UK Air Defence - Cold War

[NutLoose]

There was also the RAF Regiment from Brize with their Rapier looking after the US Bases nearby.

And if you fancy owning one...

https://www.trinitymarine.co.uk/shop...nching-system/

[seer557]

Well thank you NL......................just wasted spent 30 minutes on a fascinating tour of that site!

Might just order a nice Trotman anchor to stop the grandkids parking on the grass.

Seer

[MPN11]

Originally Posted by NutLoose

There was also the RAF Regiment from Brize with their Rapier looking after the US Bases nearby.

And if you fancy owning one...

https://www.trinitymarine.co.uk/shop...nching-system/

Inflating the tyres might enhance saleability!

[ORAC]

NATO agreed to pay for the HAS build/hardening of the UK airfields as long as the UK provided SAW cover. So the old RAFG/Cyprus Bloodhound were put in place at Bawdsey, West Raynham etc and Rapier units to cover those outside their cover such as LM, KS, BZ etc. No computer links, such at Gata, were ever put in place with the UKADGE units, and in fact for most of their existence the HMEZ/LMEZ were not even updated on the the radar maps.

IIRC Within 6 months of NATO signing the cheques for the hardening programme the Boodhound force was disbanded.

Thats not counting the ex-Argentine Oerlikon/Skyguard equipped sqns at Waddington - at least until the ammunition time expired.

[NutLoose]

Thats not counting the ex-Argentine Oerlikon/Skyguard equipped sans at Waddington - at least 7ntil the ammunition time expired.

Didn't the Radar then become a "speed trap" for low flying aircraft, to be used after any public complaints?

Found it

The ex-Argentine Skyguard/35mm cannon combination was used as part of the air-defence system at RAF Waddington for a number of years until retirement. The Skyguard was then found a new use with the RAF Police and the low-level flying monitoring team. A lot of the captured kit is on display in various units here in the Falklands.

[typerated]

Originally Posted by NutLoose

Didn't the Radar then become a "speed trap" for low flying aircraft, to be used after any public complaints?

Found it

It was too. I remember a Highland Cardinal or OSEX in Wales when (Bassoon?) was giving the location of the skyguard (somewhere near Bala) on initial contact

[Pontius Navigator]

Originally Posted by ORAC

IIRC Within 6 months of NATO signing the cheques for the hardening programme the Boodhound force was disbanded.

It depends when the cheque was signed. If it was before the hardening then that is wrong. Coningsby was fully hardened by 1987 and the B H withdrawn in 1990.

Now I know the Noggie s said they would install SHORAD, for the money and then didn't.

[ORAC]

IIRC the money was paid out after completion and inspection (as happened with the hardened UKADGE bunkers - I remember the fun they had moving the parts from the Large Screen Display from bunker to bunker over night to get each working for the inspection team travelling around to make sure everything worked.

Cant remember which was the last airfield hardened. Lossiemouth?

[Yellow Sun]

Originally Posted by ORAC

Cant remember which was the last airfield hardened. Lossiemouth?

Off the top of my head, I thought that the HASs at St Mawgan were completed after Lossiemouth. Then there was the provision of HPS and the dispersals in the woods at Kinloss. Did the funds for that project come from the same budget?

YS

[Pontius Navigator]

YS, no, that was SACLANT budget.

[Mortmeister]

Originally Posted by NutLoose

There was also the RAF Regiment from Brize with their Rapier looking after the US Bases nearby.

And if you fancy owning one...

https://www.trinitymarine.co.uk/shop...nching-system/

Nutty,

My wife is probably going to want your head on a pole now. What a treasure trove of goodies on that website.

I'm quite fancying the polished and trimmed Canberra ejection seat for my 'man-cave!'

Regards
Mortmeister

[MAINJAFAD]

Originally Posted by ORAC

NATO agreed to pay for the HAS build/hardening of the UK airfields as long as the UK provided SAW cover. So the old RAFG/Cyprus Bloodhound were put in place at Bawdsey, West Raynham etc and Rapier units to cover those outside their cover such as LM, KS, BZ etc. No computer links, such at Gata, were ever put in place with the UKADGE units, and in fact for most of their existence the HMEZ/LMEZ were not even updated on the the radar maps.

IIRC Within 6 months of NATO signing the cheques for the hardening programme the Boodhound force was disbanded.

Thats not counting the ex-Argentine Oerlikon/Skyguard equipped sqns at Waddington - at least until the ammunition time expired.

The Bloodhound Mk 2 data link system wasn't in the RAF LCP's when the system was procured in the early 1960's (The Swedish and Swiss had it fitted from the git go). The decision to fit the RAF systems with the Digital control mode was made in 1966, and a modification program to allow the LCP's to employ the Digital Control method of operational and install the required Digital Data Link Mk 5 equipment was carried out on the 23 LCP's in RAF service in 1967. Enough DDL Mk 5 equipment sets for the whole operational force of 21 Sections were ordered in 1966, however when the East of Suez decision was made in mid 1967, the order for the 10 DDL Mk 5 sets for the FEAF Squadrons (33 and 65) were cancelled. 41 and 25 Squadron's did use it in exercises with the GL161 systems of 1ACC and one DLL Mk 5 set was swapped around the FEAF sections to prove the modifications and allow a bit of training in Theatre before the FEAF Bloodhound Squadrons started to draw down in 1968. The Basic reason the DC mode was not employed in the UK was most likely SLEWC wasn't software engineered to support Bloodhound operations (not in the specifications as the main UK SAM defences were withdrawn in 1968/69 with the drawdown of the MBF in the QRA role (There were no more than 3 Bloodhound Mk 2 sections in that role anyway (112 Sqn at Woodhall Spa until April 1967 when they went non operational for the move to Cyprus and 41 Sqn at West Raynham until June 1969))), plus the fact that there wasn't enough DDL Mk 5 sets available to equip half of the Bloodhound Mk 2 force as finally rolled out in 1983/4 (three set were given to Singapore for the 3 sections sold to them). When the Computers and displays were replaced on Bloodhound 2 in 1986-89, they did include data links that allowed the whole system to be digitally integrated with itself along with command and control functions being carried out at Flight, Squadron and Force level. I do believe it was also going to be integrated into IUKADGE, but of course that didn't become operational until long after Bloodhound was canned.

[glad rag]

Originally Posted by Mortmeister

Nutty,

My wife is probably going to want your head on a pole now. What a treasure trove of goodies on that website.

I'm quite fancying the polished and trimmed Canberra ejection seat for my 'man-cave!'

Regards
Mortmeister

The "Original Reclaimed German Aluminium Ships Bulkhead Light" is quite a catch too, although it must be said, somewhat lacking in synergy..

[Chairborne 09.00hrs]

During one of the "Cold War" lunchtime lectures at Cosford I was disappointed to learn that we had only one re-load round for each Bloodhound launcher.

[Pontius Navigator]

Originally Posted by Chairborne 09.00hrs

During one of the "Cold War" lunchtime lectures at Cosford I was disappointed to learn that we had only one re-load round for each Bloodhound launcher.

You need to qualify that statement. Which Mark and what year? I know we acquired reloads in late 70s.

[MAINJAFAD]

Mk 1 - 575 production missiles produced between 1959 and 1961. On top of that were up to 110 pre production missiles used for the service acceptance firings at Woomera (93 known to have been fired) and up to 180 experimental prototypes built from late 1955 onwards) 11 squadrons formed between 1958 and 1960. 23 1/2 Fire Units ordered. 264 Sqn at North Coates had three, though only 2 were ever used at one time (the originally missiles there in 1958 were prototype rounds that were not part of the main production run). The other 10 squadrons had 2 Fire Units and the 1/2 one was at Aberporth for trials firings (with only 4 launchers). Each Fire unit was spilt into two sections each of which consisted of fire control systems that controlled a Type 83 Radar and 8 missiles on launchers. Each section could lock all 8 missiles onto a target and fire 4 of them in a single salvo against that target. Therefore 32 missiles on launcher per squadron and 8 held as spares giving a total operational force of 352 missiles on launcher and a ready use force of 440. The other missiles were held in reserve to support service evaluation firings not completed at Woomera (mainly to do with ECCM), modification proofing and replacements for Squadron missiles fired in training shoots at Aberporth. 182 production missiles were fired between mid 59 and Nov 63 with the vast majority of that figure from the start of 1961 onwards.
The first squadron to reach IOC was 263 Squadron at Watton in November 1960 (the weapon system didn't complete its service acceptance trials until the middle of that year and it wasn't until 18th November that a fully armed production missile was loaded onto an operational fire unit). The force was finally at full strength in February 1962 with the handover of the last Type 82 and tactical control centre at Lindholme. The whole force was declared to SACEUR on the 1st May 1962 and commenced ORA operations with one section at 10 minutes readiness, the other half of its fire unit at 30 minutes and the rest of the squadron at 2 hours. This was the height of the Bloodhound Mk 1 force and it lasted a total of 28 DAYS!!!! On the 28th May 62, 264 Squadron was taken off alert to allow the squadron to be used in training for the rest of the force in the use of a number of major modifications that had been instigated by HQ Fighter Command in 1961 and were rolled out into the force in early 1962. The main change was the introduction of a sector search capability on the Fire Unit's Type 83 radar which allowed it to find its own targets. Before that, precise target putting on information was given to the Fire Unit automatically from its Tactical Control Centre and without that finding targets by itself required a man in the radar display van to turn hand wheels to steer the dish in azimuth and elevation and then hope. This made the TCC's and the Type 82 radar's redundant as target data could be fed directly to the Fire Units from a Master Radar Station via voice and they were closed down at the end of 1962 / early 1963. The plan was that the Force was to run on until 1965, however, budget cuts resulted in Squadron's being shut down at a rate of two every three months starting with 263 and 94 Squadrons in March 1963 and ending with 62 and 242 Squadrons going non-operational at the end of June 1964. An operational SAM defence of the UK did not then reappear until early 1966 with 112 Squadron at Woodhall Spa.

Bloodhound Mk 2 buy 374 missiles for 5 squadrons.

25 Squadron formed 1963 - Primary role - Production system proofing trials, post R&D and acceptance service trials and Operator Training. Planned equipment allocation - 2x Type 87 Sections 1x Type 86 section all with 4 launchers. 15 Missiles. 1 Engagement control simulator.

65 Squadron formed 1964 - Primary role - Tropical system proofing trials, base defence of Singapore, deployable FEAF Bloodhound 2 force. Planned equipment allocation - 3x Type 87 sections for base defence with 8 launchers. 3x Type 86 sections with 4 launchers for deployment use. 72 missiles. 1 Engagement control simulator.

112 Squadron formed 1964 - Primary role - base defence of Cyprus, however formed at Woodhall Spa due to doubts about the future of the requirement for a SAM defence on the Island which were removed in the 1966 defence review. Planned equipment allocation - 4x Type 87 sections for base defence with 8 launchers. 64 Missiles. 1 Engagement control simulator.

33 Squadron formed 1965 - Primary role - base defence of Butterworth. Planned equipment allocation - 4x Type 87 sections for base defence with 8 launchers. 64 Missiles. 1 Engagement control simulator.

41 Squadron formed 1965 Primary role - UKAD / Reinforcement manpower support to NEAF/FEAF, deployable NEAF Bloodhound 2 force. Planned equipment allocation - 3x Type 87 sections for base defence with 8 launchers. 3x Type 86 sections with 4 launchers for deployment use. 72 missiles. 1 Engagement control simulator.

RAF Newton - primary role - Technical Training 1x Type 87, 1 x Type 86 1x LCP, 2 launchers (missiles as required (normally 3 from reserve stocks)).

RAF Aberporth - primary role - firing range - 1x Type 86 section with 2 launchers. 30 missiles for modification proofing and post service evaluation trial firings.

Operational reserves for squadron firing training - 57 missiles.

With the exception of 112 Squadron who never got their full allocation of equipment, all of the squadrons were fully equipped as above by 1966. The missile evaluation trials which started at Woomera in late 1962 massively overran and were not completed until April 1965 (a mixture of major technical issues which were not easily fixed, the original wing wasn't strong enough for low level use and had to be redesigned, the original boost motors were not powerful enough and there were major problems with the radars. plus the weather in south Australia in 1963-64 was not that good as one D Campbell found out). Likewise the Service acceptance trails at North Coates also massively overran into October 1966, thus even a limited release to service was not issued until late 1965 and the weapon system was still operating on that well into 1967.

65 Squadron was the first Unit to reach IOC in November 1965, with 112 Squadron following in January 1966 with 2 sections with 4 launchers a piece, they gradually built up to the full establishment of 72 missile by the end of 1966, but only had three working sections by the start of 1967 and only 12 launchers with 26 missiles actually available for use or reload, the rest were in boxes. 33 Squadron became operational in late 1966 and 41 Squadron didn't become combat capable until May 1967 when they took over from 112 Squadron. 41 Squadron's 3 Type 87 sections held the 12 hour readiness role until June 1968 and as soon as the RN started deployment of Polaris patrols, 2 of the sections were put on care and maintenance. the remaining section stayed on 12 hour readiness until the day after the bombers came off QRA at which point it was shut down and all three sections were dismantled. As for 25 Squadron, they inherited the three Type 86 radars from 65 Squadron in late 1967 when the FEAF deployable force was wound up. The Squadron was then rerolled to have 4 type 86 sections with 4 launchers (both of the type 87 sections ended up with a full compliment of 8 launchers. One section was allocated as a trails and training section, while the rest became deployable sections for use in NEAF, along with the remaining deployable sections of 41 Squadron. The FEAF force drew down throughout 1968 and 1969 with 33 Squadron returning all of their kit to the UK, while 65 Sqn returned all of remaining parts of their type 86 sections and all of their missiles (most of which were quite badly corroded). The three Type 87 sections were retained for hand over to Singapore. At this point the RAF missile stocks stood at 340, 34 having been fired at Aberporth, though 50 of the 340 were earmarked for transfer via refurbishment at Filton to Singapore. The plan was then to have three sections of 112 Squadron with 12 launchers and 48 missiles on Cyprus, while 25 Squadron's 4 sections would moved to West Raynham and join 41 Squadron thus resulting in the station having 7 sections each with 4 launchers, plus the remaining missiles. One section for trials and operator training use and the rest for deployment when required in either Malta or Libya. This all changed when the requirement for active air defence of airbases in RAFG came up in 1969, which would open a big pot of NATO money. Thus all of the deployable kit, bar the trials section was shipped off to the Clutch Airfields with 25 Squadron in 1970.

The RAF did buy 66 missiles back of the Swedes in 1978 and they did become operational from 1980 onwards (after all of the modifications required that hadn't been embodied by the Swedes were finally manufactured). The RAF ended up firing 90 odd missiles and there were 297 left when the force was phased out in 1991 (at least 2 were scrapped in the 70's due to excessive corrosion or being dropped during loading operations!!!)

The high water mark of the Bloodhound Mk 2 force in the UK would have been between 1984 and late 1985, when there were 6 operational sites with 16 operational sections.
85 Sqn A Flt West Raynham 3x sections with 20 launchers (two with 6 and one with 8).
85 Sqn B Flt North Coates 3x sections with 24 launchers
85 Sqn C Flt Bawdsey 2x sections with 12 launchers
85 Sqn D Flt West Ranyham 2x sections with 12 launchers (earmarked for Coltishall)
25 Sqn A Flt Barkston Heath 2x sections with 16 launchers
25 Sqn B Flt Wyton 2x sections with 16 launchers
25 Sqn C Flt Wattisham 2x sections with 12 launchers

Thus there were 112 operational launchers at the high point with 300 available missiles (the last three were fired in 1986). In theory there was nearly 2 reloads per launcher, however there were a few missiles that were rust buckets that wouldn't have survived a launch (the last RAF missile fired was such a round and it broke up during launch).

[Pontius Navigator]

Mainjafad. Fascinating, thank you. Not disagreeing with you for a moment. I heard about the buy back of Swedish and Swiss missiles. Now I heard that the missiles sold to them were 100% perfect. Now I heard the Swedes accepted the package on the basis that any modifications deemed essential by us would be incorporated by BAC. The other country accepted them as is.

Clearly it was not the Swedes or they didn't get all the mods.

[ORAC]

The only point I wil add is that during any 3 day AD exercise the force had always expended all it’s Mx stocks by the end of day one.

Working on historic kill rates from Vietnam/Arab-Israeli/Indo-Pakistan conflicts the general view was that in a shooting war they’d, hopefully, achieve 3-5 kills, and hopefully against any Kitchen/Kingfish Mx above and outside F-4 Sparrow snap-up range.

[MPN11]

Fascinating read, MAINJAFAD ... thank you.

Always grateful for the Bloodhound force for eventually giving ATC the jolly decent T82 radar to use in a more peaceful role, allowing Mil Area ATC to provide a better service in those relatively early days. It provided a step change in capability when compared with the T80 (slow, 4 rpm) and 264 (enormous blips at range), and of course shared use of the Scopies' T84/T85 (4 rpm).

[Wensleydale]

When the Computers and displays were replaced on Bloodhound 2 in 1986-89, they did include data links that allowed the whole system to be digitally integrated with itself along with command and control functions being carried out at Flight, Squadron and Force level. I do believe it was also going to be integrated into IUKADGE, but of course that didn't become operational until long after Bloodhound was canned.

Back in the '80s, I remember being tasked with "Voice Control of SAM" while working Neatishead from the NAEW E-3A. It sounds more interesting than it was, as the control just consisted of a track voice tell format which was usually responded to by a very bored "Roger" from the ground unit.