RAF Observers

[Q-RTF-X]

Could anybody please help clarify what the role of an Observer was with the RAF during WW2 ? I get the impression it was a combination of Navigator plus other functions, dependant on aircraft type. It’s something that has been puzzling me for quite some time. Any info greatly appreciated with thanks in advance.

[iRaven]

Try the following book:

Observers and Navigators and Other Non-Pilot Aircrew in the RFC, RNAS and RAF
by Wing Commander C. G. Jefford


Part I traces the rise of the first generation of non-pilot aircrew, the observers, aerial gunners/gunlayers and kite balloon observers who flew with the RFC, RNAS and latterly the RAF between 1914 and 1919.

Part II examines the way in which the peacetime RAF rapidly dispensed with its observer officers and spent the next fifteen years attempting to make do by misemploying airmen as air gunners on a part-time basis. This inadequate practice is contrasted with the very positive attitude towards non-pilots that prevailed within the Royal Navy. The story continues with the reinstatement of observers in 1934, albeit still as part-time corporals until 1939. Wartime experience soon revealed that the omnipotence of pilots was a myth and by the summer of 1940 all observers and gunners were at least sergeants and increasing numbers were being commissioned. Part II goes on to examine the proliferation of non-pilot aircrew categories until 1942 when the system was substantially reorganised, the observer being supplanted by the air bomber and a variety of specialised types of navigator. This section ends with a summary of wartime training.

Part III covers the rest of the century, including the last two years of WW II and the ill-conceived '1946 Aircrew Scheme'. Following the latter's demise in 1950, the RAF adopted an all-officer policy for its pilots and navigators, the fact that they were to have equal career prospects having been announced as early as 1948. Part III examines the way in which this policy of equality has actually been applied while continuing to trace the rises and falls in the fortunes of all non-pilot categories to date.

What emerges, along with a much clearer impression of the crucial importance of non-pilots to the RAF, is a discriminatory attitude towards them. The author demonstrates that this attitude had its roots in the RFC where it became so institutionalised that its effects are still detectable today.

[Wensleydale]

Initially, the observer was just that - a lookout who was later armed. The pilot was responsible for all aspects of flight including navigation. As aircraft became more complex, the air gunner was added to the crew with the observer assisting the pilot with his navigation (pointing out landmatks etc).

This situation carried on into WW2 with aircraft such as the Hampden carrying an observer and two gunners, one of whom manned the radio. Once again, the pilot was responsible for the safe navigation of the aircraft. The observer also acted as the bomb aimer. Sometimes, a second pilot (usually a new pilot) acted as the observer to gain experience. There are many stories of the pilot being wounded and the observer pilot taking control.

However, with the advent of night bombing, a dedicated crew member was required to plot the aircraft position and later to use the new electronic navigation aids. Given his own plotting table in the heavies, the navigator (as he was now called) was required to move into the nose to act as bomb aimer over the target. This was not practical, so on raids such as Augsburg, Nettleton carried an extra navigator for this role. This crew member eventually became the Bomb Aimer and replaced the nose gunner.

'Twas a little more complicated than this, but time and space limit the answer.

[Whopity]

Then of course there were the Radar Observers (RO) who flew in the Meteors and Javelins.

[Rossian]

...the last one I remember meeting was the boss of 204 Sqn at Ballykelly on 1967/68? - O.G. Williams. A nice, if slightly old fashioned, chap. So I have no doubt there were others still floating about at that time.

The Ancient Mariner

[Melchett01]

Google is your friend as they say, but only if you put the right question in! The attached link might be of interest which is from the RAFCommands.com site and is a thread covering the differences between the old Air Observer and Air Navigation schools whilst they were running concurrently in the early 1940s.

Difference between Air Observer School and Air Naviation School?

[Tankertrashnav]

the last one I remember meeting was the boss of 204 Sqn at Ballykelly on 1967/68? - O.G. Williams. A nice, if slightly old fashioned, chap. So I have no doubt there were others still floating about at that time.

A little later there was a senior officer at one of the nav schools who still wore the Observer brevet (quite unofficially I am sure). It may be recalled that the 'O' brevet was often referred to "the flying a---hole" and it was generally agreed that the description was very appropriate in his case.

The navy of course has to be different - their navs are still called observers, I believe. Also in the navy a pilot is someone who tries to prevent the captain steering his ship onto the rocks - with varying degrees of success

[airborne_artist]

The navy of course has to be different - their navs are still called observers, I believe.

Fondly called lookers, because apart from that they don't do much

[Whopity]

A little later there was a senior officer at one of the nav schools who still wore the Observer brevet

Group Captain Harry King, RAF Gaydon 1966-69, a lawyer who wrote the MAFL

[Union Jack]

The navy of course has to be different - their navs are still called observers, I believe. - TTN

Fondly called lookers, because apart from that they don't do much. - AA

..... whilst better still, in ships of the Royal Navy, the navigator is fondly called .... "Pilot" and just look where that led!

Jack

[Ron Cake]

In the 1950's and 60's it was not unusual to see aircrew of more advanced years sporting the 'O' brevet. I assumed it was because they were proud of having qualified as an Observer and wanted nothing to do with any new fangled 'N' brevet.

I bet there are are some WSO's who have declined the new badge and continue to wear their 'N' and 'AE' brevets. Same thing, really.

Incidentally, Jeff Jeffords book, mentioned in the initial post reply, is a thoroughly researched and definitive work on the subject. An excellent read.

[Hipper]

Immediately post war my father flew in Lancasters and was described as 'Air Bomber/NAV II'. I presume therefore that there was a 'NAV I'. What did each do?

Later in the 1950s flying in the V-Bombers there was a Nav/Plotter and Nav/Radar.

[goudie]

When 617 Sqdn was reformed, with Vulcans, at RAF Scampton in '58 the CO was Wing Commander Bower. He wore an Observers brevet. One of the old school and an absolute gent.

[Prangster]

I've been observing the RAF for some time now and am becoming increasingly worried about its health. Were it on an intensive care unit obs would be carried out every 15 minutes. Just a thought

[Wensleydale]

'Air Bomber/NAV II'

This was his rank. In order to serarate the ground NCOs from the NCA of the time, a new rank structure was developed together with new rank badges and independent messes.

The rank had classes plus the aircrew position. (eg Pilot 1; Navigator II etc). Aircrew started as Aircrew Cadet then moved on to Aircrew 1/II (Corporal); Aircrew III (Sgt); Aircrew IV (FS) then Master Aircrew (WO). Only the latter remains in regular RAF - the others were abolished in 1949(?)

ps. If anyone has one of the old NCA rank badges (except Master) the Waddington Heritage centre could do with some examples! Please pm me.

[Tankertrashnav]

Wensleydale - In 30 years of dealing I had about two examples of these badges pass through my hands. Saw a full set at a collectors fair at least ten years back with an eye-watering three-figure price-tag. Good luck to the Waddington Heritage Centre!

Incidentally Whopity, the officer about whom I made some less than complimentary remarks was not the Gp Capt King you refer to - never ran across him. My man had better remain anonymous!

[Barksdale Boy]

My fellow nav (plotter) on my first Vulcan crew (101 Sqn, 68-70), who had won his DFC and Croix de Guerre avec Palme before I was born, wore an Observer's brevet on his mess kit. He was also a very " nice, if slightly old-fashioned" chap.

IIRC Gaydon's CO IN 1966, Group Captain King, retired from the service to be ordained as a priest in the Church of England.

[Q-RTF-X]

Lots of good stuff posted, thanks to all concerned I have a much better picture now and a much expanded view; for instance, I never knew there was any such animal as a Radar Observer. I remember in my time as "an 'orrible boy entrant" at St. Athan there was a Squadron Leader medical officer in sick quarters (a rather temperamental gentleman) who wore an observer’s brevet and, I also remember once when transiting Sharjah sighting a Trucial Oman Scouts officer sporting similar. I have a hazy recollection of seeing a couple of others, but the details evade me now. Fantastic response – PPRuNe showing a good face.

[reynoldsno1]

The Stn Cdr at Gatow in 1974 also sported an "O" - Jack Wilson ISTR, lovely guy.

[Barksdale Boy]

Sorry, guys - brain fade due to claret excess setting in. Group Captain Knight was the Gaydon stn cdr who later became ordained; King was his successor.