F-35 Probe and Drogue
Join Date: Apr 2005
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A prod's a prod ----.
That's no excuse for aiming low at the start of the night though....
F-35 Probe and Drogue
Since when should my experience ever stand in the way of banter?! However, I would expect better from a TP.
The answer, by the way, is no. My old aircraft would have fallen out of the sky if I'd tried to fly slow enough to tank off a Herc.
BV
The answer, by the way, is no. My old aircraft would have fallen out of the sky if I'd tried to fly slow enough to tank off a Herc.
BV
As far as I was concerned any prod that resulted in contact, a green light and fuel flowing was a good one.
I've seen a lot worse - believe me!
I've seen a lot worse - believe me!
Last edited by Tankertrashnav; 29th Jan 2013 at 14:21.
My old aircraft would have fallen out of the sky if I'd tried to fly slow enough to tank off a Herc.
Anyway, I have passed your comments on to the pilot in question and he will no doubt get back to you for advice soon.
Last edited by LateArmLive; 29th Jan 2013 at 15:25.
Join Date: Mar 2008
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There is no doubt that the pilot attempting to trial F35 AAR was either badly taught or not taught at all. I would recon he is a TP or Harrier pilot or both! I have tanked in both the Phantom and Tornado against the C130 on both the centre and wing hoses. Like all AAR, if you use the correct technique you will not go wrong. Both ac could AAR up to full with both weapons and tanks fitted.
Apart from chasing the basket the pilot is consistantly sitting too low. You have to accept that it is possible to miss, particularly if the basket is affected by the approaching receiver. Fly up and down the line of the hose. Chasing the basket WILL eventually reult in a spokes. Some of the worst AAR has been when there have been beers on prods.
When the F3 needed a KC135 BDA clearance for Bosnia, Boscombe Down insisted on doing it despite not having any AAR current TPs. 3 Probe Tips later and a lot of egg on face they gave the clearance with a whole page of warnings of how dangerous and difficult it was. God bless TPs.
Apart from chasing the basket the pilot is consistantly sitting too low. You have to accept that it is possible to miss, particularly if the basket is affected by the approaching receiver. Fly up and down the line of the hose. Chasing the basket WILL eventually reult in a spokes. Some of the worst AAR has been when there have been beers on prods.
When the F3 needed a KC135 BDA clearance for Bosnia, Boscombe Down insisted on doing it despite not having any AAR current TPs. 3 Probe Tips later and a lot of egg on face they gave the clearance with a whole page of warnings of how dangerous and difficult it was. God bless TPs.
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I am pretty sure that I was taught once - but suspect it was 'badly'.
How about my own technique. Move into a waiting position no more than three foot from the basket and offset the probe from the centre to account for bow wave. In this case aiming for the 2 o'clock position just inside the rim. Look up at the drogue unit and fly towards it at a smart marching pace.
Lunging at short range - caused by basket gazing - always seemed to produce the most intense sinusoids, but my real pet peeve was mainly junior guys who wouldn't wait in a position so the tanker driver could see them - and when cleared astern went far too far back...some 50 feet aft of the hose.
'How's that going to work in IMC?' I would ask. (Concentrates the mind when all you can see of Mr Vickers finest is the wing tip.)
I think the chap in the video does OK, but he does start from too far back and is clearly stretching the hose in a low position.
Oh, and yes I do know the driver and yes I have tanked off the C-130. Canadian nice with good pods and hoses, Spanish dreadful with an unlit drogue at night.
How about my own technique. Move into a waiting position no more than three foot from the basket and offset the probe from the centre to account for bow wave. In this case aiming for the 2 o'clock position just inside the rim. Look up at the drogue unit and fly towards it at a smart marching pace.
Lunging at short range - caused by basket gazing - always seemed to produce the most intense sinusoids, but my real pet peeve was mainly junior guys who wouldn't wait in a position so the tanker driver could see them - and when cleared astern went far too far back...some 50 feet aft of the hose.
'How's that going to work in IMC?' I would ask. (Concentrates the mind when all you can see of Mr Vickers finest is the wing tip.)
I think the chap in the video does OK, but he does start from too far back and is clearly stretching the hose in a low position.
Oh, and yes I do know the driver and yes I have tanked off the C-130. Canadian nice with good pods and hoses, Spanish dreadful with an unlit drogue at night.
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The other thing I forget to mention was SPILS In or OUT for C130 AAR? You will recall it was SPILS OUT for the Herc. This was because a TP tried to act like a JP (his words not mine) and nearly lost control. He deliberatly got high and induced yaw which caused the SPILS to trip, this frightened him.
As far as I know most of us tanked with SPILS In without any problem. My concern was if the SPILS were OUT and you backed out at Max Weight you could then get high AoAs very quickly. Once again, God bless TPs.
As far as I know most of us tanked with SPILS In without any problem. My concern was if the SPILS were OUT and you backed out at Max Weight you could then get high AoAs very quickly. Once again, God bless TPs.
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As an ex AARI and a TP I have to say I recon he was a TP who had never done it before. This had been the case with the Nimrod which, until Corporate had been judged by previous Boscombe TPs as impossible to prod. It was, actually, one of the most benign prodders I ever experienced. If you really want difficult try an AEW Nimrod against a Vulcan!
