SDSR 15
Maroonman4
That sort of attitude is also displayed in the Government's attitude to the police where reforms have been brought in based on rehashed research by one man and is more about political dogma than academic rigour. If that can be said of the armed forces and police does the same apply to Tory changes to the NHS or education?
I wish I could add something of value to this thread, and if I/we all thought that the next SDSR would be presented after deep thought, academic rigour and a strategically robust evolution conducted over sensible timelines, then maybe we would all chip in and give our two pennies worth. But really we all know it is just another cost cutting exercise, and we haven't even finished trying to implement the huge change from the last SDSR yet.
It applies to everything done by politicians. They, sometimes, "consult" people who do know the subject but, if the response is not what the politician wants, they ignore it. They can, of course, truthfully say that there have been consultations with interested parties.
Gentleman Aviator
As I have often said before, the correct SDSR process is - in theory -simple. It goes thusly:
1. Chancellor: O CDS, how much cash do you want?
2. CDS: O Minister, what do you want us to do?
3. Minister: We want you to do, A, B C, D ........... Z
4. CDS: That will cost you £X squillion.
5. Chancellor: You can't have that much, you can only have £Y squillion.
6. CDS: O Minister, what less do you want us to do.
7. Minister: We might settle for A, B, C, D ............ Q
8. CDS: That'll cost you £X-Z squillion.
9. Chancellor: Still too much. £X-Z squillion > £Y squillion.
10. LOOP Serial 6 - Serial 9 until £X-Z squillion = £Y squillion.
Will it ever happen like that??? What do you think!
1. Chancellor: O CDS, how much cash do you want?
2. CDS: O Minister, what do you want us to do?
3. Minister: We want you to do, A, B C, D ........... Z
4. CDS: That will cost you £X squillion.
5. Chancellor: You can't have that much, you can only have £Y squillion.
6. CDS: O Minister, what less do you want us to do.
7. Minister: We might settle for A, B, C, D ............ Q
8. CDS: That'll cost you £X-Z squillion.
9. Chancellor: Still too much. £X-Z squillion > £Y squillion.
10. LOOP Serial 6 - Serial 9 until £X-Z squillion = £Y squillion.
Will it ever happen like that??? What do you think!
1. Chancellor: O CDS, how much cash do you want?
2. CDS: O Minister, what do you want us to do?
3. Minister: We want you to do everything.
4. CDS: That will cost you £X squillion.
5. Chancellor: You can't have that much, you can only have £Y squillion.
6. CDS: O Minister, what less do you want us to do.
7. Minister: Nothing, we want you to do all of it.
8. CDS: That'll cost you £X squillion.
9. Chancellor: I told you, you can only have £Y squillion.
10. LOOP Serial 6 - Serial 9 until Minister and/or CDS gets fed up.
11. CDS: OK.
12. Chancellor: oh, by the way, we'll also need you make another W squillions of in year savings and I'll get back to you about the cuts, er, SDSR later in the year.
2. CDS: O Minister, what do you want us to do?
3. Minister: We want you to do everything.
4. CDS: That will cost you £X squillion.
5. Chancellor: You can't have that much, you can only have £Y squillion.
6. CDS: O Minister, what less do you want us to do.
7. Minister: Nothing, we want you to do all of it.
8. CDS: That'll cost you £X squillion.
9. Chancellor: I told you, you can only have £Y squillion.
10. LOOP Serial 6 - Serial 9 until Minister and/or CDS gets fed up.
11. CDS: OK.
12. Chancellor: oh, by the way, we'll also need you make another W squillions of in year savings and I'll get back to you about the cuts, er, SDSR later in the year.
Really, Pious, an unworthy comment. You do get the difference between deficit and debt, don't you? You guys complain that the previous Government cut too hard to reduce the deficit and then complain that the debt increased. Do you really think any government could have zerod-out a deficit of that size in five years?
I was watching Norman Lamb, Lib Dem MP, on Question Time last night. In response to a question about further Defence cuts, he trotted out the old mantra about Defence and Security of us all, in so many words, as being his first and foremost consideration as you'll here any Politician, put on the spot, say. He then went on to point out the 'however' that Defence can not be treated any differently to any other Government Department!
I'll say something the four female guests on the panel had a far greater and realistic grasp of the issue of national defence than he did.
After all the recent ring fencing I still struggle to understand
FB
I'll say something the four female guests on the panel had a far greater and realistic grasp of the issue of national defence than he did.
After all the recent ring fencing I still struggle to understand
FB
Last edited by Finningley Boy; 6th Jun 2015 at 12:04.
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QT was quite illuminating for a number of reasons..
1. it reinforced the view that our current breed of MP are entirely self serving, bar the occasional lone exception.
2. the foreign aid budget IS fair and is of enormous benefit to those countries with fledgling space and nuclear weapons programs.
3. the EU is magnificent and has kept Europe at peace for a very long time allowing us to trot around the globe asserting democracy at the point of a laser.
And the final irony, lost on quite a few, was the skilled immigrant from Romania telling us we should let more of his mates in!! Why can't WE train and retain enough doctors then
1. it reinforced the view that our current breed of MP are entirely self serving, bar the occasional lone exception.
2. the foreign aid budget IS fair and is of enormous benefit to those countries with fledgling space and nuclear weapons programs.
3. the EU is magnificent and has kept Europe at peace for a very long time allowing us to trot around the globe asserting democracy at the point of a laser.
And the final irony, lost on quite a few, was the skilled immigrant from Romania telling us we should let more of his mates in!! Why can't WE train and retain enough doctors then
I don't think it's a coincidence that that particular line of questioning on QT was followed up by this article in the DT today, fleshing out some of the numbers I posted in an earlier post:
British aid billions 'subsidising' third world defence budgets - Telegraph
As for the irony of the Romanian doctor, I think that was lost on many. There was much of the UKIP manifesto that I didn't agree with, for practical as well as doctrinal reasons, but they were spot on about more effectively managing immigration so we can more effectively choose who comes to join our club. That to my mind is just common sense given our small and limited geographical size which is probably why it would never fly in political circles.
British aid billions 'subsidising' third world defence budgets - Telegraph
As for the irony of the Romanian doctor, I think that was lost on many. There was much of the UKIP manifesto that I didn't agree with, for practical as well as doctrinal reasons, but they were spot on about more effectively managing immigration so we can more effectively choose who comes to join our club. That to my mind is just common sense given our small and limited geographical size which is probably why it would never fly in political circles.
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"Why can't WE train and retain enough doctors then"
because the consultants already in place throttle the supply so they keep their fees up tbh
and most immigrants are doing work that you can't get a true Brit to even think of doing - ask any farmer, or restaurant owner ................ or anyone wanting nursing assistants at midnight on a Saturday
because the consultants already in place throttle the supply so they keep their fees up tbh
and most immigrants are doing work that you can't get a true Brit to even think of doing - ask any farmer, or restaurant owner ................ or anyone wanting nursing assistants at midnight on a Saturday
Last edited by Heathrow Harry; 7th Jun 2015 at 14:52.
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Interestingly, since my flying pay was cut, my wife has been working as a nursing assistant at a local care home to make up the difference, she's the only Brit there. To be fair, they all work 12 hour shifts for 5p above minimum wage. And are excellent workers, no Brit will go near it. But to be honest, you are sacrificing a lot of pride to work for that sort of money. 
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Yeah - our local A&E is pretty much doctors from the Sub-Continent and nurses and assistants from Phillipines & W Africa after 17:00 on Friday
and the cleaners & Catering staff are all Somalis and Romanians as faras I can see
and the cleaners & Catering staff are all Somalis and Romanians as faras I can see
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£500m
Having recently left the RAF I would suggest that the savings could be made by cutting out some of the inefficiencies. In fact cutting out just half of the waste would cover the savings required and pay for a Sqn of P8s.
A lot of these arguments sound like those I used to read in the Herald every morning (the main Zimbabwean daily).
Take the "why can't we train" one for example: training takes time so the milk is already spilled and all the moaning and all the kings horses can't make a doctor for tomorrow morning. While you fiddle around with the knobs and valves and keep trying to get something without paying the requisite amount of tax, new doctors have to be obtained right away.
The same sort of thing goes for all the other jobs - while you argue about the reasons and solutions, while you try X and it doesn't work and then try Y, today's business needs to get done. If it can't get done now, then by the time you finally get your act together, that industry may no longer exist on your shores.
Take the "why can't we train" one for example: training takes time so the milk is already spilled and all the moaning and all the kings horses can't make a doctor for tomorrow morning. While you fiddle around with the knobs and valves and keep trying to get something without paying the requisite amount of tax, new doctors have to be obtained right away.
The same sort of thing goes for all the other jobs - while you argue about the reasons and solutions, while you try X and it doesn't work and then try Y, today's business needs to get done. If it can't get done now, then by the time you finally get your act together, that industry may no longer exist on your shores.
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The SDSR will be at "The end of the year" declared SOS in Parliament this morning.
The SNP went on the their usual rant about No Nukes in Scotland
and followed it with an Interesting discussion on MPA, waxing lyrically about "returning the capability to its historical and geographical homeland"
St Mawgan it is then ! Screw you SNP
The SNP went on the their usual rant about No Nukes in Scotland
and followed it with an Interesting discussion on MPA, waxing lyrically about "returning the capability to its historical and geographical homeland"
St Mawgan it is then ! Screw you SNP
No matter what they say, just the risk of another independence vote means that the MoD would be bloody mad to establish anything new north of the border. The potential relocation costs would eat the ever-shrinking budget. I think SNP may be hoisted by their own whatits.