Red Arrows makeover for 2014.
Red On, Green On
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 6,490
Likes: 2
From: Between the woods and the water
The last Royal Yacht Brittania, in theory it had a war role in reality it was never deployed to The Falklands or even for used in disaster relief.
Add to that HMY Britannia was not very large, and not a great sea-keeper, so it made far more sense to take up more recent vessels from the trade.
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,535
Likes: 13
From: UK
Reds used to be sidewinder capable. Don't know if they still are.
Some of the team aircraft are technically sidewinder capable although with the cockpit mods for the display role it would not just be a case of bolting the rockets on.
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 314
Likes: 0
From: London
Last time I asked about the Sidewinder role, it had drifted into obscurity along with the MFF concept. Presumably the aircraft are still capable of carrying Sidewinders but it's clearly a long-gone idea. Not much point augmenting Typhoons with Hawks. These days, if the UK got into a struggle that was so desperate as to need MFF resurrecting, we might as well wave a white flag and forget about it.
As for the Blue Angels, I can verify that their airframes are usually the oldest or the most-used in the fleet. The twin-seater I bumbled around in a couple of times was an old wreck, disguised by highly polished paintwork!
Nobody is going to touch the Red Arrows - it's too much of a political headache that nobody wants to handle. No MP wants to be billed as the person who killed-off the Red Arrows. The Hawks will soon be at the end of their fatigue lives and it seems more likely that they will simply be retired when they have to be, and that the RAFAT will disband as a direct result. It's the easy option that avoids any ugly murder scenes.
Whether any team re-appears to replace them is open to question. If industry money was put into the idea then maybe it could happen, but it would require a batch of very old Hawks to be refurbished and maintained at great cost. It seems unlikely that even industry could support such a venture. Of course the RAF has some shiny new Hawks now, but there are very few of them (too few in fact) and there's no way that resources could be diverted to display flying.
Sadly, one has to conclude that the heady days of nine-ship formation flying isn't going to last forever.
As for the Blue Angels, I can verify that their airframes are usually the oldest or the most-used in the fleet. The twin-seater I bumbled around in a couple of times was an old wreck, disguised by highly polished paintwork!
Nobody is going to touch the Red Arrows - it's too much of a political headache that nobody wants to handle. No MP wants to be billed as the person who killed-off the Red Arrows. The Hawks will soon be at the end of their fatigue lives and it seems more likely that they will simply be retired when they have to be, and that the RAFAT will disband as a direct result. It's the easy option that avoids any ugly murder scenes.
Whether any team re-appears to replace them is open to question. If industry money was put into the idea then maybe it could happen, but it would require a batch of very old Hawks to be refurbished and maintained at great cost. It seems unlikely that even industry could support such a venture. Of course the RAF has some shiny new Hawks now, but there are very few of them (too few in fact) and there's no way that resources could be diverted to display flying.
Sadly, one has to conclude that the heady days of nine-ship formation flying isn't going to last forever.
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 46
Likes: 0
From: Earth
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,026
Likes: 0
From: Hove
Don't like it at all.
Perhaps I'm looking at it in the wrong way but to me it looks like four aircraft going their own different ways, even if it's a formation split.
Given the events over the last few months maybe a team aspect would have been better?
Perhaps I'm looking at it in the wrong way but to me it looks like four aircraft going their own different ways, even if it's a formation split.
Given the events over the last few months maybe a team aspect would have been better?
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 6,328
Likes: 2
From: France
Not another design competition for Blue Peter watchers is it!...............Ill get my coat
Last edited by Wander00; 18th February 2014 at 14:08. Reason: Bad proofreadin, and trying to watch ski half pipe at the same time!
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 641
Likes: 0
From: North Yorkshire
I really like it. It gives the right message for their 50th anniversary, dynamic, patriotic, colourful and recognizing their own distinguished history. I especially like the way they have worked in the Gnats and Hawks. Despite Spurtle's churlish comment, a lot of thought went into it.
Well done the Reds and good luck for the coming display season.
Well done the Reds and good luck for the coming display season.
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 866
Likes: 0
From: Somewhere
Red Arrows Fly the Flag with New Tailfin for 50th Display Season
It seems to be popular with most people outside of here so a winner as far as RAFAT is concerned.
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,142
Likes: 58
From: Temporarily missing from the Joe Louis Arena
Looks fine. What happens if Scotland vote YES though?
This said though, many English sports teams incorporate blue in their team strips for some reason....
Gentleman Aviator
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,722
Likes: 91
From: Teetering Towers - somewhere in the Shires
Looks fine. What happens if Scotland vote YES though?
... if necessary! Hawaii (née Sandwich Islands) seem to be happy with their present flag.
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 160
Likes: 0
From: uk
RY Britannia
Thread drift (sorry)
January '86 Britannia lifted 450 out of Aden along with an RFA.
Ground forces were also deployed, having left Lyn. in a hurry they were sorting out their kit on Bravo disp. at AKR when they realised one of there landrovers was krank, cue visit to mt to requisition a replacement, luckily not on my inventory for AFAIK its still out there.
PM
January '86 Britannia lifted 450 out of Aden along with an RFA.
Ground forces were also deployed, having left Lyn. in a hurry they were sorting out their kit on Bravo disp. at AKR when they realised one of there landrovers was krank, cue visit to mt to requisition a replacement, luckily not on my inventory for AFAIK its still out there.
PM
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 528
Likes: 0
From: Far North of Watford
MPN11
I'm sure that the team members who are brave enough to view this thread will be delighted to know the level of support they are getting from their former comrades. If you can't say anything constructive, why do you feel it necessary to post at all?
I'm sure that the team members who are brave enough to view this thread will be delighted to know the level of support they are getting from their former comrades. If you can't say anything constructive, why do you feel it necessary to post at all?
Joined: Mar 2010
Aviation Qualifications: ATCO
Posts: 8,023
Likes: 314
From: Often in Jersey, but mainly in the past.
Originally Posted by Genstabler
I'm sure that the team members who are brave enough to view this thread will be delighted to know the level of support they are getting from their former comrades. If you can't say anything constructive, why do you feel it necessary to post at all?
In future I will pass my posts to you in draft for your clearance. Will that be OK?
Would you care to comment on the others who have also expressed disapproval?
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 573
Likes: 0
From: England
So, a question to the cyber-brave Chairborne Warriors who don't like the design and choose to slag it off on here.
What would you have designed, and what would have made your design better than that chosen? In your own time.
(Or to put it another way - put your money where your virtual mouth is!)
What would you have designed, and what would have made your design better than that chosen? In your own time.
(Or to put it another way - put your money where your virtual mouth is!)