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1869 (Middlesbrough) Squadron ATC Long Service

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1869 (Middlesbrough) Squadron ATC Long Service

Old 15th Apr 2014, 00:05
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pzu
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Thumbs up 1869 (Middlesbrough) Squadron ATC Long Service

Two Cadet instructors with1869 (Middlesbrough) Squadron ATC receive Mayoral Awards recognising a combined 90 years service

Nine decades of air cadet service rewarded (From The Northern Echo)

Congratulations from a 1965 vintage cadet

PZU - Out of Africa Retired
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Old 15th Apr 2014, 22:50
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I joined 1869 at the same time as "Dicky" Bird and knew him well. Good to see that both he, and Dave Bowman, are still going strong.

We'll done guys

B-E
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Old 17th Apr 2014, 08:57
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Ah... Coulby Newham TA Centre, Grob flights out of Catterick and the tricky walk home through Hemlington in uniform.

Seeing those two faces took me right back. To 1986, to be precise.

Congratulations, both.
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Old 17th Apr 2014, 11:08
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Surprised they were allowed to stay on. In my wing, they stuck pretty rigidly to the 'out at 55' rule with few exceptions.
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Old 20th Apr 2014, 11:59
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Chevvron,


You'll be pleased to know that the air cadets is rather more flexible about dealing with its volunteer staff these days. If a person continues to contribute and is effective and willing, what's the advantage of getting rid of them because of some artificial age ceiling.


However, the Corps is always on the lookout for new talent.


One just has to see the smiles on the faces of cadets who have done something special and one realises that the ATC is probably the best youth organisation in the country. It also produces young people who are a credit to society.


It's the range and depth of the young peoples' achievements which makes working with the cadets so very satisfying. If you've the time to spare and the inclination to be involved - get down to your local sqn!!


Old Duffer
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Old 20th Apr 2014, 13:43
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Surprised by the medal, one would have thought they would be using something like the LS&GC medal, all be it with an AirCadet bar.. I do like the idea of added bars at intervals, which is a throwback to good conduct stripes, which perhaps the LS&GC should have..
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Old 21st Apr 2014, 05:45
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Well Nutloose, the whole subject of medals was IMHO rather casually dealt with by the report from Sir John Holmes (?) about two years ago. The report was OK as far as it went but could have had some wider TofRs.


There remains some disquiet re the changes introduced circa 1993 by John Major in an attempt to make everybody equal. In addition, the various long service medals for different types of reserves were not rationalised nor reasons given for not doing so.


The time qualifier for the LS&GCM was brought down from 18 to 15 years many moons ago but the issue of officers' eligibility in a changing world was never properly addressed - one reason apparently being, 'what happens if an officer fails to qualify because the GC bit of his/her service isn't up to the mark'?


The Cadet Forces Medal (CFM) is awarded to uniformed volunteers who become eligible after twelve years (essentially unbroken) service. Certain cadet service can also count and a regular who moves straight into the cadet forces can also count some of their service, as long as it's not also being used for some other long service award. Interestingly, the clasp is sewn directly to the ribbon of the medal, whereas in most other medals, clasps/bars are actually connected to the medal itself.


The award of a CFM is highly prized by volunteers. It's no fun stirring from a warm fireside in the depth of winter and going to a cold wooden hut in some dingy part of town. However, as I suggested in my previous post, there is enormous satisfaction to be had from making a difference to the young people who join the cadets. A callow youth of 13 soon becomes a cadet warrant officer of 20 with a shed load of achievements which most young people can only wonder at.


Old Duffer
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Old 21st Apr 2014, 09:51
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You can (could in the mid 70s) be awarded the LS&GCM as an officer. I got mine when a Fg Off. because for 12 of the 15 qualifying years I was non-commissioned. There are many officers with the medal of course because if you've already got it you remain entitled to wear it on commissioning, but I believe those of us who got it as officers will be in a small minority.
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Old 21st Apr 2014, 11:37
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EngAl,


Absolutely right for those with air person service. I meant exclusively officer service and by extension insufficient airman/woman service to qualify after commissioning.


Old Duffer
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Old 21st Apr 2014, 18:55
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Of course Old-Duffer is correct that if one only has officer's service then no LSGC.

IIRC, a minimum of 6 years airman service is required to "qualify", the subsequent officer service then only counts as 50%!

So having done that six, another 18 years of officer service would be needed - no wonder they are rare!
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Old 21st Apr 2014, 22:34
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Good to see these two still going strong - and also interested to see that Ray "Robocop" Mallon is also still going strong as the elected Mayor of Middlesborough after some 12 years in post.

Jack
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Old 21st Apr 2014, 22:47
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Thanks Old Duffer for explaining.

I thought removing the medal and issuing the cross version for all was a good move btw
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Old 22nd Apr 2014, 05:54
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Nutloose,


Perhaps surprisingly, there was a good deal of moaning from those who were formerly recipients of the medal, rather than the cross. There was a certain degree of 'exclusivity' about a DFM or an MM for example.


Two other comments were ( and possibly still are): the continuation with the old medal titles eg Military Cross, led to confusion and it would have been better to have had new titles, as was the case with the Conspicuous Gallantry Cross (CGC). Second, and a point aimed at the RAF I suspect, is that the opportunity to win - say - a DFC as an NCO was reduced because in general, it would only be helicopter rear crew who might reach 'the bar' set. Whilst there have been a couple of AFCs and at least one QGM - search and rescue -, I think the last gallantry award to non commissioned aircrew in the heat of battle goes back to Gulf War One and that can't be right given the performance of the guys and gals involved. Whilst not wishing to follow our US brethren (I always thought 'medal of the month' had something to do with golf) perhaps an award such as the Air Medal, might be worth considering for repeat tours. The Accumulated Service Medal doesn't quite 'do it' for me.


Old Duffer
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Old 22nd Apr 2014, 07:59
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Old-Duffer

as ever, you are right on the medal/cross problem.

The last DFM was indeed - IIRC - awarded to a Chinook crewperson in GW I, who had already been awarded an AFM - also one of the last. I think he's been advised - TTN may wish to comment - that the (monetary) worth of that group is extremely high!

And of course, there's no reason why decisions cannot be reversed; after all, we've got the BEM back after some years of MBE only........
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Old 26th Apr 2014, 15:02
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Apologies for drifting the Thread.


Today I received a copy of a new book: "Horizons - a history of the air cadets".


At first glance it's packed with stories and information about the air cadet organisation both past and present - there's even a photo of TTH!!


It's a bit pricey from the publisher but the well known river has it seriously discounted but has no stock to supply it yet!


Old Duffer
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Old 26th Apr 2014, 15:09
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there's even a photo of TTH!!
Good Lord!

I'm sure it's a fine piece of work, but other writers may have had a different slant on the history.......!
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Old 27th Apr 2014, 06:05
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Well, as they say, I couldn't possibly comment!


It contains a 'partial' Roll of Honour of cadets. My only initial 'gripe' was that a full RofH was offered but thought inappropriate. Ah well!


That said, I bought two copies and shall be setting one copy off on the rounds of that part of the organisation where I have an interest.


Old Duffer
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Old 27th Apr 2014, 12:13
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O-D

One hopes the "partial" Roll of Honour includes Cadet Edward Wilson (26 Jan 1975).
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Old 27th Apr 2014, 13:52
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Civilian instructor long service ?

I know of a CI with approaching 40 years of unbroken service to the ATC and think that this deserves some form of recognition, is there any way the ATC can do this ?
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Old 27th Apr 2014, 14:09
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A and C

There are many ways such service can be formally recognised. There are Commendations from Commandant Air Cadets, AOC 22 Group and CAS; above those there is the DCLA - Defence Council Letter of Appreciation.

An MBE or the more recently re-introduced BEM may be a player but - with all due deference to the subject - they require more than Long Service and Good Conduct as competition for State Awards such as these is fierce.

Best move is to discuss it with the OC Wing or (probably better!) the Wg Ex O. If you don't know who these are, PM me with details of location or Sqn and I can provide a contact.

Teeters
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