Airmen shot Frankfurt March 2nd

[tezzer]

click click, bang bang sorted !

Let him go and find his 78 virgins or whatever the fk he was promised !

[Whenurhappy]

So now that we've all had a good rant, we've determined:

• That the death penalty will not be applied in this case
• He will not be tried in the US
• Any sentence is unlikely to have detered him
• Stopping radicalising is probably a more effective strategy
• And we don't simply shoot 'recalcitrants' simply because they are expensive to look after

Perhaps we are missing a few practical issues here;

Force Protection - given hightened alert state in German airports, I am surprised the US were using a Forrest Gump-style school bus to pick up troops. Similarly, having worked similar issues in the past, both Lander and Bundes Politzei are more than happy to provide 'additional HNS' if requested.

On Friday I was transitting through Munich Franz Josef airport and saw a number of US servicemen in uniform. I spoke with a woman Major in a natty blue urban combat BDUs and asked her if they were returning from theatre. It transpired she was an auditor, returning to he States from a visit to some USAFE facilities. I tactfully asked whether, given the shootings, whether uniform as appropriate. She replied 'oh that was over in Frankfurt, right? We'll be safe here!'

I was stunnd both by the naiviety and the implied arrogance of her answer. The US just don't seem to 'get' domestic terrorism, yet.

WP

[GreenKnight121]

Originally Posted by ghostnav

If the Death Penalty worked,, the US would not suffer the significant number of deaths each year; It doesn't.

For ANY punishment to be effective as a deterrent, it must be swift and certain.


In the US, the death penalty is rarely carried out... even if the prisoner is so sentenced... and few of those convicted of murder are so sentenced.

Perhaps 1 in 5 of those sentenced to death are actually executed... the rest either get their sentences commuted to life in prison, die in prison from natural causes or are killed by other prisoners, or manage to get their convictions overturned.

Thus, the death penalty as currently applied is not certain.



Those who are executed normally gain 5-10 years of time via legal appeals and other maneuverings... some of those recently executed were convicted and sentenced over 20 years ago!

Thus, the death penalty as currently applied is not swift.



In addition, the rate at which convictions have been being overturned for all categories of violent crime (mainly due to DNA evidence proving that the convicted was not the killer/rapist/attacker) indicates that the death penalty should be reserved for cases where guilt is absolutely beyond doubt (such as in the Frankfurt case, where the killer is captured in the act of murder), lest an innocent person be executed.




There is 1 main goal in criminal punishment (protect society from the actions of criminals), and 3 intermediate steps to achieving it...

1. deter the criminal from repeating the crime (or other crimes).

2. deter others from committing crimes due to the example of punishment.

3. provide society with relief from fear (the criminal can not harm the victim or anyone else) and with release of anger (the b@$tard got what he deserved).


#1 is done by making the consequences of the crime unpleasant enough and certain enough that the criminal decides to not repeat it, and by insuring that the criminal does not have to repeat it (by educating an under-educated criminal and teaching employable skills to unskilled criminals).

#2 is done by making the example(s) of the consequences of the crime unpleasant enough and certain enough that other potential criminals decide to not commit those crimes.

#3 is necessary to prevent citizens from seeking their own vengeance upon the suspected criminal and to keep fear from building into violent panic (humans destroy that which they fear).



The death penalty ensures that that criminal will never again harm society (collectively or individually), and that society need neither fear what the criminal might do or fear what the victims of the criminal might do to get revenge.

It also prevents any rehabilitation of the criminal and deprives society of any contributions that criminal could have made after rehabilitation.



In the minds of those here, what do you think could be the factor(s) that make a criminal not rehabilitatable (and thus not worth spending the money to imprison, and what crimes are so extreme as to justify such an extreme punishment?

[JuergenP]

In the 1970s the US army always transited in civilian clothing...they have forgotton this...sad

[Airborne Aircrew]

GK:

Quite simple. Since all actions have consequences then if you do the crime you do the time. If the time is demed to be death, (murder, kiddie fiddling, rape being a Lions Fan), then so be it. No appeals process where the eveidence is solid. A simple bye bye, nice knowing you, good riddance works for me.

[Duncan D'Sorderlee]

And here was me thinking that this would be a condolences thread for those US Servicemen murdered in Germany.

RIP

Duncs

[con-pilot]

Actually after the fourth shot the gunman's gun jammed. The Airman that the assassin was aiming at when the gun jammed, chased after the shooter and helped the local police subdue the shooter.

Give me a minute or two and I'll try and find a link to the story.

[Dengue_Dude]

And here was me thinking that this would be a condolences thread for those US Servicemen murdered in Germany.

Well perhaps it should be, but it also shows how strongly people feel about bloody radical Moslems . . .

As for not making him a martyr - who was the second IRA hunger striker (martyr), anyone remember.

Summary execution.

Would be nice to know what the 'shot' guys would have said, seeing all the do-gooders springing out of the woodwork aiming not to 'lower ourselves to his standard'.

Do you think for a second that stance is treated with anything but contempt by this kind of perpetrator - it's decadence and weakness in their eyes?