Masters of the Air
Join Date: Oct 2001
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Join Date: Feb 2006
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Watching the first episode now as I have Apple TV and it Is forming up to be a cracking series IMHO.
Even you have not got Apple TV I think you will find you can watch the first episode on it as a trial.
Even you have not got Apple TV I think you will find you can watch the first episode on it as a trial.
Geri wrote:
No it wasn’t, when you compare it to the RAF only being able to get 1 in 3 bombs dropped within FIVE miles of the target before the pathfinders it has to be considered precision for the time. Often the average 8th groups matched the accuracy of the most highly trained RAF specialists as the destruction of the FW plant at Marienburg demonstrated.
When the lead bombardier opened his bomb doors, the others followed suit, watching for his bombs to fall, when they too pressed the button, the target receiving a simultaneous rain of bombs half a mile wide and one mile long. So it wasn't carpet bombing?
Sorry to add fuel to the tread drift of bombing accuracy - in the book "Inferno", the author (Joe Pappalardo) claims that a post war study comparing bombing accuracy between the RAF and the USAAF (IIRC, it was percentage of bombs within a given distance of the 'target'), the USAAF was better, but the difference was slight - as in about 1%.
According to what I've also read, the Norden had the capability of being very accurate, but that was with manufacturing tolerances what were impossible to meet in the sort of mass production that was required and with more knowledge of ambient conditions (especially wind speeds) than the bombers could possibly have in wartime.
According to what I've also read, the Norden had the capability of being very accurate, but that was with manufacturing tolerances what were impossible to meet in the sort of mass production that was required and with more knowledge of ambient conditions (especially wind speeds) than the bombers could possibly have in wartime.
Well, I watched the two episodes last night and to be honest I was thoroughly underwhelmed. I know it’s a drama, based on fact, which at the end of the day is supposed to be entertainment and therefore those of us with some understanding of the valiant efforts of the 8th Air Force and some knowledge of aviation are not really the target audience.
I found the storyline thin and too many of the leading characters looking very unconvincing. The CGI was poor, the scenes inside the aircraft much better.
The stereotype token RAF scene was pathetic rather like Nigel Pargetter appearing as a
senior Parachute Regiment Officer in Band of Brothers ! I did quite enjoy the crosswind landing scene into Greenland which made me feel rather nostalgic……….
Hopefully a disappointing start which will lead to improvement in future episodes.
I found the storyline thin and too many of the leading characters looking very unconvincing. The CGI was poor, the scenes inside the aircraft much better.
The stereotype token RAF scene was pathetic rather like Nigel Pargetter appearing as a
senior Parachute Regiment Officer in Band of Brothers ! I did quite enjoy the crosswind landing scene into Greenland which made me feel rather nostalgic……….
Hopefully a disappointing start which will lead to improvement in future episodes.
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Sorry to add fuel to the tread drift of bombing accuracy - in the book "Inferno", the author (Joe Pappalardo) claims that a post war study comparing bombing accuracy between the RAF and the USAAF (IIRC, it was percentage of bombs within a given distance of the 'target'), the USAAF was better, but the difference was slight - as in about 1%.
According to what I've also read, the Norden had the capability of being very accurate, but that was with manufacturing tolerances what were impossible to meet in the sort of mass production that was required and with more knowledge of ambient conditions (especially wind speeds) than the bombers could possibly have in wartime.
According to what I've also read, the Norden had the capability of being very accurate, but that was with manufacturing tolerances what were impossible to meet in the sort of mass production that was required and with more knowledge of ambient conditions (especially wind speeds) than the bombers could possibly have in wartime.
Join Date: Feb 2006
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Well, I watched the two episodes last night and to be honest I was thoroughly underwhelmed. I know it’s a drama, based on fact, which at the end of the day is supposed to be entertainment and therefore those of us with some understanding of the valiant efforts of the 8th Air Force and some knowledge of aviation are not really the target audience.
I found the storyline thin and too many of the leading characters looking very unconvincing. The CGI was poor, the scenes inside the aircraft much better.
The stereotype token RAF scene was pathetic rather like Nigel Pargetter appearing as a
senior Parachute Regiment Officer in Band of Brothers ! I did quite enjoy the crosswind landing scene into Greenland which made me feel rather nostalgic……….
Hopefully a disappointing start which will lead to improvement in future episodes.
I found the storyline thin and too many of the leading characters looking very unconvincing. The CGI was poor, the scenes inside the aircraft much better.
The stereotype token RAF scene was pathetic rather like Nigel Pargetter appearing as a
senior Parachute Regiment Officer in Band of Brothers ! I did quite enjoy the crosswind landing scene into Greenland which made me feel rather nostalgic……….
Hopefully a disappointing start which will lead to improvement in future episodes.
An interesting article on the pros and cons of the RAF approach and the USAF approach to bombing. The Norden bomb sight was quite accurate at 1500' and lower, but as would be expected rose considerably with increased altitude.
The Allied Rift on Strategic Bombing | Air & Space Forces Magazine (airandspaceforces.com)
The Allied Rift on Strategic Bombing | Air & Space Forces Magazine (airandspaceforces.com)
On average, in 1939, only a third of the bombs hit within five miles of the aiming point. In the Ruhr Valley—Germany’s industrial heartland, defended by guns and fighters—strikes were even less accurate.
“ In 1943, rather than dropping bombs into pickle barrels, 8th Air Force bombardiers were having trouble hitting the broad side of a barn,” said historian Stephen L. McFarland of Air University. Average CEP soared to 1,200 feet.
2 episodes in and I liked. it. I tend to be overly analytical on computer animation and aircraft details, but I told myself to just sit back and enjoy it, and I did. The interior aircraft sets and the detail, such as switches, checklists, etc. are incredible. The CGI is acceptable and the characters (from an American point of view) are fine.
Join Date: Feb 2006
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An interesting article on the pros and cons of the RAF approach and the USAF approach to bombing. The Norden bomb sight was quite accurate at 1500' and lower, but as would be expected rose considerably with increased altitude.
The Allied Rift on Strategic Bombing | Air & Space Forces Magazine (airandspaceforces.com)
The Allied Rift on Strategic Bombing | Air & Space Forces Magazine (airandspaceforces.com)
Episode three:
’This is the largest air armada ever assembled in the history of mankind!’
Well, apart from the three RAF 1,000 bomber raids over a year earlier, all of which were bigger…
’This is the largest air armada ever assembled in the history of mankind!’
Well, apart from the three RAF 1,000 bomber raids over a year earlier, all of which were bigger…
Last edited by snapper41; 6th Feb 2024 at 14:52.
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As with all CGI of WW2 aeroplanes, the speeds they fly at look completely wrong. The ME109s flashing through the B17 formations appear to be going at phenomenal speeds, way in excess of the 350 - 400mph they were probably doing. If you look at actual footage from these battles, the German fighters are going nowhere near the speeds portrayed by CGI. I assume that they're all speeded up to add to the excitement, but it just looks wrong to me.
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I enjoyed seeing the houses outside the airfield perimeter with the UPVC guttering!
Im enjoying it. The incident with the RAF in episode 2 smacks of lazy stereotyping to me, but then the target market is the US audience, not the UKs.
Im enjoying it. The incident with the RAF in episode 2 smacks of lazy stereotyping to me, but then the target market is the US audience, not the UKs.
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As with all CGI of WW2 aeroplanes, the speeds they fly at look completely wrong. The ME109s flashing through the B17 formations appear to be going at phenomenal speeds, way in excess of the 350 - 400mph they were probably doing. If you look at actual footage from these battles, the German fighters are going nowhere near the speeds portrayed by CGI. I assume that they're all speeded up to add to the excitement, but it just looks wrong to me.
Easy to forget the assessment at the end where they decide the RAF are probably right...
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