Did any RAF or RN aircrew on exchange with USAF, USN fly over Vietnam?
In his book, ACM Sir Peter, went for a visit to 'Nam when he was in FEAF (in 69/70?) Going in country, he flew in a Huey gunship as he described the crew chief gunners behaving as 'Chicago gangsters hanging on a trapeze wire' when going on range. He also described the frustration of the USAF crews whose hands were tied as all targeting was decided and done from Hawaii and D.C. He said that the winning hearts and minds program in Vietnam worked out fine for a while until the the troops left the villagers and the VC moved in to kill the village elders and then all the good work done earlier went to pot unlike our guys in Malaya.
Looking halfway down this page
Rumour Control
reference to exchange pilot to a unit based at Ellington field who flew the F-4 who did not get left out of the deployment?
Looking halfway down this page
Rumour Control
reference to exchange pilot to a unit based at Ellington field who flew the F-4 who did not get left out of the deployment?
I had a friend who was Irish....who flew in the same Battalion....which branch of the Irish I do not recall. My unit supported the Australians down at Nui Dat, and I am aware of Australians being other places as well including the 135th ENU's which was a joint Australian Navy and US Army Assault Helicopter unit flying Huey's.
I have never heard of any British Soldier or Airman being assigned to, attached, to, visiting any combat unit I am aware of.....which does not mean there weren't any....but in all the time that has lapsed....it would seem most likely it would have become known.
I have no doubt there may have been some SAS folks amongst the SpecOps guys but nothing has cropped up in any of the books written about those years by some of the participants that I am aware of.
The Aussies were great to work with.....entirely too organized compared to the American Army when it came ot using Chinooks. Superb Soldiers in my view!
I have never heard of any British Soldier or Airman being assigned to, attached, to, visiting any combat unit I am aware of.....which does not mean there weren't any....but in all the time that has lapsed....it would seem most likely it would have become known.
I have no doubt there may have been some SAS folks amongst the SpecOps guys but nothing has cropped up in any of the books written about those years by some of the participants that I am aware of.
The Aussies were great to work with.....entirely too organized compared to the American Army when it came ot using Chinooks. Superb Soldiers in my view!
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the army were there
operating out of Laos during the time that the great John Cross was the DA. Great book of his 'first in, last out', please read.
CIA, Air America, its not all fiction. Theres a retired RCT Lt. Col who can tell you a thing or 2 and I wish he would write it all down because hes one of the few left that knows, well some of it.
I have sometimes tried to work out if he posts on here and the earlier post of a Saigon landing in '70 intrigued me, but I dont think so. If he does post on here maybe we can eek it out of him, because Im not going to betray his confidence, again.
// T
CIA, Air America, its not all fiction. Theres a retired RCT Lt. Col who can tell you a thing or 2 and I wish he would write it all down because hes one of the few left that knows, well some of it.
I have sometimes tried to work out if he posts on here and the earlier post of a Saigon landing in '70 intrigued me, but I dont think so. If he does post on here maybe we can eek it out of him, because Im not going to betray his confidence, again.
// T
Mildly OT
Just in case anyone's questioning their grey cells, Bryan Brown was in the film, but not at the top of the bill. I'd guess that as he's almost certainly the most famous cast member for most British & American viewers of The Odd Angry Shot, this is why he's often assumed to be the star. Kennedy's reputation in Australia is totally lost on any Briton who's not googled him after watching the film.
Just in case anyone's questioning their grey cells, Bryan Brown was in the film, but not at the top of the bill. I'd guess that as he's almost certainly the most famous cast member for most British & American viewers of The Odd Angry Shot, this is why he's often assumed to be the star. Kennedy's reputation in Australia is totally lost on any Briton who's not googled him after watching the film.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Archimedes, spot on Bryan Brown is the actor I always think of in the film. Of Grahame Kennedy I have no recollection at all.
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For those non Ozmates not familiar with Graham Kennedy, perhaps someone could find the (IMT?) clip of Rover the Labrador peeing on camera - the longest canine urination on camera ever recorded. Very, very funny, if not (according to Wikipedia) quite as unscripted as it seemed at the time.
(According to Wikipedia, they gave Rover much, much water to drink before he came on camera.) There's another, (also a set up, where they overfed the dog before the show), where Rover wouldn't eat the sponsor's pet food on camera - so Kennedy (or so it seemed) ate the dog food straight from the can.
Kennedy's role in 'The Odd Angry Shot' was out of character - a serious role, which, as far as I know, was a first for Kennedy, and to many pundits' surprise, which he actually handled quite well. The movie wasn't half bad, but I agree with earlier comments that it wasn't indicative of the SAS mode of operation in Vietnam.
Re the thread title asking if any Brits served in SVN, I could be wrong, (I'm finding that memories tend to be unreliable after so many years have passed), but I thought it was pretty much a given that a small number of Brits transferred to the Australian Army (with more of less 'semi-official' approval/sanction from the Brit end) , in particular, the SAS, to allow them to serve in SVN. As I said, I could be wrong.
(According to Wikipedia, they gave Rover much, much water to drink before he came on camera.) There's another, (also a set up, where they overfed the dog before the show), where Rover wouldn't eat the sponsor's pet food on camera - so Kennedy (or so it seemed) ate the dog food straight from the can.
Kennedy's role in 'The Odd Angry Shot' was out of character - a serious role, which, as far as I know, was a first for Kennedy, and to many pundits' surprise, which he actually handled quite well. The movie wasn't half bad, but I agree with earlier comments that it wasn't indicative of the SAS mode of operation in Vietnam.
Re the thread title asking if any Brits served in SVN, I could be wrong, (I'm finding that memories tend to be unreliable after so many years have passed), but I thought it was pretty much a given that a small number of Brits transferred to the Australian Army (with more of less 'semi-official' approval/sanction from the Brit end) , in particular, the SAS, to allow them to serve in SVN. As I said, I could be wrong.
205 Sqn Shackletons had at least a couple of visits to Vietnam in 70/71. One after an engine failure off the coast whilst in transit between HK and Changi and diversion to Phan Rang, where the crew were 'looked after' by 2 Sqn RAAF then flying Canberrras, and did a number of 'interesting' things whilst waiting for a new engine. Another went into Saigon - Tan Son Nhut - for much the same problem IIRC - but the crew were strictly monitored. However, we didn't 'serve' there.
Last edited by Shackman; 1st Oct 2012 at 09:40.
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In the late sixties, as the Brits began to withdraw everything that was East of Suez to West of Suez (and therefore, quite a few people saw the [what was] very good life they’d enjoyed for a very long time coming to an end), bar talk at Tengah had it that ‘someone’ was looking for experienced fast jet drivers to fly high performance, delta winged aircraft in Asia for 5,000 USD a month.
Last edited by And Then; 1st Oct 2012 at 11:50.
Hmm ' Candy Machine' F-102 deployments from Clark? 
So we're talking about 6-7 years of becoming a US citizen to be cleared and vetted to be done in 6-7 weeks followed by conversion course of 6-7 months?
Sweet
So we're talking about 6-7 years of becoming a US citizen to be cleared and vetted to be done in 6-7 weeks followed by conversion course of 6-7 months?
Sweet
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Odd Angry Shot.. great film. But I also thought The Wild Geese was a great film.. until I watched it again the other day. 
The RAF Regt had a Flt Lt who served in Vietnam with the Aussies - he was stn Rock at Waddo in the 90s (I think) and published an autobiography at about the same time. As Senior Ground Defence Staff Officer, HQ Far East Air Force, Air Vice Marshal D A Pocock RAF Regt (deceased) also worked with the USAF to improve its ground defence 'proposition' (it has finally happened, I have forgotten the equivalent military word) out there.
The RAF Regt had a Flt Lt who served in Vietnam with the Aussies - he was stn Rock at Waddo in the 90s (I think) and published an autobiography at about the same time. As Senior Ground Defence Staff Officer, HQ Far East Air Force, Air Vice Marshal D A Pocock RAF Regt (deceased) also worked with the USAF to improve its ground defence 'proposition' (it has finally happened, I have forgotten the equivalent military word) out there.
On two separate occasions during 69 and 70 a Shackleton from 205 Sqn Changi diverted into Vietnam with engine trouble. One was fixed after an overnight stay, but I think the other remained for an engine change (prob 2-4 days). Both aircraft were returning from Hong Kong. Same captain (Howard?)
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A Few Photographs From S/E Asia
I do hope this works. Some of my fathers photographs from 1967. My apologies for the poor quality. The images were taken from an 8mm film.
Last edited by hval; 2nd Oct 2012 at 20:59.
I watched "The Odd Angry Shot" the other day, based on the recommendations here. An interesting film, but as others have pointed out, nothing like SAS operations in South Vietnam.
I can also recommend "Sleeping With Your Ears Open". Based on the descriptions of patrols in the book, a realistic SAS film would be rather boring and devoid of dialog - at least in the jungle. Back at base might be a different matter.
Several days of patrolling completely silently with using only hand signals and little or no contact with the VC or NVA, other than observation, makes for great reading but a poor film.
I can also recommend "Sleeping With Your Ears Open". Based on the descriptions of patrols in the book, a realistic SAS film would be rather boring and devoid of dialog - at least in the jungle. Back at base might be a different matter.
Several days of patrolling completely silently with using only hand signals and little or no contact with the VC or NVA, other than observation, makes for great reading but a poor film.
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India Four Two
I reckon a film of the antics on "The Hill" would make interesting viewing !
The SAS got into enough fights that a shortish film could be made,
a few fights, a few hot extractions (including the loss of the soldier)
plus the usual leave periods to pad it put !!!
Must read the Sleeping With Your Ears Open and Behind Enemy Lines.
.
I reckon a film of the antics on "The Hill" would make interesting viewing !
The SAS got into enough fights that a shortish film could be made,
a few fights, a few hot extractions (including the loss of the soldier)
plus the usual leave periods to pad it put !!!
Must read the Sleeping With Your Ears Open and Behind Enemy Lines.
.
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Vietnam
Did many flights through Saigon with 52 SQN during 1969 and 1970 on the way to HongKong. In 1971 did a tour around the US bases in a Mk 2 Andover with the VIP Flt out of Changi. Then in the 90's did a couple of trips to Hanoi from HongKong for the UNHCR negotiators. Finally, staged through the old Tan San Nhut field in the late 90's--- it was unchanged since the 70's. Good memories!
I flew in a USAF TFW over 1969-70 in SVN, but that was before I joined the RAF, so I don't qualify for the thread title.
But I did a weekend visit in 1970 down to stay with FACs in Ca Mao, in the southern delta (then IV Corps in SVN). While I was having a beer with the FACs, this Brit came over for a beer (or two). He had been ex-Brit Army, or perhaps RM, and was serving in a mercenary role leading out small long-range patrols on search and destroy. Perhaps I should say he wasn't "leading" - he would bring up the tail as he didn't want to be shot in the back.
He had previously served in this role in Africa, Congo I think. He had several chain type scars across his face, so had been in the wars. We drank for the afternoon, then we piled into his jeep and went off-base to a civvie-type house. This was the local Ca Mau CIA chief's house. We had a very pleasant BBQ, sitting around a large table with all the CIA chaps - and their wives!! And me, still in my sweaty flying suit. Eventually my new-found Brit mate and I stumbled off and back to base in his jeep. Ahhhh, happy days.
But I did a weekend visit in 1970 down to stay with FACs in Ca Mao, in the southern delta (then IV Corps in SVN). While I was having a beer with the FACs, this Brit came over for a beer (or two). He had been ex-Brit Army, or perhaps RM, and was serving in a mercenary role leading out small long-range patrols on search and destroy. Perhaps I should say he wasn't "leading" - he would bring up the tail as he didn't want to be shot in the back.
He had previously served in this role in Africa, Congo I think. He had several chain type scars across his face, so had been in the wars. We drank for the afternoon, then we piled into his jeep and went off-base to a civvie-type house. This was the local Ca Mau CIA chief's house. We had a very pleasant BBQ, sitting around a large table with all the CIA chaps - and their wives!! And me, still in my sweaty flying suit. Eventually my new-found Brit mate and I stumbled off and back to base in his jeep. Ahhhh, happy days.
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Yes. On 52 Sqn we used Saigon to refuel when returning to Seletar/Changi from Hong Kong and some crews stopped the night. It was uncomfortable there, knowing the VC probably had tunnels under where you were standing. Also I flew past Saigon during a 'busy' period (A quiet period was just manic) on the way to Phnom Pehn. Crew listened in to the tower controller. One thud was baulked on approach, requested a quickie radar and was told to eject!
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The RAF Regt chap was called Guy Bransby and his book is called her Majesty's Vietnam Soldier. He is quite a character and a proper gentleman. Also served in the Falklands and has written about that too. He also liberated a nice little statue from the Governor's residence which I remember being in the Mess at Catterick.