.
Now I look back at those same videos and cherish the Jaguar segments instead of course.
BV
BV,
New build Buccs in the 80's with Tornado avionics - why not?
What advantage would Tornado have had over these (apart from dash speed when clean)? I can think of lots of disadvantages!
Interesting the USAF is looking to buy new F-15s - which could well see them past 2050... maybe slip to 2060??? Surely not eagles getting near 100 years since first flight??
So Buccs at 2019 does not sound so bad?
New build Buccs in the 80's with Tornado avionics - why not?
What advantage would Tornado have had over these (apart from dash speed when clean)? I can think of lots of disadvantages!
Interesting the USAF is looking to buy new F-15s - which could well see them past 2050... maybe slip to 2060??? Surely not eagles getting near 100 years since first flight??
So Buccs at 2019 does not sound so bad?
I liked the Banana as much as the next guy but the mythical idea of stuffing it with a complete set of Tornado avionics is just that. Even if it did all fit you would still have a Bucc wrapper with the all the limitations therein. Also not sure why anyone would bring a hypothetical aircraft to a thread dedicated to an aircraft that was flown in UK service for 40 years!
And you would have needed an entirely new flight control system if you wanted auto TF. Bravo Tornado and all who flew , maintained and operated it. RIP those who gave their lives in it.
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Originally Posted by typerated
New build Buccs in the 80's with Tornado avionics - why not?
What advantage would Tornado have had over these (apart from dash speed when clean)? I can think of lots of disadvantages!
Do I have the background to justify the above? Flew Buccs overland and maritime, on Ops and was a QWI. Then flew Tornado for 30 years in flight test.
Rgds
L
My knowledge pales in comparison to Lomcevak's but the main ingredient that kept the Buccaneer relevant for so long was the guile and cunning of the crews and the legendary support and miracle working provided by the groundcrew.
The list of basic things the Bucc didn't have were inconvenient but when the aircraft was dressed for ops the stores limitations hit home. If you were happy to have little or no chaff then you could go without a chaff pod, otherwise you lost a pylon. Add an ECM pod and you lost another of your 4. Just a single sidewinder took another. Leaving you with one pylon and fuel in the bay and/or door. Hang a Pave Spike off this last pylon gave you zero offensive weapons, not even a gun.
Mixed loads in a 4-ship got you so far and in gulf war 1 some creative fits with ALE40 chaff/flare, ECM, Sidewinder, pod and a single asymmetric slipper tank looked odd, but did the business. When the air threat subsided the crews went without the Sidewinder and therefore could carry a single LGB and self-designate.
I would offer that it was the crews, both air and ground, and the character of the Buccaneer that made it all special. Same for the Tornado - when I look back at my time on the GR version I only ever think of the people I was with, but the aircraft was a flexible and dependable part of that mix.
The list of basic things the Bucc didn't have were inconvenient but when the aircraft was dressed for ops the stores limitations hit home. If you were happy to have little or no chaff then you could go without a chaff pod, otherwise you lost a pylon. Add an ECM pod and you lost another of your 4. Just a single sidewinder took another. Leaving you with one pylon and fuel in the bay and/or door. Hang a Pave Spike off this last pylon gave you zero offensive weapons, not even a gun.
Mixed loads in a 4-ship got you so far and in gulf war 1 some creative fits with ALE40 chaff/flare, ECM, Sidewinder, pod and a single asymmetric slipper tank looked odd, but did the business. When the air threat subsided the crews went without the Sidewinder and therefore could carry a single LGB and self-designate.
I would offer that it was the crews, both air and ground, and the character of the Buccaneer that made it all special. Same for the Tornado - when I look back at my time on the GR version I only ever think of the people I was with, but the aircraft was a flexible and dependable part of that mix.
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Originally Posted by Jetset Jimbo
Dad was a Tornado test pilot - he was killed in June 1979 flying a prototype when I was a little boy. A thread to remember all those who gave their lives to Tornado would be a good thing to my mind.
OAP
Last edited by Onceapilot; 17th Mar 2019 at 15:13.
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Originally Posted by Bob Viking
I know we all like to reminisce and have fond memories of our previous aircraft but can you honestly say you would have wanted to see Buccaneers (of any state of modification) in RAF service in 2019?!
I agree that Strike Eagles would have been awesome but buying off the shelf is never attractive to governments.
Lets face it, despite the banter, the Tornado did a sterling job for four decades but even a solid workhorse such as that has to pass into history eventually.
It was Gulf War videos of the GR1 in action that cemented my future career choice so it’ll always have a special place in my heart, even if I never got to fly it.
Now I look back at those same videos and cherish the Jaguar segments instead of course.
BV
I agree that Strike Eagles would have been awesome but buying off the shelf is never attractive to governments.
Lets face it, despite the banter, the Tornado did a sterling job for four decades but even a solid workhorse such as that has to pass into history eventually.
It was Gulf War videos of the GR1 in action that cemented my future career choice so it’ll always have a special place in my heart, even if I never got to fly it.
Now I look back at those same videos and cherish the Jaguar segments instead of course.
BV
Fighters are more my thing but the Tornado is one of the jets that cemented my passion for aeroplanes. I'll always love it.
Originally Posted by Onceapilot
Hi Jimbo. Very sad to read you lost your Dad in that accident. You will no doubt know that he was making an important contribution to an aircraft that became part of daily life for many of us, and which has performed admirably through four decades of service. Unfortunately, that enterprise came a great personal cost to some, and their loved ones. But, the efforts of people like your Dad made the Tornado a tremendous tool for the job that it had to do. Best wishes.
OAP
OAP
The P.150, a development of the Buccaneer, was proposed in 1968. It was to have had a thin wing, modified radar, a fully revised digital inertial nav/attack system and would have been powered by Spey engines with reheat. Whether it would have been as successful as the Tornado is hard to say.
Although TSR.2 would have had considerably more range than Tornado and would have been far superior at high level, it wouldn't have had the excellent all round versatility of Tornado. But it looked much nicer!
Although TSR.2 would have had considerably more range than Tornado and would have been far superior at high level, it wouldn't have had the excellent all round versatility of Tornado. But it looked much nicer!
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Originally Posted by BEagle
The P.150, a development of the Buccaneer, was proposed in 1968. It was to have had a thin wing, modified radar, a fully revised digital inertial nav/attack system and would have been powered by Spey engines with reheat. Whether it would have been as successful as the Tornado is hard to say.
Although TSR.2 would have had considerably more range than Tornado and would have been far superior at high level, it wouldn't have had the excellent all round versatility of Tornado. But it looked much nicer!
Although TSR.2 would have had considerably more range than Tornado and would have been far superior at high level, it wouldn't have had the excellent all round versatility of Tornado. But it looked much nicer!
TSR.2 is one ugly beast. The Tornado by comparison is stunning. The F.3 even more so.... a lean, mean, fighting machine.......
Originally Posted by BEagle
The P.150, a development of the Buccaneer, was proposed in 1968. It was to have had a thin wing, modified radar, a fully revised digital inertial nav/attack system and would have been powered by Spey engines with reheat. Whether it would have been as successful as the Tornado is hard to say.
Although TSR.2 would have had considerably more range than Tornado and would have been far superior at high level, it wouldn't have had the excellent all round versatility of Tornado. But it looked much nicer!
Although TSR.2 would have had considerably more range than Tornado and would have been far superior at high level, it wouldn't have had the excellent all round versatility of Tornado. But it looked much nicer!
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Tornado Tales
I hope no one minds this post (it's non-commercial) but tonight we have posted a collection of Tornado stories as our latest feature to help mark the aircraft's retirement.
There are some good yarns here and I am very grateful to everyone who helped out.
Farewell Tornado ? Tornado Tales | GAR - We've got aviation covered
There are some good yarns here and I am very grateful to everyone who helped out.
Farewell Tornado ? Tornado Tales | GAR - We've got aviation covered
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Originally Posted by typerated
Must have funny glasses
Tornado - Fin too big or the Fuse too short?
Tornado - Fin too big or the Fuse too short?
This angle in bat wing always looked good to me...
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So when is the last UK Tornado flight going to be? The airframes destined to be used at Cosford for techie training are surely going to be ferried in there - aren't they?
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Originally Posted by 1.3VStall
So when is the last UK Tornado flight going to be? The airframes destined to be used at Cosford for techie training are surely going to be ferried in there - aren't they?
