Grobs
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slingsby_T67_Firefly
The USAF bought 113 of them - Slingsby must have done something right!
The USAF bought 113 of them - Slingsby must have done something right!
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Then scrapped them lock, stock and spares, see previous post.
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Epsilon minus
An interesting post with little basis in fact, the only major problem with the Tutor is the propellor and that is being addressed.
There are no major structural issues with the aircraft, some time back there was a gear collapse but this was due to loads beyond the certification requirements.
I am guessing that you might have seen a report from an MoD agency that is critical of the manufacturing quality control, Unfortunatly this report failed to understand the use of thickened resin and assumed that this was a defect in manufacture.
I would be quite happy to operate the Grob Tutor to the limits of the flight manual provided it was fitted with the MT propellor.
There are no major structural issues with the aircraft, some time back there was a gear collapse but this was due to loads beyond the certification requirements.
I am guessing that you might have seen a report from an MoD agency that is critical of the manufacturing quality control, Unfortunatly this report failed to understand the use of thickened resin and assumed that this was a defect in manufacture.
I would be quite happy to operate the Grob Tutor to the limits of the flight manual provided it was fitted with the MT propellor.
Last edited by A and C; 26th Jul 2013 at 11:52.
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Reliability
Since the Grob is the sole provider of EFT for all 3 services the airworthiness and operational reliability must be beyond doubt.
The BBC, the Times and the Daily Mail have all carried lengthy reports regarding the grounding of the entire fleet. In one report a defence official describes the operational reliability of the aeroplane as "a fiasco".
There are 40 AAIB incident reports on this type.
The press also express concern that there is a backlog of over six months of student pilots waiting for training and this is now concerning politicians and rightly so.
This Indian Air Force experienced reliability problems with the HPT-32 and now this aeroplane has been replaced by the Pilatus PC 7 MkII.
No doubt the highly skilled staff of the MOD procurement office will have anticipated just this sort of "road block" in the training requirement and have carefully worded clauses into the agreements with service providers to get out of this mess quickly. Now is the time to evoke them (doubt they exist
) I would say.
The BBC, the Times and the Daily Mail have all carried lengthy reports regarding the grounding of the entire fleet. In one report a defence official describes the operational reliability of the aeroplane as "a fiasco".
There are 40 AAIB incident reports on this type.
The press also express concern that there is a backlog of over six months of student pilots waiting for training and this is now concerning politicians and rightly so.
This Indian Air Force experienced reliability problems with the HPT-32 and now this aeroplane has been replaced by the Pilatus PC 7 MkII.
No doubt the highly skilled staff of the MOD procurement office will have anticipated just this sort of "road block" in the training requirement and have carefully worded clauses into the agreements with service providers to get out of this mess quickly. Now is the time to evoke them (doubt they exist
) I would say.
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Epsilon Minus
The first thing to say is of the 40 AAIB reports what number are directly attributable to aircraft reliability issues ?
As for quoting the press on technical matters surely you are on shakey ground, after all just take a look at piece about the Tornado & Glider airprox a masterpiece of accurate reporting if ever a saw one !
The major problem with the Grob fleet has been the reluctance to grasp the nettle on the propeller issue, this has now been done so as soon as all new propellers can be manufactured and fitted I see the type returning to service with the types major issue resolved.
As for quoting the press on technical matters surely you are on shakey ground, after all just take a look at piece about the Tornado & Glider airprox a masterpiece of accurate reporting if ever a saw one !
The major problem with the Grob fleet has been the reluctance to grasp the nettle on the propeller issue, this has now been done so as soon as all new propellers can be manufactured and fitted I see the type returning to service with the types major issue resolved.
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Grobs
A and C
If I were writing a certification requirement for an aircraft the ability of the undercarriage assembly to withstand the maximum amount of braking a pilot can apply would definitely be on my list.
If I were writing a certification requirement for an aircraft the ability of the undercarriage assembly to withstand the maximum amount of braking a pilot can apply would definitely be on my list.
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ASRAAM
You make a very good point and I agree with you.
I expect that the rules were written in days when the whole braking system was not capable of so much retardation, the Grob has quite big brakes, modern tyres and was braking on a high friction surface, all these factors stacking up to make the certification requirements obsolete.
I suspect that with older types put in the same position the aircraft would have simply collided with the aircraft ahead as the ineffective braking system failed to retard the aircraft quickly enough.
I expect that the rules were written in days when the whole braking system was not capable of so much retardation, the Grob has quite big brakes, modern tyres and was braking on a high friction surface, all these factors stacking up to make the certification requirements obsolete.
I suspect that with older types put in the same position the aircraft would have simply collided with the aircraft ahead as the ineffective braking system failed to retard the aircraft quickly enough.
