Strike threat at Cranwell
Clickable version: 'Increase pay or we'll walk out' - union's RAF Cranwell warning | Lincolnshire Live
Good luck with that! The MOD are going to a contractor because the provision of cleaning, grass-cutting, light bulb replacement etc are not what the MOD's business is about. Directly employing all the workers seems to defeat the efficiencies that are expected to be realised by going to a multi-activity contractor in the first place.
GMB says its policy is that profit-seeking contractors have no place in the Ministry of Defence and that ancillary services should be provided by directly employed workers who will spend their money in the local community.
GMB says its policy is that profit-seeking contractors have no place in the Ministry of Defence
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Let's be brutally honest here, ISS is a pretty horrible contractor.
Anyone been to the Home of Combat ISTAR Mess(es) recently?
Speak to some of the staff about how they are managed and it is very clear what ISS are all about.
That said, the above quote is plain Corbyn-Thornberry idiocy.
Anyone been to the Home of Combat ISTAR Mess(es) recently?
Speak to some of the staff about how they are managed and it is very clear what ISS are all about.
That said, the above quote is plain Corbyn-Thornberry idiocy.
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If every window that needed cleaning and drain needed unblocking was done by directly employed MOD staff, we'd have to double the defence budget and still probably not afford any aircraft. If the GMB have an issue with profit-seeking may I respectfully suggest they sod off to North Korea or Venezuela
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GMB says its policy is that profit-seeking contractors have no place in the Ministry of Defence.
UNITE say that there is no place for profit-seeking contractors in the NHS or public services.
The fact is that the unions see no place for profit-seeking contractors anywhere. And if Jeremy Corbet's lot get in there will be no profit making.
They will increase equality by making us all equally poor.
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TBM - when was the last time you lived and worked in Lincolnshire? As for ISS, SODEXO and others are not much better, with the MOD contracts its a case of who bids the lowest gets the contract and they then adjust their costs (pay low, deliver the worst service they can get away with) to ensure they make their margins. The same applies to a well known outsourcer that I now work for - it knows the cost of everything but the value of nothing - people are important, if you do not pay them enough and take the fact that house prices are still below the UK average in that part of Lincs then in reality there are few options. Travel to find work or move - probably not, particularly as most would have TUPED backwards and forwards over many years and would not be able to afford either options or are service dependents who are fed up with being used.
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Very telling .. Years ago I visited the new operators of 'Frankfurt-Hahn'. When the USAF pulled out, the local economy completely collapsed .. The locals welcomed with open arms the re-opening of the place as a civilian airport a few years later, because it provides jobs, stability and a future...
Food for thought TBM?
CS
I remember my military days as being fed well with good tucker by service personnel. Attended an aircrew graduation formal dinner in the mess recently and the standard of food could best be described as "slops". All civilian contractor now. Could see why those living in no longer eat in the mess, preferring to cook up a BBQ on the lawn outside their accommodation instead.
Although I enjoyed the comfort and privilege of living in the Mess during my service, one does wonder if it's time to move into the 21st century and scrap separate messes.
A single combined dining facility with separate areas for ORs, Seniors and Officers. The traditional messes becoming just social facilities?
A single combined dining facility with separate areas for ORs, Seniors and Officers. The traditional messes becoming just social facilities?
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
A few years ago the Lincolnshire edge presented problems for contractors retaining workers. You had Humberside, Kirton Lindsey, Scampton, Waddington, Digby, Cranwell and also Coningsby with contractors and different contract renewal dates. One, Serco, noted how appropriately skilled workers would flex up and down as new contracts offered higher pay.
Although I enjoyed the comfort and privilege of living in the Mess during my service, one does wonder if it's time to move into the 21st century and scrap separate messes.
A single combined dining facility with separate areas for ORs, Seniors and Officers. The traditional messes becoming just social facilities?
A single combined dining facility with separate areas for ORs, Seniors and Officers. The traditional messes becoming just social facilities?
In fact I know the SNCOs and Lads used to swap rank tabs at times, just for a change of view, not a change of food.
I remember my military days as being fed well with good tucker by service personnel. Attended an aircrew graduation formal dinner in the mess recently and the standard of food could best be described as "slops". All civilian contractor now. Could see why those living in no longer eat in the mess, preferring to cook up a BBQ on the lawn outside their accommodation instead.
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Nothing new there.
UNITE say that there is no place for profit-seeking contractors in the NHS or public services.
The fact is that the unions see no place for profit-seeking contractors anywhere. And if Jeremy Corbet's lot get in there will be no profit making.
They will increase equality by making us all equally poor.
UNITE say that there is no place for profit-seeking contractors in the NHS or public services.
The fact is that the unions see no place for profit-seeking contractors anywhere. And if Jeremy Corbet's lot get in there will be no profit making.
They will increase equality by making us all equally poor.
If Statbucks and Amazon paid ANY tax and we didn't have to spend £billions of taxpayers money on failed reckless bankers, maybe we all wouldn't be equally poor (except the RBS banker who gives himself a £3000000 bonus despite still making a loss year after year)
I too loved Mess Life and the fellowship it provided. I basically handed over my entire wage at the end of the month. No regrets. You could not afford to live out, you were not expected to live out. The car would be some old banger to get you to the pub and possibly shared by several of you to cut the cost. It was not a job, it was not a career - it was a way of life.
We are now in a different world. The young Officers now own houses, fast cars and jet off to all points in their free time. The Mess is a place to stay in the week. Dining In Nights are sometimes seen as an encroachment of their free time. Why eat the Mess food when you can head into town? Many go home at the weekend and their wives have equally demanding careers so the 'parties on the patch' are fast becoming a thing of the past.
No point worrying about it. Time to adapt so I agree about having one combined dining facility with some separate areas for socialising. I would, however, not like to see the day arrive where uniforms are only worn at work with all travelling done in civvies. Hair nets for those who do not want to cut their hair. Messes only opened for specific functions. That would not be good but I have seen that in other European countries. That would be the start of a very slippery slope.
As for the contractors. A very good friend of mine has just handed in his notice after 4 years as an FTRS Families Officer. Sick of the dreadful service, lack of understanding and 'who gives a sh*t' attitude of the chosen contractor(s).
Sign of the times I'm afraid. 'Whole Force Concept' = 'Cheap as Chips'.
We are now in a different world. The young Officers now own houses, fast cars and jet off to all points in their free time. The Mess is a place to stay in the week. Dining In Nights are sometimes seen as an encroachment of their free time. Why eat the Mess food when you can head into town? Many go home at the weekend and their wives have equally demanding careers so the 'parties on the patch' are fast becoming a thing of the past.
No point worrying about it. Time to adapt so I agree about having one combined dining facility with some separate areas for socialising. I would, however, not like to see the day arrive where uniforms are only worn at work with all travelling done in civvies. Hair nets for those who do not want to cut their hair. Messes only opened for specific functions. That would not be good but I have seen that in other European countries. That would be the start of a very slippery slope.
As for the contractors. A very good friend of mine has just handed in his notice after 4 years as an FTRS Families Officer. Sick of the dreadful service, lack of understanding and 'who gives a sh*t' attitude of the chosen contractor(s).
Sign of the times I'm afraid. 'Whole Force Concept' = 'Cheap as Chips'.
To be fair to the contractors in this particular case, a friend of mine 
recently ate a few meals in the WO & SNCOs Mess at Cranditz and the food was perfectly fine. Less choice than say 10 years ago but when you are catering for only about 20 (the most I saw eating at any meal), you'd expect that (well, I would). I realise the 'livers in' may have a different tale to tell (always thought that would be a good name for a scruff's bar - "The Livers Inn"
recently ate a few meals in the WO & SNCOs Mess at Cranditz and the food was perfectly fine. Less choice than say 10 years ago but when you are catering for only about 20 (the most I saw eating at any meal), you'd expect that (well, I would). I realise the 'livers in' may have a different tale to tell (always thought that would be a good name for a scruff's bar - "The Livers Inn"
gr4techie
I have no argument against the unions working to preserve/improve the things you have listed. But their hating of profit-making is an ideological one and it completely ignores the fact that wealth creation depends upon the profit motive. Without profitable companies there will be no money to spend on all the things which the unions want.
Companies like Starbucks and Amazon pay a lot of tax, but (because of international tax laws) they do not pay enough corporation tax in the UK.
The vast majority of the RBS losses are the result of mistakes which were made (or if you prefer sins committed) Before the current CEO joined the company. He has actually managed to reduce losses and operating costs by many billions. Blaming him for the historical problems is rather like you joining a squadron and then having your annual performance assessment being based on mistakes that were made by other people before you joined. Would you really consider that fair or even sensible?
Maybe the union wants to stop our race to the bottom and wants to protect the amount of equipment available, working conditions and quality of service?
I have no argument against the unions working to preserve/improve the things you have listed. But their hating of profit-making is an ideological one and it completely ignores the fact that wealth creation depends upon the profit motive. Without profitable companies there will be no money to spend on all the things which the unions want.
If Statbucks and Amazon paid ANY tax and we didn't have to spend £billions of taxpayers money on failed reckless bankers, maybe we all wouldn't be equally poor
Companies like Starbucks and Amazon pay a lot of tax, but (because of international tax laws) they do not pay enough corporation tax in the UK.
(except the RBS banker who gives himself a £3000000 bonus despite still making a loss year after year)
The vast majority of the RBS losses are the result of mistakes which were made (or if you prefer sins committed) Before the current CEO joined the company. He has actually managed to reduce losses and operating costs by many billions. Blaming him for the historical problems is rather like you joining a squadron and then having your annual performance assessment being based on mistakes that were made by other people before you joined. Would you really consider that fair or even sensible?
Last edited by keith williams; 16th May 2017 at 17:08.
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If there are no other jobs in the area then surely that is a very good reason to drive down wages. After all, where I live my employer is struggling to recruit domestic staff because local wages are high, and is having to offer more. It's called the market.
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Supply and demand - at some point they will cross on the price versus quantity graphs. That is the perfect pricing point.
...but some idiots (GMB, UNITE..) want no profit to be made which will encourage no contractor to bid. Profit is the oxygen of business (to state the obvious).
But if the wages are driven down in area where demand for jobs is high, then the contractor holds all of the aces, can thrash staff, deliver a poor service (such as at a Combat ISTAR base) and get away with it.
Heard from management - 'I don't work for the RAF, the RAF work for me.'
...but some idiots (GMB, UNITE..) want no profit to be made which will encourage no contractor to bid. Profit is the oxygen of business (to state the obvious).
But if the wages are driven down in area where demand for jobs is high, then the contractor holds all of the aces, can thrash staff, deliver a poor service (such as at a Combat ISTAR base) and get away with it.
Heard from management - 'I don't work for the RAF, the RAF work for me.'