WE177 incident at RAF Bruggen
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Now you could only do that on a forecast. I recall low flying over the North Sea being limited to, say, south of 54 north.
PN
All I can say is you must have a better memory than me! I cannot even remember sea state being mentioned when briefing for yet another sortie of PIs over the North Sea! Sometimes we did four on the same night too!
All I can say is you must have a better memory than me! I cannot even remember sea state being mentioned when briefing for yet another sortie of PIs over the North Sea! Sometimes we did four on the same night too!
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I'm glad I wasn't on the EOD team that day.
"Whats the EOD job boss? Some PPK pistol misfired again down the range?"
"No, just a 10kt nuke".
"I hope you have a steady hand or can run far".
"Whats the EOD job boss? Some PPK pistol misfired again down the range?"
"No, just a 10kt nuke".
"I hope you have a steady hand or can run far".
PN: dct, there was more room under a Vulcan and we used to do simultaneous HO/TO at the end of the load sequence.
Luxury, a 900lb mc gave us about one/two inch's either end of the bomb bay in a bucc! The rare double load was a real nightmare
Luxury, a 900lb mc gave us about one/two inch's either end of the bomb bay in a bucc! The rare double load was a real nightmare
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
dct, (950!) I endeared myself the them at Bruggen when I said, now shut the door.
Four groundies lay down and footed the door closed
Four groundies lay down and footed the door closed
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I remember a room mate at the time when learning I was about to do Q telling me all the fire engines had to respond el pronto to Q if there was a fire and it over rid everything else, asking him why, he didn't know, and I sure as heck wasn't going to enlighten him, my thoughts were heading in the opposite direction preferably up wind.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Seriously, we never had a sea state/low level wind consideration in the early 80s in the Shack. I seem to think it was one of those creeping rules that was sensibly introduced on one sqn or wg then crept to another before being adopted by first one group, then another, until 1, 11 and 18 all played the same game. For Nimrods I don't think ditching weather was ever a consideration, certainly in the 70s.
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Did the restriction come in after the SAR winch man lost his life due to the mishap with the survivor and his parachute?
I remember that whenever strong winds were forecast in the UK during met brief for Sentry training sorties, our FA used to ask for the actual surface winds in the fighter play areas so that we had advance warning of any possible cancellations. Winds out of limits resulted in a few phone calls before take-off to ensure that the WC training was forthcoming and we didn't waste lots of expensive fuel waiting for non-existent aircraft.
I remember that whenever strong winds were forecast in the UK during met brief for Sentry training sorties, our FA used to ask for the actual surface winds in the fighter play areas so that we had advance warning of any possible cancellations. Winds out of limits resulted in a few phone calls before take-off to ensure that the WC training was forthcoming and we didn't waste lots of expensive fuel waiting for non-existent aircraft.
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Of course there was a sea state, low level wind limit, and other common sense "rules" which the Auth/Leader would apply to all TRAINING sorties. What we accepted in war was different.
To say otherwise is very disingenuous.
To say otherwise is very disingenuous.
Newt, I'm pretty sure the rule was in when you were still in - since we overlapped. I had the impression it had been introduced, or maybe formalised into the rules, after a Jaguar ejection when the pilot had been killed hitting the ground in strong winds - in which case it was sometime after 1979.
I was the 'duty erk' that night in the Cage at HQRAFG when the 'black phone' in the corner rang for the first time in two years. The Duty Ops Officer from Bruggen in a slightly agitated voice said the Op O....m was in force. Never seen so many senior officers rush in to work that late at night. Good to watch from the bottom as CinC RAFG spoke to 4* in the UK about who was going to tell the Germans.
Interesting that the report states that OLDHAM alert was 'the standard signal for initial report of an accident to a nuclear weapon'.
Standard? Did it happen often then.....
Standard? Did it happen often then.....
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EJECTION WIND LIMITS
Didn't these come in after 29 Sqn lost an F4 in early 1986 up in the Pennines. The nav was very seriously injured landing on some rocky ground doing a Michael Schumacher in the snow. Only the extreme cold and his helmet saved him.
MB
MB
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Standard? Did it happen often then.....
MoD catalogues its nuclear blunders | Environment | The Guardian
My recollection from the late 70s was, following a fast jet ejection into a very stormy North Sea, the helicopter winchman died attempting the rescue. The F4 at that time had a 35 kt crosswind limit. Someone (can't remember who) was tasked with finding out what limits, if any, other air forces who flew over the North Sea in winter applied. The answer was around 35kts. This coincided with the crosswind limit and so, as I recall, this was adopted by 11 Gp as a reasonable working limit. Incidentally, the limit for wearing immersion suits was 10C. Having since done quite a bit of scuba diving and spent some time in the sea at 10C or so, that limit is mighty low. I believe the RN used 15C and that seems to me to be much more sensible.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Both crew were VSI and I believe one took Holy Orders. No, the problem was not surface wind but low level ejection at high speed. I believe the glissaded down a valley edge, the snow and helmet as you say did the rest.