Harrier Last Flight (Merged)
Cassandra (why are you mine?)
Your story is Bollocks. So please don't print it in your newspaper, and if you do, for a change please realise that the spelling is Tornados NOT Tornadoes!
Your story is Bollocks. So please don't print it in your newspaper, and if you do, for a change please realise that the spelling is Tornados NOT Tornadoes!
However it came about:
RAF bins Tornados, keeps Harrier, Navy maintain FW FJ capability, JSF introduced, shared between RAF and RN.
RAF bins Harrier, keeps Tornado, Navy FW FJ ability withers, JSF introduced, Navy unable to man it, RAF asset.
RAF bins Tornados, keeps Harrier, Navy maintain FW FJ capability, JSF introduced, shared between RAF and RN.
RAF bins Harrier, keeps Tornado, Navy FW FJ ability withers, JSF introduced, Navy unable to man it, RAF asset.
Originally Posted by F3sRbest
Did it go or not.....
I did hear an FJ overhead (above cloud), may have been the sniffer...?
Cassandra
Who in the MoD? CDS, Perm Sec, SofS, USofS???
Very senior person the First Sea Lord by chance?
The only person you actually name is the PM - why not put a FoI request in to his 'outer office' and ask there???
And why wait almost a week before asking the question. Surely this would have been a better scoop if it had not been on the day of the Harriers (supposed) last flight? Or did X Factor / Katie Price / some non-WAG take priority over concern for the national Defence?
Troll.
Who in the MoD? CDS, Perm Sec, SofS, USofS???
Very senior person the First Sea Lord by chance?
The only person you actually name is the PM - why not put a FoI request in to his 'outer office' and ask there???
And why wait almost a week before asking the question. Surely this would have been a better scoop if it had not been on the day of the Harriers (supposed) last flight? Or did X Factor / Katie Price / some non-WAG take priority over concern for the national Defence?
Troll.
That's an interesting one - how to prove that something that didn't happen, didn't happen. For my next trick, let me prove the non-existance of God...
OK, let me put it another way, for starters your premise is incorrect. You say:
"The MoD had advised the PM that the Tornados and not the Harriers should be decommissioned." (How do you do the cool quotey thing that puts the words in a box?)
So who is 'the MoD' here? DG Strat? Hd Strat Man (Prog)? PUS? CDS? An endorsed paper from the DSPG or DB? Hd Navy RP?
The ONLY opinion that counts is either an endorsed paper by the DB, approved by SofS, or a decision by the DMC.
Bearing in mind that ALL 3 of the current Chiefs of Staff (who sit on both the DB and the DMC) have said that they endorsed the decision to bin Harrier, I do not believe that the 'MOD advice' was to bin Tornado. Therefore, how could a group of RAF officers change the PM's mind when the formal advice he had received was to bin Harrier?
Not quite QED, but a pretty good open-source argument.
OK, let me put it another way, for starters your premise is incorrect. You say:
"The MoD had advised the PM that the Tornados and not the Harriers should be decommissioned." (How do you do the cool quotey thing that puts the words in a box?)
So who is 'the MoD' here? DG Strat? Hd Strat Man (Prog)? PUS? CDS? An endorsed paper from the DSPG or DB? Hd Navy RP?
The ONLY opinion that counts is either an endorsed paper by the DB, approved by SofS, or a decision by the DMC.
Bearing in mind that ALL 3 of the current Chiefs of Staff (who sit on both the DB and the DMC) have said that they endorsed the decision to bin Harrier, I do not believe that the 'MOD advice' was to bin Tornado. Therefore, how could a group of RAF officers change the PM's mind when the formal advice he had received was to bin Harrier?
Not quite QED, but a pretty good open-source argument.
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Mythology
YC
I recall that Apollo granted Cass' the gift of prophecy (or profecy in your case)
but added a caveat that no one would believe her after an affray normally reserved for the lager louts of Exeter on a Saturday night.
I agree with you though - the Tornado should be going to the knackers yard not the Harrier.
EM
I recall that Apollo granted Cass' the gift of prophecy (or profecy in your case)
but added a caveat that no one would believe her after an affray normally reserved for the lager louts of Exeter on a Saturday night.
I agree with you though - the Tornado should be going to the knackers yard not the Harrier.
EM
I agree with you though - the Tornado should be going to the knackers yard not the Harrier.
It's a travesty that Harrier is gone though.
D120A. Thanks. See following links for more photographic coverage from both RAF Cottesmore and Wittering.
Cottesmore 13th December, what a day!
Harrier Drawdown - week by week
From the following where there is further photo coverage.
Modern Military Photography • UK Airshow Review Message Board
For those that missed the flypast. This would have been from yesterday over RAF Wyton.
To all those involved with the Harrier. Thank You!
TJ
Cottesmore 13th December, what a day!
Harrier Drawdown - week by week
From the following where there is further photo coverage.
Modern Military Photography • UK Airshow Review Message Board
For those that missed the flypast. This would have been from yesterday over RAF Wyton.
To all those involved with the Harrier. Thank You!
TJ
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I think this coalition should be decommisioned & scrapped, 4.5 years early.
Disgusting what they are doing - AND getting away with. " brand new" carriers soon - no bloody aircraft - what would Churchill have thought?.
I remember a Horizon programme, many, many years ago about the Harrier & Mr Farley. I still have it on video - betamax !! (Sony betamax player still works too) Fantastic aircraft, even today.
Nothing left soon, only mega debt for all of us slaves, and (a very few) hyper-rich elite bankers.
Lid
Disgusting what they are doing - AND getting away with. " brand new" carriers soon - no bloody aircraft - what would Churchill have thought?.
I remember a Horizon programme, many, many years ago about the Harrier & Mr Farley. I still have it on video - betamax !! (Sony betamax player still works too) Fantastic aircraft, even today.
Nothing left soon, only mega debt for all of us slaves, and (a very few) hyper-rich elite bankers.
Lid
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"Finger on the pulse" ITV news at lunchtime stated that RAF Cottesmore was in Lincolnshire and the flypast was to take place in that county alone.
Ministry of Defence | Defence News | Equipment and Logistics | Harrier bids a final farewell
You'd think the MOD would get their facts right...
But then again, they were the ones who decided to retire such a fine aircraft, so I guess its a blessing they didnt stick up a photo of 16 tornados flying in formation!
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This is today's MOD at its best.
Harrier bids a final farewell
An Equipment and Logistics news article
15 Dec 10
Tributes were paid to the joint force of Royal Navy and RAF Harrier aircraft today as a spectacular flypast across eastern England marked the aircraft's retirement after 41 years of service.
A pilot prepares for the final flight of the GR9 Harriers from 1(F) Squadron, 800 Naval Air Squadron and IV(R) Squadron at RAF Cottesmore
[Picture: Senior Aircraftman Mark Dixon, Crown Copyright/MOD 2010]
A formation of 16 Harriers took to the skies over Lincolnshire, flying over seven RAF bases, Lincoln Cathedral and the towns of Stamford and Oakham.
Brought into service in 1969 and based at RAF Wittering, this British aircraft was designed to take off and land both vertically and on a short runway.
Well known for its role in the Falklands War, the Harrier went on to serve in many other conflicts including in Bosnia and Iraq in the 1990s.
The RAF and Royal Navy Harrier squadrons joined forces in 2000 to form Joint Force Harrier, based at RAF Cottesmore. These combined Harrier squadrons went on to serve in Sierra Leone, the second Gulf War and most recently Afghanistan.
Air Officer Commanding No 1 Group, Air Vice-Marshal Greg Bagwell, said:
Officer Commanding 800 Naval Air Squadron, Commander Dave Lindsay, said:
[Picture: LA (Phot) Luis Holden, Crown Copyright/MOD 2010]
Last year the aircraft celebrated its 40th anniversary
as the Harrier squadrons flew home after five years in Afghanistan.
Joint Force Harrier Commander, Group Captain Gary Waterfall, said:
An Equipment and Logistics news article
15 Dec 10
Tributes were paid to the joint force of Royal Navy and RAF Harrier aircraft today as a spectacular flypast across eastern England marked the aircraft's retirement after 41 years of service.
A pilot prepares for the final flight of the GR9 Harriers from 1(F) Squadron, 800 Naval Air Squadron and IV(R) Squadron at RAF Cottesmore
[Picture: Senior Aircraftman Mark Dixon, Crown Copyright/MOD 2010]
A formation of 16 Harriers took to the skies over Lincolnshire, flying over seven RAF bases, Lincoln Cathedral and the towns of Stamford and Oakham.
Brought into service in 1969 and based at RAF Wittering, this British aircraft was designed to take off and land both vertically and on a short runway.
Well known for its role in the Falklands War, the Harrier went on to serve in many other conflicts including in Bosnia and Iraq in the 1990s.
The RAF and Royal Navy Harrier squadrons joined forces in 2000 to form Joint Force Harrier, based at RAF Cottesmore. These combined Harrier squadrons went on to serve in Sierra Leone, the second Gulf War and most recently Afghanistan.
Air Officer Commanding No 1 Group, Air Vice-Marshal Greg Bagwell, said:
"The Harrier is a true icon and stands testament to the innovation and excellence of British design and engineering, and the skill and courage of our airmen.
"It has had a truly distinguished service with both the RAF and the Royal Navy, from the South Atlantic to the skies over Afghanistan. It now takes its place in history as one of aviation's greats."
16 Harriers in formation on the last day of flying on 15 Decemeber 2010
[Picture: Cpl Al Crowe, Crown Copyright/MOD 2010]
Officer Commanding 800 Naval Air Squadron, Commander Dave Lindsay, said:
"The Harrier leaves UK service after an illustrious career that has seen it contribute to every major conflict in the last 30 years. It has been an enormous personal privilege and honour to have been involved with this wonderful aircraft for nearly 20 years, at sea and over land, at peace and in conflict."
A Harrier GR9 lands onboard HMS Ark Royal (stock image) [Picture: LA (Phot) Luis Holden, Crown Copyright/MOD 2010]
"I will forever be immensely proud to be able to say I have been a
Royal Navy Harrier Squadron Commander."
as the Harrier squadrons flew home after five years in Afghanistan.
Joint Force Harrier Commander, Group Captain Gary Waterfall, said:
"As the last Harrier Force Commander, it has been a real honour to ensure that the Harrier has been retired from service with all of the respect and dignity deserved.
"Today has been a tribute to everybody involved with the Harrier family."