Iran Threatens to Close Strait of Hormuz
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Out of Trim
"The 8,000 ton destroyer will carry 48 Sea Vipers that can also be used to shoot down fighters as well as sea skimming missiles. It will also carry a Lynx helicopter capable of carrying Sea Skua anti-ship missiles and is capable of embarking 60 special forces troops.
60 troops in a lynx; I've got to see that happen...! "
I think you need to learn to read in English, perhaps?
"The 8,000 ton destroyer will carry 48 Sea Vipers that can also be used to shoot down fighters as well as sea skimming missiles. It will also carry a Lynx helicopter capable of carrying Sea Skua anti-ship missiles and is capable of embarking 60 special forces troops.
60 troops in a lynx; I've got to see that happen...! "
I think you need to learn to read in English, perhaps?
Given that an the assumption is everything will be focused on one area then how robust is the Suez canal to a couple of deliberate sinkings and the safety and security of pipelines taking oil away from the Gulf.
Funnily enough I see big Russki presence in Syria very soon and a big Chinese one in Iran..............ultimate stalemate for all concerned.
Funnily enough I see big Russki presence in Syria very soon and a big Chinese one in Iran..............ultimate stalemate for all concerned.
SASless, I'd take with a grain of salt the claims in the caption.
"The Iranian frigate IS Sahand (F 74) burns after being attacked by the Joseph Strauss and A-6s. Sahand was hit by three Harpoon missiles, Skipper rocket-propelled bombs, a Walleye l@ser-guided bomb, and several 1,000-pound bombs."
That said, air launched torpedoes would have made short work of that ship, since the old adage remains true:
" It is easier to sink a ship by letting water in through the bottom than trying to let all the air out through the top. "
"The Iranian frigate IS Sahand (F 74) burns after being attacked by the Joseph Strauss and A-6s. Sahand was hit by three Harpoon missiles, Skipper rocket-propelled bombs, a Walleye l@ser-guided bomb, and several 1,000-pound bombs."
That said, air launched torpedoes would have made short work of that ship, since the old adage remains true:
" It is easier to sink a ship by letting water in through the bottom than trying to let all the air out through the top. "
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I am curious as to what strategy might be under discussion between No. 10 and the White House (NATO aside) re: Iran and what thinking prevails as to who would lead any potential strikes (from the West) and which targets might be considered.
Experience-based speculation welcomed!
Experience-based speculation welcomed!
I am curious as to what strategy might be under discussion between No. 10 and the White House (NATO aside) re: Iran and what thinking prevails as to who would lead any potential strikes (from the West) and which targets might be considered.
Even though we might consider ourselves outside of the 'inner circle' of planners, our knowledgeable views and opinions on 'live' situations are of great value in building an intelligence picture. Why lay things out on a plate for them?
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Tourist
Post 150 - lost your sense of irony?
Or perhaps you're American or German, where this subtle aspect of English humour is not generally recognised
Mister B
Post 150 - lost your sense of irony?
Or perhaps you're American or German, where this subtle aspect of English humour is not generally recognised
Mister B
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Iran won't close the straights.
About 1/2 or so of their economy depends on their exported oil, which they would not be able to export and/or sell if they did this.
In addition, they export huge amounts of gasoline and diesel fuel, due to their lack of refineries. Their economy would also shut down due to the lack of these imported transportation fuels if they closed the straights.
cliff
HHN
About 1/2 or so of their economy depends on their exported oil, which they would not be able to export and/or sell if they did this.
In addition, they export huge amounts of gasoline and diesel fuel, due to their lack of refineries. Their economy would also shut down due to the lack of these imported transportation fuels if they closed the straights.
cliff
HHN
Interesting that China has stated that "a single countrys domestic law should not be the remit for deciding Who trades with Whom and imposition of sanctions in International trade".
I see China as continuing to import Iranian oil and any blockade which stops or attempts to stop this may get them involved in supporting their national interest.
Is China about to get a public military base in Iran ?
I see China as continuing to import Iranian oil and any blockade which stops or attempts to stop this may get them involved in supporting their national interest.
Is China about to get a public military base in Iran ?
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A very basic introduction to sub surface vehicle detection & PGW/ Strait of Hormuz.
The approaches to the Strait of Hormuz have reasonably homogenous temperature and salinity levels. This makes it easier to detect submarines in this area.
Are you aware that there is research on using the cavitation of a ships propeller/s as an active, non directional source?
Re:
Patrick Robinson:
Nuclear depth charges? The mind boggles.
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Go this thread is full of an even higher level of uninformed dross than normal for Pprune.
A Kilo is not big. It is really small, and ideal for the area in the right hands and serviceable.
The kill radius of a bucket of sunshine is absolutely tiny.
I suspect that is why they were withdrawn. They were simply not as effective as Active/passive ASW plus a torpedo.
I reckon you would need thousands if your approach to sweeping the Straits of Hormuz was to be successful using a random scatter technique.
Seriously guys, if you have no knowledge at all, why post as if you do?
A Kilo is not big. It is really small, and ideal for the area in the right hands and serviceable.
The kill radius of a bucket of sunshine is absolutely tiny.
I suspect that is why they were withdrawn. They were simply not as effective as Active/passive ASW plus a torpedo.
I reckon you would need thousands if your approach to sweeping the Straits of Hormuz was to be successful using a random scatter technique.
Seriously guys, if you have no knowledge at all, why post as if you do?
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Go this thread is full of an even higher level of uninformed dross than normal for Pprune.
A Kilo is not big. It is really small, and ideal for the area in the right hands and serviceable.
The kill radius of a bucket of sunshine is absolutely tiny.
I suspect that is why they were withdrawn. They were simply not as effective as Active/passive ASW plus a torpedo.
I reckon you would need thousands if your approach to sweeping the Straits of Hormuz was to be successful using a random scatter technique.
Seriously guys, if you have no knowledge at all, why post as if you do?
A Kilo is not big. It is really small, and ideal for the area in the right hands and serviceable.
The kill radius of a bucket of sunshine is absolutely tiny.
I suspect that is why they were withdrawn. They were simply not as effective as Active/passive ASW plus a torpedo.
I reckon you would need thousands if your approach to sweeping the Straits of Hormuz was to be successful using a random scatter technique.
Seriously guys, if you have no knowledge at all, why post as if you do?
Edit: quotes
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I go along with Tourist and I still maintain that this location is a dodgy area for the conventional type operations for submarines. How many US submarines have been involved in collisions in that eaxct area??
With the utmost of respect to most folks although my memory is quite hazy.. we are talking of depths that on average are no greater than about 40 metres (just over 130ft??) Again I am fairly sure that like any narrow shipping routes there are sea lanes going through the strait and because it is so narrow you will be steaming on one side through national waters belonging to Iran. I stand to be corrected on this but that is how it was. Ships bound in one direction are pasing very close to Iran plus thgere are LOTS of small islands which by definition are hunks of land rising out of the sea.
I am guessing (NEVER served on submarines) the boats owned by Iran are not maintained to the same standards of these in the west and they will not be best suited to dodging huge great tankers as these things take up a lot of,space and I would certainly not fancy passing underneath these vessels in a boat that might not be well maintained, or a crew that might be inexperienced. I would not want to do it on the best maintained vessels
I have NEVER advocated these Iranian boats would be used in a conventional Western manner, I have certainly NEVER suggested they would be capable of playing evasive games with the west, but they are capable of hiding in these coastal waters and possibly try to hit out at vessels that came within striking distance of Iran, OR.... they might be used to deploy those nasty mines...
I have tried my hardest to just suggest that it is NOT in the interest of Iran to blockade the Strait but I have also tried to answer a question that to me had nothing to do with this specific incident. Namely thermal layers and the evading of detection.
My experience is from way back in the early 1970's and I FULLY respect that times have changed and the age of sail has gone.
I would like to think that if Iranian ships or boats were to leave the sanctuary of coastal waters then sadly they would possibly become 'ground bait!'
If this is Tom Clancy or any other author then so be it but I am NOT saying ANYTHING will happen... I am NOT saying submarines from Iran WILL DEPLOY or WILL attack shipping. I am like most other folks just speculating (nothing better to do)
With the utmost of respect to most folks although my memory is quite hazy.. we are talking of depths that on average are no greater than about 40 metres (just over 130ft??) Again I am fairly sure that like any narrow shipping routes there are sea lanes going through the strait and because it is so narrow you will be steaming on one side through national waters belonging to Iran. I stand to be corrected on this but that is how it was. Ships bound in one direction are pasing very close to Iran plus thgere are LOTS of small islands which by definition are hunks of land rising out of the sea.
I am guessing (NEVER served on submarines) the boats owned by Iran are not maintained to the same standards of these in the west and they will not be best suited to dodging huge great tankers as these things take up a lot of,space and I would certainly not fancy passing underneath these vessels in a boat that might not be well maintained, or a crew that might be inexperienced. I would not want to do it on the best maintained vessels
I have NEVER advocated these Iranian boats would be used in a conventional Western manner, I have certainly NEVER suggested they would be capable of playing evasive games with the west, but they are capable of hiding in these coastal waters and possibly try to hit out at vessels that came within striking distance of Iran, OR.... they might be used to deploy those nasty mines...
I have tried my hardest to just suggest that it is NOT in the interest of Iran to blockade the Strait but I have also tried to answer a question that to me had nothing to do with this specific incident. Namely thermal layers and the evading of detection.
My experience is from way back in the early 1970's and I FULLY respect that times have changed and the age of sail has gone.
I would like to think that if Iranian ships or boats were to leave the sanctuary of coastal waters then sadly they would possibly become 'ground bait!'
If this is Tom Clancy or any other author then so be it but I am NOT saying ANYTHING will happen... I am NOT saying submarines from Iran WILL DEPLOY or WILL attack shipping. I am like most other folks just speculating
(nothing better to do)
Even with a Nuke Torpedo or Depth Charge....one has to know where to send it to in order to score a kill. Ergo...it would assume finding the Sub is the first order of business. You cannot find it...you cannot kill it.
So the Kilo's have been scooting around for years laying sea bed mines...as well as other barge type surface vessels. Even if we knew the location of every single mine....removing them would be a lengthy process.
As the Iranians would know where the mines are...and when they will be armed...they would still be able to operate large surface vessels would they not?
For the armchair experts here......I am not an expert on Mine warfare or Littoral Combat...but I do live around the corner from a Holiday Express Motel.
So the Kilo's have been scooting around for years laying sea bed mines...as well as other barge type surface vessels. Even if we knew the location of every single mine....removing them would be a lengthy process.
As the Iranians would know where the mines are...and when they will be armed...they would still be able to operate large surface vessels would they not?
For the armchair experts here......I am not an expert on Mine warfare or Littoral Combat...but I do live around the corner from a Holiday Express Motel.
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As the Iranians would know where the mines are...and when they will be armed...they would still be able to operate large surface vessels would they not?
I have always been in the corner that believes we are not about to get involved in any military conflict between the west and Iran. I have tried with all my posts to ask questions as opposed to predict, or suggest anything may, or would happen.
What has now caught my eye is that I see that Iran has gone public regarding the trial of an alleged US spy. Is it correct to suggest this man has been identified as an ex US Marine reservist with a duel nationality? He was allegedly employed by the CIA and was believed to have been tasked with trying to infiltrate the Iranian Intelligence Ministry. It looks like by going public Iran is now putting this person in front of the World’s media in an attempt to deliberately provoke the US government? (question NOT statement)
Iran has ‘dared’ the US Navy to attempt to sail the Stennis Battle Group back through the Strait, this challenge has hopefully been ignored, so is this there next attempt to incite the US to react? (question NOT statement) What are the benefits of Iran provoking the west? Why take the risks of a confrontation that could probably see the military arm of the Iran military greatly diminished?
Now we see America having an alleged spy being put in front of TV cameras and we are told this person has been sentenced to death! Will the US stay quiet? Will they go public and make an exchange? Will the US now increase the tension between Iran and the west? How will this trial influence any decisions regarding the closure of the Strait.
Is there a possibility that we might see an air denial corridor imposed on Iran?
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Thread Starter
Iran says it will close Strait of Hormuz if crude exports blocked
Tehran’s leadership has decided to order a blockade of the strategic Strait of Hormuz if the country’s oil exports are blocked, a senior Revolutionary Guard Commander said as reported by Iranian press. The strategic decision was made by Iran's top authorities, Ali Ashraf Nouri said, as cited by the Iranian Khorasan daily.
US to respond if Iran blocks Gulf
WASHINGTON: The US will respond if Iran tries to close the strategic Strait of Hormuz at the entrance to the Gulf, Defence Secretary Leon Panetta warned yesterday, saying such a move would cross a "red line".
"We made very clear that the US will not tolerate the blocking of the Straits of Hormuz," Panetta told CBS television. "That's another red line for us and that we will respond to them."
Panetta was seconded by General Martin Dempsey, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, who said Iran has the means to close the waterway, through which 20 per cent of the world's oil passes. "But we would take action and reopen the Straits," the general said on the same show, Face the Nation
Tehran’s leadership has decided to order a blockade of the strategic Strait of Hormuz if the country’s oil exports are blocked, a senior Revolutionary Guard Commander said as reported by Iranian press. The strategic decision was made by Iran's top authorities, Ali Ashraf Nouri said, as cited by the Iranian Khorasan daily.
"The supreme authorities … have insisted that if enemies block the export of our oil, we won't allow a drop of oil to pass through the Strait of Hormuz. This is the strategy of the Islamic Republic in countering such threats," Nouri said.
Until now, there had been no official confirmation of Iran’s military having direct orders to block the Strait. However, Tehran has been threatening to block the strategic waterway – one of the world's most important oil routes – if the West slapped more sanctions on its oil exports or risked hostile military act of any kind.US to respond if Iran blocks Gulf
WASHINGTON: The US will respond if Iran tries to close the strategic Strait of Hormuz at the entrance to the Gulf, Defence Secretary Leon Panetta warned yesterday, saying such a move would cross a "red line".
"We made very clear that the US will not tolerate the blocking of the Straits of Hormuz," Panetta told CBS television. "That's another red line for us and that we will respond to them."
Panetta was seconded by General Martin Dempsey, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, who said Iran has the means to close the waterway, through which 20 per cent of the world's oil passes. "But we would take action and reopen the Straits," the general said on the same show, Face the Nation
What has now caught my eye is that I see that Iran has gone public regarding the trial of an alleged US spy. Is it correct to suggest this man has been identified as an ex US Marine reservist with a duel nationality? He was allegedly employed by the CIA and was believed to have been tasked with trying to infiltrate the Iranian Intelligence Ministry. It looks like by going public Iran is now putting this person in front of the World’s media in an attempt to deliberately provoke the US government? (question NOT statement)
His arrested was 1st publicised in December and discussed on here.
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Thanks for that Racedo.
Was that report referring to the death sentence as per this latest update or did it state he had been put on trial? I had tried searching but have so far failed miserably, clearly this will be down to operator error.
I put in this man's surname and got the result
Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms..
Was that report referring to the death sentence as per this latest update or did it state he had been put on trial? I had tried searching but have so far failed miserably, clearly this will be down to operator error.
I put in this man's surname and got the result
Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms..
US Chairman of the Joint Chiefs says Iran has the capability to close the Strait for a short while but that the US Military has the ability to re-open it.
No discussion was made about how that would be done or what the ramifications of said closure would be.
It might be a good time to buy huge amounts of shares in DuPont and some of the other boom time companies.
No discussion was made about how that would be done or what the ramifications of said closure would be.
It might be a good time to buy huge amounts of shares in DuPont and some of the other boom time companies.