Keystone Kops Go flying!
Nosey,
Good points. Press reports - especially in the national newspapers are more often wrong in some detail than right. They may also be hugely out of date. The recent 'revelation' about being able to intercept and watch intelligence imagery from US assets over the Balkans had been all over the internet months ago, and was in a monthly aviation mag in about April. Fleet Street caught up with it in June.....
You seem to be hinting that this latest revelation may be 'old news' - perhaps dating from before the decision to resurrect the AMRAAM optimisation programme. Perhaps it was the reason that the programme was resurrected?
C'mon, nosey, confirming that surely wouldn't contravene OSA, and would probably win you promotion to Squadron Leader, Wing Commander or even Group Captain for wiping the egg off MoD faces!
Good points. Press reports - especially in the national newspapers are more often wrong in some detail than right. They may also be hugely out of date. The recent 'revelation' about being able to intercept and watch intelligence imagery from US assets over the Balkans had been all over the internet months ago, and was in a monthly aviation mag in about April. Fleet Street caught up with it in June.....
You seem to be hinting that this latest revelation may be 'old news' - perhaps dating from before the decision to resurrect the AMRAAM optimisation programme. Perhaps it was the reason that the programme was resurrected?
C'mon, nosey, confirming that surely wouldn't contravene OSA, and would probably win you promotion to Squadron Leader, Wing Commander or even Group Captain for wiping the egg off MoD faces!
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rota,
yes i have been that lucky, twice.
can't mail you cause your profile don't have your e-mail.
don't quite understand you ref to speed! please enlighten.
noody.
"my jet now has more booze,birds,leather seats and thrust than yours!"
yes i have been that lucky, twice.
can't mail you cause your profile don't have your e-mail.
don't quite understand you ref to speed! please enlighten.
noody.
"my jet now has more booze,birds,leather seats and thrust than yours!"
Lupus Domesticus
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WE, was that a typo, or was your journalist/enthusiast mate actually fried at the time, like most of them? Jacko, you're not allowed to answer this one.
Also...if Fat is a ratio of weight to height, do we all become fat b@stards when lying down? What about at altitude? What about when lying down at altitude?
Also...if Fat is a ratio of weight to height, do we all become fat b@stards when lying down? What about at altitude? What about when lying down at altitude?
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And what about that letter from your Commander at basic training saying why they booted you 
Does it matter which way you sleep in space? How does having less gravity change your body mass index?
Does it matter which way you sleep in space? How does having less gravity change your body mass index?
'Twasn't anything to do with size that was the problem, it was being four seconds too slow in a 300 yard sprint.
I'll email you about the other thing.
What has this got to do with Tornado F3/Foxhunter/AMRAAM anyway?
BlueWolf, my friend's a good bloke. He (and I) was talking about the power, not the processing capability.
I'll email you about the other thing.
What has this got to do with Tornado F3/Foxhunter/AMRAAM anyway?
BlueWolf, my friend's a good bloke. He (and I) was talking about the power, not the processing capability.
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In answer to a couple of points raised here...
ASRAAM will not be fitted to Harrier GR7, nor GR9.
AMRAAM is not "currently" fitted to F3s on operations.
So sez MoD.
Well that was £125m well spent then.
Got a fistful of notes here boys, anyone got a lighter?
ASRAAM will not be fitted to Harrier GR7, nor GR9.
AMRAAM is not "currently" fitted to F3s on operations.
So sez MoD.
Well that was £125m well spent then.
Got a fistful of notes here boys, anyone got a lighter?
Frankly, the Telegraph article is pure twaddle. The F3 is cleared for ASRAAM and AMRAAM in addition to Sidewinder and Skyflash. The missiles fielded by the RAF in the Falklands, over Iraq and on QRA over London are operating decisions based on many factors. The AOP, currently under development (and going well) will improve the AMRAAM capability of the F3. To date, the RAF have never fired an AMRAAM off an F3 in trials. The only such trials have been conducted by BAE SYSTEMS, and there were no wingmen to endanger. In any case, the trials were a complete success. As I said, the Telegraph is talking through its jet-pipe, and not for the first time on defence mattersI suspect that a disgruntled SHAR advocate is behind this fiction. I dont want to get into that debate, but bad-mouthing the F3 will not reverse a decision taken after the best advice available was digested. That does not mean, of course, that the advice was good, merely the best available. If you have ever worked in the MoD, you'll understand.
Meanwhile, the chaps are very impressed by ASRAAM. The Service firings of this missile were extremely impressive.
Given the weapons suite and JTIDS the F3 is a formidable platform.
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Max,
You speak a thousand truths!! I know a lot of F16 / F18 / F15 drivers who have foolisly thought an F3 was easy meat! even when armed with SkyFlash. Here's an idea, match the weapon to the sensor............Fox Hunter, JTIDS etc give a RAP (No WE I'll not explain what that is) second to non, here or overseas, in a fighter sized aircraft. However, that wedge of cash that "TL" needs a lighter for, may be better spent on colour TvTabs and a HMS.
WE- If you ever go north of Doncaster, you'll find the phrase "a bit fat" used a lot. It is kind of a joke, and generally doesn't refer to a persons actual weight (although it can), it is a way of saying "Fat in the Head", ie a cranium filled with glutinous fatty tissues, rather than the complex matrix of nuerons, nerves and grey matter that anyone who flys Her Majesty's finest fighters have! or, to a lesser degree, those of us who fly (or have flown) F3s!!
So, finally we have outed this scandalous text as total fiction. The question still remains, when will the F3 have "Full Up" AMRAAM? If the EuroFolly progect is progressing as well as I expect, we'll need it! Also, giving the F3 the best ASRAAM capability possible is probably more critical, since this would make up for some of the airframes turning limitations (Although it will easily out turn a SHAR!, and Jacko...a Jag!)
For Current F3 Mates: Imagine a "weapons tight" VID on a pair of SU 27s (or Mig29s)............tricky Eh?
Rota
You speak a thousand truths!! I know a lot of F16 / F18 / F15 drivers who have foolisly thought an F3 was easy meat! even when armed with SkyFlash. Here's an idea, match the weapon to the sensor............Fox Hunter, JTIDS etc give a RAP (No WE I'll not explain what that is) second to non, here or overseas, in a fighter sized aircraft. However, that wedge of cash that "TL" needs a lighter for, may be better spent on colour TvTabs and a HMS.
WE- If you ever go north of Doncaster, you'll find the phrase "a bit fat" used a lot. It is kind of a joke, and generally doesn't refer to a persons actual weight (although it can), it is a way of saying "Fat in the Head", ie a cranium filled with glutinous fatty tissues, rather than the complex matrix of nuerons, nerves and grey matter that anyone who flys Her Majesty's finest fighters have! or, to a lesser degree, those of us who fly (or have flown) F3s!!
So, finally we have outed this scandalous text as total fiction. The question still remains, when will the F3 have "Full Up" AMRAAM? If the EuroFolly progect is progressing as well as I expect, we'll need it! Also, giving the F3 the best ASRAAM capability possible is probably more critical, since this would make up for some of the airframes turning limitations (Although it will easily out turn a SHAR!, and Jacko...a Jag!)
For Current F3 Mates: Imagine a "weapons tight" VID on a pair of SU 27s (or Mig29s)............tricky Eh?
Rota
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Beagle,
The F3 is our only Supersonic Interceptor, consequently it should be fully intergrated with a Secure, Co-Ordinated, Recognised Air Picture.........Hang on, that spells SCRAP!
I just talked myself out of a job!.............Booger!
Noody- If you don't remember speeding, you're not who I thought you were!
Rota
The F3 is our only Supersonic Interceptor, consequently it should be fully intergrated with a Secure, Co-Ordinated, Recognised Air Picture.........Hang on, that spells SCRAP!
I just talked myself out of a job!.............Booger!
Noody- If you don't remember speeding, you're not who I thought you were!
Rota
keystone kops
RotaDish,your ref. to speeding,is it perhaps about the day the roof got lifted off the Fire Section at MPA,and Bristows evacuated the building?Said pilot rtu`d next day?
Well
I'VE always thought the Tornado F3 a good aircraft, with first class pilots and navigators and similarly excellent engineering guys. So don't accuse me of demeaning the importance of the Tornado (either F or GR types) or the importance of UK air defence.
I'VE always thought the Tornado F3 a good aircraft, with first class pilots and navigators and similarly excellent engineering guys. So don't accuse me of demeaning the importance of the Tornado (either F or GR types) or the importance of UK air defence.
Correct, Jacko!
Wish that the RAF had been able to afford the full JTIDS fit we'd developed for the VC10 a few years ago! Large display in full colour, soft key menus, intuitive symbology.....
If the F3s belonging to the Fuerza Area Malvinas won't stop speeding, then put the hindenburger tanks back on the jets!! Perhaps they wouldn't need AAR then - and we could spring the '10 away from the wretched place once and for all.......
Wish that the RAF had been able to afford the full JTIDS fit we'd developed for the VC10 a few years ago! Large display in full colour, soft key menus, intuitive symbology.....
If the F3s belonging to the Fuerza Area Malvinas won't stop speeding, then put the hindenburger tanks back on the jets!! Perhaps they wouldn't need AAR then - and we could spring the '10 away from the wretched place once and for all.......
Mmmmmmmm
JTIDS was going to be part of the SHAR upgrade, along with an LRG base nav/attack system and of course the new engine.
Where did the money/aircraft/pilots/everyone else go?
JTIDS was going to be part of the SHAR upgrade, along with an LRG base nav/attack system and of course the new engine.
Where did the money/aircraft/pilots/everyone else go?
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I sincerely hope that Maxburner is right and the report is a load of twaddle. I can understand that the Telegraph (or any other paper) would be reluctant to print "sorry, what we wrote the other day was utter bo**ocks", but shouldn't someone be jumping up and down, throwing teddy out of the cot and complaining about "so and so" misleading the House of Commons?